Men afraid of commitment?

Off Topic
801

[quote]csulli wrote:

[quote]WhiteSturgeon wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:
Women do not want nice men. The term ‘Nice guys finish last’ is not just a saying. I am living proof.[/quote]

Awe, that isn’t true! :frowning: I happen to be married to a really, really, really nice guy! Perhaps, you are just interested in girls that don’t appreciate nice guys. [/quote]
Are you sure? Can you be certain of this from your frame of reference? I wonder about such things.[/quote]

Yeah sturg, what is your frame of reference? Usually really, really, really nice guy = double bagger. But I honestly can’t see you being with a double bagger.

802

[quote]The Other Titan wrote:

[quote]Varqanir wrote:

[quote]WhiteSturgeon wrote:

[quote]The Other Titan wrote:

[quote]Varqanir wrote:

[quote]The Other Titan wrote:

[quote]Waittz wrote:

Second thing: harrypotter is a creepy trolling weirdo and should never be taken seriously. [/quote]

I’m just wondering where I stand on the creepy, trolling weirdo list. [/quote]

You haven’t been around long enough to earn your creepy trolling weirdo wings yet. Right now you’re just kind of a nuisance, and to be honest we don’t take much notice of you at all.
[/quote]

Oh, I’m just getting warmed up Vanqueer. Besides I’m feeling confident that I rank #1 or at least #2 on a certain someone’s creepy, trolling weirdo list.

Hey Em, can you save me a spot on your creepy, trolling, weirdo list? [/quote]

You have your moments but I think you’re more ridiculous than anything else. Just so you know, if and when you make my “creepster list”, I will no longer be communicating with you. [/quote]

Oh how sad. You have presented him with an existential dilemma. On the one hand, if he doesn’t continue with his semi-relevant creepiness, he will have nothing to say to you. On the other hand, if he escalates his creepiness so as to gain more of your attention, he will lose your attention altogether.

What to do, what to do.

Hey I’ve got an idea. Perhaps The Other Tit can stop being an annoying creep, and start engaging in relevant, thoughtful discussion.

But no, now that I’ve mentioned it, he’s just going to do the opposite.[/quote]

It is truly a dilemma. I must not get myself banished from Sturgeonland.

start engaging in relevant, thoughtful discussion??? WTF we spent a 1/2 page talking about the way we squeeze toothpaste so don’t even pretend that there is “thoughtful” discussion going on in this thread. [/quote]

Just because you haven’t been contributing to it doesn’t mean that it doesn’t exist.

803

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:
One of the flaws in the concept of “men built this world” is that when you build something you get paid for your labor and move on to the next one. It’s not like you have ownership rights and get royalties for the time it is in service. Then the next generation gets it and does the same.

We have such a great view because we stand on the shoulders of giants. That doesn’t mean we can lay claim to their work too. And some of those giants have been and will continue to be women.

[/quote]

It is not about ownership rights, it is about women not “needing” men.

Sure, if her car breaks down she will call a man to tow it away, she will call man to repair it, she lives in a society with some sense of order because big, burly men with lots of guns make sure it stays that way.

There is an article where a single mother bragged how strong and independent she was because she visited a community college while getting foodstamps and subsidies for housing and whatnot which in their majority where financed by men.

Some women are simply dilusional when it comes to how much they need men, cut the welfare state and we would have a divorce rate resembling that of the year 1900.

[/quote]

Putting it that way, do you also see that men “need” women, either in a modern or historical context?

804

[quote]WhiteSturgeon wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:

[quote]harrypotter wrote:

And then we have the shaming articles asking why guys prefer porn, PUA and games when it comes down to commitment. So women dont need men? Sounds like somebody got blasted in the face by one too many athletes during her prime.[/quote]

You’re icky. Probably the ickiest poster on TNation, and that’s saying a lot.

That’s why women don’t like you, not because of the feminist movement.[/quote]

Ah, the creep move in combination with “I bet you never get laid”…

Did I mention that we have a list?

