I think Mendez takes this pretty soundly. 5 round beat down.
The idea they would get Aldo, a striker, to pretend to be injured so Mendez, Conor’s worst matchup, a strong, excellent wrestler with knockout power who is one of the only people in the division who matches Conor’s size, can face him as an easier opponent is ridiculous.
Conor has never faced an elite wrestler, when he lost early in his career he lost against people with superior wrestling. The last thing the UFC and Conor wanted was him to have to face a wrestler, on short notice no less. Hence why Conor’s camp contacted Nate Diaz trying to set up a catchweight without the UFC’s knowledge.
Mendez is his worst nightmare. That is why he has gotten to Conor like no one else has.
[quote]Fistiecuffs wrote:
Same shit has been going on pretty much since combat sports became a business, I’d argue its much less of a problem with UFC today than it has been in the past, both boxing and MMA (e.g. Pride). Of course they want McGregor to win, but if the best they can do to ensure that is for Aldo to fake injury and give the fight to Mendes instead of Edgar then I wouldn’t really applaud their effort.[/quote]
I agree it has been prevalent in other combat sports through the years. But I respectfully disagree with you in that it is less of a problem in the UFC in recent years. In fact, the controlling aspect of the UFC is rearing its ugly head more now than ever. They are after every cent that they can grab right or wrong. And that’s a far cry from making a legitimate profit. In fact, if I walked by Dana White I would point to the ground and say “Dana there’s a quarter” and no doubt he would face leap on the floor trying to scoop it up. He’s a very greedy man with seemingly no feeling or care for the actual fighters. All one has to do is read about fighters who are no longer under Dana White’s power to control. I have spoken to a few of them personally. Read what they have to say about him and the UFC in general. It isn’t pretty.
From the latest grab to making the fighters wear Nike uniforms and taking all of the sponsorship money from Nike, and only paying their top few fighters a legitimate purse. To “arranging” fights so that the guy they want to win actually wins. While one cannot say that the fights are fixed, I don’t believe they are. One can assume that when a fight is held in a certain fighters country and that particular fighter is given better accommodations. The opponent of their favorite fighter is only given a couple of weeks notice. And their favorite fighter might be fighting someone that is obviously less talented…well the hand writing is on the wall isn’t it? I am not necessarily attributing all of these things to the McGregor/Mendes fight. But as you can see some are in play.
Yes, one of the best fighters in the division. But, one who also lost to Aldo, McGregor’s original opponent, not once but twice! sure they’re both top 10 fighters but why not put the next best fighter in place of Aldo? That would obviously not be Mendes but Edgar based on records and especially whom each fighter has fought and how each fight was won or lost. Again, do they really want McGregor to lose this fight–NO WAY.
I agree but these things have a way of leaking out as I am sure you are aware. The only secrets that are ever really kept are the ones that only one person knows. Also, I am not claiming that Mendes has a knee injury, or any other injury. But, it might just be that Dana and company know more than they you think about his current condition. Then again he might be in great shape but will not give McGregor as good a fight as Edgar. Why was Edgar passed over? That is a good question isn’t it?
That may be enough. But it begs the question why so accommodating to McGregor? And as a side note why do fighters take steroids? To simply get an edge over their opponents right? How much of an edge? It doesn’t matter in a close fight 1% turns it in their favor. The UFC will do all they can, as in giving a certain fighter an edge, to make sure that their boy wins.
One only has to look at how they have manipulated the grapplers out of the sport in order to make it more exciting for those who do not understand grappling and want to see a stand-up slugfest. Oh don’t worry the UFC is absolutely attempting to manipulate every single aspect of that sport!
I never said that they would, it’s far too dangerous in this day and age to get that involved in “fixing” a fight. I am only alleging that they sort of “tip” things in the direction that they want them to go. They then step back and let nature take its course and 9 out 10 times they get the result that they want.
When they lose that one however it is painfully obvious on their faces. Just take a look at Dana Whites face after Werdum beat Cain Velasquez into a bloody pulp. He was sick over it. All he could see were all of those Mexican dollars flying out the window. Don’t fool yourself the UFC makes matches with the hopes of one of the fighters defeating the other just about every time. Granted sometimes they make matches where they win either way. How much help they give to their favorites is usually (not always) obvious.
You could be spot on with that. And in fact the UFC doctors said the rib was not broken while two independent doctors said it was broken (more corruption on the part of the UFC doctors). So, the UFC wanted the spectacular fight to go on after spending x number of dollars promoting it. I think the monkey business began after that in this particular case. Of course one could make an argument that McGregor should not even be in a championship fight. But I can see that point from both angles.
Actually, Dana White owns 10% of the UFC and is prominent in all decisions. You are correct he likes to swear at everyone and belittle people. That speaks to his real insecure personality. He is a crude, obnoxious, greedy small man who would negotiate the gold out of your grandmothers teeth if he thought it would further his career.
So, here’s hoping Mendes pulls off the win. Not because I love Mendes or dislike McGregor. But, I do dislike Dana White’s tactics and a Mendes win would really throw a monkey wrench in the old manipulating UFC machine.