Seriously, we do. [/quote]

Feminazis have a list, too, but, being a reasonable human being, I dispute that the qualities they shriek about in men are true of more than a few of them. I would suggest that the feminazis should be nicer if they want nicer men.[/quote]

Women do not want nice men. The term ‘Nice guys finish last’ is not just a saying. I am living proof.[/quote]

Awe, that isn’t true! :frowning: I happen to be married to a really, really, really nice guy! Perhaps, you are just interested in girls that don’t appreciate nice guys. [/quote]

I have actually never met a woman who likes nice guys. The scenario breaks down like this. Woman sits around kitchen drinking wine with other women, bitching about men, bitching about how mean and selfish they are, etc. Next thing you know said woman is on cloud 9 having met the love of her life who happens to be the most narcissistic pig on the face of the Earth. the meaner the cocksucker is, the more attached said woman becomes.
Then finally the break-up. Woopie! She’s free from that asshole. Swears she’ll never do it again. Finally she meets a nice guy. Treats her well, brings her flowers, etc.
Now if she is a good enlightened woman, she must constantly remind herself that while, not much of a challenge and kind of boring, this is a good man and she better damn well stick with him. If she is average, he is boring and not a challenge and will probably cheat and then move on. The guy could be good looking, have a good job, and do fun and interesting things with her, but the relationship is not a challenge. While it appeals to the nesting nature of a woman, it does not appeal to her sexual nature.

Now this isn’t a comment on you, this is a scenario I have scene played out, over and over and over again. It’s actually backed by some science, though I am loathed to go look for it right now.
The nesting behaviour of the female prefers and needs to nice guy. The sexual nature of the woman pretty much likes to be dominated and fucked hard like a proper woman.
In America we value sex waaaaaaaaay over nesting family behaviour. Since we value the sexual relationship as a society, to a vast degree over the family oriented, ‘Good guy’ behaviour, the nice guy often loses and continues to.

No it’s not all women. Yes, there are lots of different people and lots of different relationships, but this sex > nurture situation plays out a lot in this country. It just does.

805

[quote]The Other Titan wrote:

start engaging in relevant, thoughtful discussion??? WTF we spent a 1/2 page talking about the way we squeeze toothpaste so don’t even pretend that there is “thoughtful” discussion going on in this thread. [/quote]

It’s not about the subject. It’s the subtext of the communication.

806

[quote]LoRez wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:
One of the flaws in the concept of “men built this world” is that when you build something you get paid for your labor and move on to the next one. It’s not like you have ownership rights and get royalties for the time it is in service. Then the next generation gets it and does the same.

We have such a great view because we stand on the shoulders of giants. That doesn’t mean we can lay claim to their work too. And some of those giants have been and will continue to be women.

[/quote]

It is not about ownership rights, it is about women not “needing” men.

Sure, if her car breaks down she will call a man to tow it away, she will call man to repair it, she lives in a society with some sense of order because big, burly men with lots of guns make sure it stays that way.

There is an article where a single mother bragged how strong and independent she was because she visited a community college while getting foodstamps and subsidies for housing and whatnot which in their majority where financed by men.

Some women are simply dilusional when it comes to how much they need men, cut the welfare state and we would have a divorce rate resembling that of the year 1900.

[/quote]

Putting it that way, do you also see that men “need” women, either in a modern or historical context?[/quote]

Because someone has to give birth to men I guess.

A necessary evil.

807

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]LoRez wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:
It is not about ownership rights, it is about women not “needing” men.

Sure, if her car breaks down she will call a man to tow it away, she will call man to repair it, she lives in a society with some sense of order because big, burly men with lots of guns make sure it stays that way.

There is an article where a single mother bragged how strong and independent she was because she visited a community college while getting foodstamps and subsidies for housing and whatnot which in their majority where financed by men.

Some women are simply dilusional when it comes to how much they need men, cut the welfare state and we would have a divorce rate resembling that of the year 1900.

[/quote]

Putting it that way, do you also see that men “need” women, either in a modern or historical context?[/quote]

Because someone has to give birth to men I guess.

A necessary evil.[/quote]

Well, besides childbirth.

808

[quote]LoRez wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]LoRez wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:
It is not about ownership rights, it is about women not “needing” men.

Sure, if her car breaks down she will call a man to tow it away, she will call man to repair it, she lives in a society with some sense of order because big, burly men with lots of guns make sure it stays that way.

There is an article where a single mother bragged how strong and independent she was because she visited a community college while getting foodstamps and subsidies for housing and whatnot which in their majority where financed by men.

Some women are simply dilusional when it comes to how much they need men, cut the welfare state and we would have a divorce rate resembling that of the year 1900.

[/quote]

Putting it that way, do you also see that men “need” women, either in a modern or historical context?[/quote]

Because someone has to give birth to men I guess.

A necessary evil.[/quote]

Well, besides childbirth.[/quote]

But it really comes down to childbirth, no childbirth no need for sexual desire or emotional bonding etc…

Sure, there were great female thinkers but the sheer fact that every reading “great female scientists” immediately thinks “Madame Curie” should tell you something.

809

[quote]pat wrote:

I have actually never met a woman who likes nice guys. The scenario breaks down like this. Woman sits around kitchen drinking wine with other women, bitching about men, bitching about how mean and selfish they are, etc. Next thing you know said woman is on cloud 9 having met the love of her life who happens to be the most narcissistic pig on the face of the Earth. the meaner the cocksucker is, the more attached said woman becomes.
Then finally the break-up. Woopie! She’s free from that asshole. Swears she’ll never do it again. Finally she meets a nice guy. Treats her well, brings her flowers, etc.
Now if she is a good enlightened woman, she must constantly remind herself that while, not much of a challenge and kind of boring, this is a good man and she better damn well stick with him. If she is average, he is boring and not a challenge and will probably cheat and then move on. The guy could be good looking, have a good job, and do fun and interesting things with her, but the relationship is not a challenge. While it appeals to the nesting nature of a woman, it does not appeal to her sexual nature.
[/quote]

But she really wants a nice, loyal caring guy.

She is not lying you know, I guestimate that “the spark is just there or it is not”, “energies flow”, “its just happens”…

810

[quote]batman730 wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:

Exactly. I can perfectly well support myself, but I still want someone to whisper with at night. [/quote]

No, you really cant, which was his point.

The entire highly artificial and quite fragile social and literal infrastructure that allows you do not “need men” was built, is maintained and financed by men.

Joe Beta gets up every morning and puts his shoulder to the wheel so that women “no longer need men” and raise their expectations who is sexworthy and who is not to infinity and beyond.
[/quote]

Well, speaking as Joe Beta, it looks to me like my wife (and any number of other professional women I know) puts her shoulder to pretty much the same wheel as I do every morning.

She is an educated professional who provides value in the marketplace and is thus compensated for her efforts in accordance to her merit. She is economically self supporting. I fail to see how my penis or anybody else’ is subsidizing this.

As I have said, I’d be grateful if my daughter has the same opportunity when the time comes. The infrastructure that allows this was undoubtedly built and defended primarily by men. However most of those men were breaking trail long before I showed up to reap the benefits of that same infrastructure without having really contributed anything to it that is specifically dependent upon my being a man (well I labour in a field that isn’t very female friendly, but that’s beside the point). I personally know a number of women who have done significantly more to further that infrastructure than I am likely to do in my lifetime, particularly in the area of scientific research.

If that infrastructure collapsed tomorrow and civilization went to shit, I agree that “gender equality” would be a very early casualty. So would a number of other concepts that I think most of us find to be fairly agreeable, regardless of gender. I don’t expect most dudes would fare too well either. Our society IS fragile and highly artificial. It also beats the hell out of the alternatives. One doesn’t need to look too far afield to see that.

Also, I think there is an important distinction to be made between “a woman doesn’t need a man” in the individual, relationship sense and “women don’t need men” as a wholesale sociological statement. For either gender to posit that they don’t need the other in the general sense is more than a little absurd. I would think this was obvious.

Mountains and molehills really.

Edited[/quote]

Fantastic post!

811

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]WhiteSturgeon wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:

[quote]harrypotter wrote:

And then we have the shaming articles asking why guys prefer porn, PUA and games when it comes down to commitment. So women dont need men? Sounds like somebody got blasted in the face by one too many athletes during her prime.[/quote]

You’re icky. Probably the ickiest poster on TNation, and that’s saying a lot.

That’s why women don’t like you, not because of the feminist movement.[/quote]

Ah, the creep move in combination with “I bet you never get laid”…

Did I mention that we have a list?

Seriously, we do. [/quote]

Feminazis have a list, too, but, being a reasonable human being, I dispute that the qualities they shriek about in men are true of more than a few of them. I would suggest that the feminazis should be nicer if they want nicer men.[/quote]

Women do not want nice men. The term ‘Nice guys finish last’ is not just a saying. I am living proof.[/quote]

Awe, that isn’t true! :frowning: I happen to be married to a really, really, really nice guy! Perhaps, you are just interested in girls that don’t appreciate nice guys. [/quote]

I have actually never met a woman who likes nice guys. The scenario breaks down like this. Woman sits around kitchen drinking wine with other women, bitching about men, bitching about how mean and selfish they are, etc. Next thing you know said woman is on cloud 9 having met the love of her life who happens to be the most narcissistic pig on the face of the Earth. the meaner the cocksucker is, the more attached said woman becomes.
Then finally the break-up. Woopie! She’s free from that asshole. Swears she’ll never do it again. Finally she meets a nice guy. Treats her well, brings her flowers, etc.
Now if she is a good enlightened woman, she must constantly remind herself that while, not much of a challenge and kind of boring, this is a good man and she better damn well stick with him. If she is average, he is boring and not a challenge and will probably cheat and then move on. The guy could be good looking, have a good job, and do fun and interesting things with her, but the relationship is not a challenge. While it appeals to the nesting nature of a woman, it does not appeal to her sexual nature.

Now this isn’t a comment on you, this is a scenario I have scene played out, over and over and over again. It’s actually backed by some science, though I am loathed to go look for it right now.
The nesting behaviour of the female prefers and needs to nice guy. The sexual nature of the woman pretty much likes to be dominated and fucked hard like a proper woman.
In America we value sex waaaaaaaaay over nesting family behaviour. Since we value the sexual relationship as a society, to a vast degree over the family oriented, ‘Good guy’ behaviour, the nice guy often loses and continues to.

No it’s not all women. Yes, there are lots of different people and lots of different relationships, but this sex > nurture situation plays out a lot in this country. It just does.[/quote]

Are you saying that you don’t think a man can possess both sex appeal and nurture appeal?

812

[quote]The Other Titan wrote:

[quote]csulli wrote:

[quote]WhiteSturgeon wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:
Women do not want nice men. The term ‘Nice guys finish last’ is not just a saying. I am living proof.[/quote]

Awe, that isn’t true! :frowning: I happen to be married to a really, really, really nice guy! Perhaps, you are just interested in girls that don’t appreciate nice guys. [/quote]
Are you sure? Can you be certain of this from your frame of reference? I wonder about such things.[/quote]

Yeah sturg, what is your frame of reference? Usually really, really, really nice guy = double bagger. But I honestly can’t see you being with a double bagger. [/quote]

What’s a “double bagger”?

813

[quote]csulli wrote:

[quote]WhiteSturgeon wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:
Women do not want nice men. The term ‘Nice guys finish last’ is not just a saying. I am living proof.[/quote]

Awe, that isn’t true! :frowning: I happen to be married to a really, really, really nice guy! Perhaps, you are just interested in girls that don’t appreciate nice guys. [/quote]
Are you sure? Can you be certain of this from your frame of reference? I wonder about such things.[/quote]

Well, actually I’m not sure if I’m sure. It’s all very complicated. - lol

I can obviously only speak for myself. When I was in my teens and during college I was emotionally immature. My mentality was screw personality and “niceness” I just want to be with a really hot guy. Some of those guys were pretty descent, while others not so much.

My mentality evolved over time… putting less emphasis on the superficial aspects and more on companionship. That being said, no matter how nice a guy was if there was absolutely no physical attraction, I would have friend zoned him. If he was incredibly nice and I found him at least semi-attractive I would have been willing to give it a shot.

814

Alpha fux and Beta bux, this is how we roll…

From GBFMs great battle anthem for modern women…

815

[quote]WhiteSturgeon wrote:

[quote]The Other Titan wrote:

[quote]csulli wrote:

[quote]WhiteSturgeon wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:
Women do not want nice men. The term ‘Nice guys finish last’ is not just a saying. I am living proof.[/quote]

Awe, that isn’t true! :frowning: I happen to be married to a really, really, really nice guy! Perhaps, you are just interested in girls that don’t appreciate nice guys. [/quote]
Are you sure? Can you be certain of this from your frame of reference? I wonder about such things.[/quote]

Yeah sturg, what is your frame of reference? Usually really, really, really nice guy = double bagger. But I honestly can’t see you being with a double bagger. [/quote]

What’s a “double bagger”? [/quote]

A guy so ugly you need to put a paper bag over his head just so you can sleep with him…then another bag over that in case the first bag rips.

816

[quote]Varqanir wrote:

[quote]WhiteSturgeon wrote:

[quote]The Other Titan wrote:

[quote]csulli wrote:

[quote]WhiteSturgeon wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:
Women do not want nice men. The term ‘Nice guys finish last’ is not just a saying. I am living proof.[/quote]

Awe, that isn’t true! :frowning: I happen to be married to a really, really, really nice guy! Perhaps, you are just interested in girls that don’t appreciate nice guys. [/quote]
Are you sure? Can you be certain of this from your frame of reference? I wonder about such things.[/quote]

Yeah sturg, what is your frame of reference? Usually really, really, really nice guy = double bagger. But I honestly can’t see you being with a double bagger. [/quote]

What’s a “double bagger”? [/quote]

A guy so ugly you need to put a paper bag over his head just so you can sleep with him…then another bag over that in case the first bag rips.
[/quote]

Thanks man. You just got me my first strike.

Sturg, I said that I did not think your husband was a double bagger!!! I was just saying that in general nice guys tend to be double baggers. That’s all.

817

[quote]WhiteSturgeon wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]WhiteSturgeon wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:

[quote]harrypotter wrote:

And then we have the shaming articles asking why guys prefer porn, PUA and games when it comes down to commitment. So women dont need men? Sounds like somebody got blasted in the face by one too many athletes during her prime.[/quote]

You’re icky. Probably the ickiest poster on TNation, and that’s saying a lot.

That’s why women don’t like you, not because of the feminist movement.[/quote]

Ah, the creep move in combination with “I bet you never get laid”…

Did I mention that we have a list?

Seriously, we do. [/quote]

Feminazis have a list, too, but, being a reasonable human being, I dispute that the qualities they shriek about in men are true of more than a few of them. I would suggest that the feminazis should be nicer if they want nicer men.[/quote]

Women do not want nice men. The term ‘Nice guys finish last’ is not just a saying. I am living proof.[/quote]

Awe, that isn’t true! :frowning: I happen to be married to a really, really, really nice guy! Perhaps, you are just interested in girls that don’t appreciate nice guys. [/quote]

I have actually never met a woman who likes nice guys. The scenario breaks down like this. Woman sits around kitchen drinking wine with other women, bitching about men, bitching about how mean and selfish they are, etc. Next thing you know said woman is on cloud 9 having met the love of her life who happens to be the most narcissistic pig on the face of the Earth. the meaner the cocksucker is, the more attached said woman becomes.
Then finally the break-up. Woopie! She’s free from that asshole. Swears she’ll never do it again. Finally she meets a nice guy. Treats her well, brings her flowers, etc.
Now if she is a good enlightened woman, she must constantly remind herself that while, not much of a challenge and kind of boring, this is a good man and she better damn well stick with him. If she is average, he is boring and not a challenge and will probably cheat and then move on. The guy could be good looking, have a good job, and do fun and interesting things with her, but the relationship is not a challenge. While it appeals to the nesting nature of a woman, it does not appeal to her sexual nature.

Now this isn’t a comment on you, this is a scenario I have scene played out, over and over and over again. It’s actually backed by some science, though I am loathed to go look for it right now.
The nesting behaviour of the female prefers and needs to nice guy. The sexual nature of the woman pretty much likes to be dominated and fucked hard like a proper woman.
In America we value sex waaaaaaaaay over nesting family behaviour. Since we value the sexual relationship as a society, to a vast degree over the family oriented, ‘Good guy’ behaviour, the nice guy often loses and continues to.

No it’s not all women. Yes, there are lots of different people and lots of different relationships, but this sex > nurture situation plays out a lot in this country. It just does.[/quote]

Are you saying that you don’t think a man can possess both sex appeal and nurture appeal? [/quote]

I possess both. :wink:

818

[quote]The Other Titan wrote:

[quote]WhiteSturgeon wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]WhiteSturgeon wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:

[quote]harrypotter wrote:

And then we have the shaming articles asking why guys prefer porn, PUA and games when it comes down to commitment. So women dont need men? Sounds like somebody got blasted in the face by one too many athletes during her prime.[/quote]

You’re icky. Probably the ickiest poster on TNation, and that’s saying a lot.

That’s why women don’t like you, not because of the feminist movement.[/quote]

Ah, the creep move in combination with “I bet you never get laid”…

Did I mention that we have a list?

Seriously, we do. [/quote]

Feminazis have a list, too, but, being a reasonable human being, I dispute that the qualities they shriek about in men are true of more than a few of them. I would suggest that the feminazis should be nicer if they want nicer men.[/quote]

Women do not want nice men. The term ‘Nice guys finish last’ is not just a saying. I am living proof.[/quote]

Awe, that isn’t true! :frowning: I happen to be married to a really, really, really nice guy! Perhaps, you are just interested in girls that don’t appreciate nice guys. [/quote]

I have actually never met a woman who likes nice guys. The scenario breaks down like this. Woman sits around kitchen drinking wine with other women, bitching about men, bitching about how mean and selfish they are, etc. Next thing you know said woman is on cloud 9 having met the love of her life who happens to be the most narcissistic pig on the face of the Earth. the meaner the cocksucker is, the more attached said woman becomes.
Then finally the break-up. Woopie! She’s free from that asshole. Swears she’ll never do it again. Finally she meets a nice guy. Treats her well, brings her flowers, etc.
Now if she is a good enlightened woman, she must constantly remind herself that while, not much of a challenge and kind of boring, this is a good man and she better damn well stick with him. If she is average, he is boring and not a challenge and will probably cheat and then move on. The guy could be good looking, have a good job, and do fun and interesting things with her, but the relationship is not a challenge. While it appeals to the nesting nature of a woman, it does not appeal to her sexual nature.

Now this isn’t a comment on you, this is a scenario I have scene played out, over and over and over again. It’s actually backed by some science, though I am loathed to go look for it right now.
The nesting behaviour of the female prefers and needs to nice guy. The sexual nature of the woman pretty much likes to be dominated and fucked hard like a proper woman.
In America we value sex waaaaaaaaay over nesting family behaviour. Since we value the sexual relationship as a society, to a vast degree over the family oriented, ‘Good guy’ behaviour, the nice guy often loses and continues to.

No it’s not all women. Yes, there are lots of different people and lots of different relationships, but this sex > nurture situation plays out a lot in this country. It just does.[/quote]

Are you saying that you don’t think a man can possess both sex appeal and nurture appeal? [/quote]

I possess both. :wink: [/quote]
LOL

819

[quote]The Other Titan wrote:

Thanks man. You just got me my first strike.

Sturg, I said that I did not think your husband was a double bagger!!! I was just saying that in general nice guys tend to be double baggers. That’s all. [/quote]

I was no double bagger.

I was just told that the world opeerated in a certain way and it turned out it did not!

O_O!!!

Which should have helped the other times that happened…

Be nice, be yourself, nice girls want committment before putting out…

If I had a time machine I would punch a few people in the throat.

And kick them in the kidneys.

And shit in their skillet.

Twice.

820

And invest in Apple, obviously.