ZEB: I don’t disagree with the idea that UFC tends to try to tip the scales in the favor of the guy who brings in more revenue, they absolutely do. I just don’t believe that they do it to the extent that will significantly alter the outcome of the fight. In this case, from a marketing point of view, I think there is a clear case for why Mendes should get the fight over Frankie. 1. He finishes fights, 2. he is still fresh in peoples minds after the Aldo fight, 3. he is willing to oblige in the trash talk and there has been a decent amount of bad blood and buildup to get the casual fan excited. Edgar is one of my absolute favorite MMA fighters of all time, but for whatever reason he simply isn’t that much of a draw. I just think it is a bit of a stretch, based on what we have seen so far, to say that Edgar is leaps and bounds ahead of Mendes in terms of skill and talent. The difference really, IMO, isn’t that big, and there is a good reason why the rankings up to that point were kind of indecisive which guy is the number two in the division.
Regardless, the UFC got what they want, and McGregor proved he can hang with wrestlers. All I can say is the kids got an incredible chin, eating overhands and elbows from Mendes and hardly flinching. Guess the next big challenge is how he can deal with a striker faster than himself in Aldo.
[quote]Fistiecuffs wrote:
ZEB: I don’t disagree with the idea that UFC tends to try to tip the scales in the favor of the guy who brings in more revenue, they absolutely do. I just don’t believe that they do it to the extent that will significantly alter the outcome of the fight. In this case, from a marketing point of view, I think there is a clear case for why Mendes should get the fight over Frankie. 1. He finishes fights, 2. he is still fresh in peoples minds after the Aldo fight, 3. he is willing to oblige in the trash talk and there has been a decent amount of bad blood and buildup to get the casual fan excited. Edgar is one of my absolute favorite MMA fighters of all time, but for whatever reason he simply isn’t that much of a draw. I just think it is a bit of a stretch, based on what we have seen so far, to say that Edgar is leaps and bounds ahead of Mendes in terms of skill and talent. The difference really, IMO, isn’t that big, and there is a good reason why the rankings up to that point were kind of indecisive which guy is the number two in the division.
Regardless, the UFC got what they want, and McGregor proved he can hang with wrestlers. All I can say is the kids got an incredible chin, eating overhands and elbows from Mendes and hardly flinching. Guess the next big challenge is how he can deal with a striker faster than himself in Aldo.[/quote]
Who were you rooting for? I was rooting for McGregor until the actual fight then I started wanting mendez to win.
The UFC got what they wanted and moreover the mystery has been solved as to why Mendes was chosen over Edgar.
Edgar stays in shape almost year round. Whereas Mendes does not and started to actually tire in the first round. Take a look at the fight again. Mendes was no where near his best. Yet, he took McGregor down at will. He didn’t lose because McGregor was a better fighter. He lost because he was totally fatigued by the second round.
And once more the suckers pony up the hundred bucks (or whatever it was, I watched the fight at a bar) to see an “arranged outcome”.
One more thing, does everyone know that the UFC has private trainers? Certain high level people that they allow their favorites to have? This is only one perk in a series of many which tip the fight to their favorite.
You won’t see McGregor nearly as vulnerable to the takedown in his next appearance. Dana will make sure of that as he sends in Matt Hughes, or another of his boys to bring McGregor’s takedown defense up to par. He wants McGregor bringing in those Irish dollars for many years to come.
They certainly don’t do this sort of thing for every fight. But when they zero in on a particular fighter whom they know will earn them mega-bucks there are very few chances taken with that persons career. Proven last night when the completely out of shape Mendes beat McGregor for almost two rounds but went down to defeat once he was too tired to defend himself.
(Applause)
Great job Dana you sum bag!
That sounds pretty dense ZEB.
Count the nummer of snap kicks he catched on his liver, probs to the guy that stays bountifull after that
[quote]Panopticum wrote:
That sounds pretty dense ZEB.
Count the nummer of snap kicks he catched on his liver, probs to the guy that stays bountifull after that[/quote]
Where did I say McGregor didn’t fight back? Nor have I ever said that McGregor is not a very talented fighter, he is no question. Especially on his feet.
But, if you were to score the fight up to the point it was stopped wheezing out of shape Mendes was winning both rounds. Had he been in shape, and Dana was well aware that he wasn’t, he would have won the fight by continuing to ground and pound. The only reason that Mendes gave up position in the second round was to try to tap out McGregor in a desperate move knowing that he did not have the stamina to even go three rounds.
Of course this does not speak to the fact that had they chosen Edgar Dana would have been waving bye bye to all of those Irish PPV dollars.
Was the fight fixed? Of course not! Just “arranged” in the proper manner.
It’s what Dana White does so masterfully when he wants someone to win. He simply sets up a match and then begins to tip it toward his guy. He has gotten away with it for so long that he’s barely even cautious about it anymore. This one being probably no more obvious than the many others.
Oh c’mon!
Dana White doesn’t have an easy way, ever.
Does he do that - what a scumbag!
Will he do this - neatly arranged, Dana!
Cut him some slack, please.
Try to view it this way, Zeb (and those who look at it similarly):
Thanks to the UFC being a non-shill company, we will all get to see those exciting matches (caveat: injuries will happen!).
I’m rarely a fanboy, but it’s great to be a martial arts and MMA fan at this time, because the premier league doesn’t pad records.
So everybody wins.
If McGregor wins, that is.
Then we will see McGregor-Aldo, followed probably by McGregor-Edgar.
Yes, I’m going on a limb here, because the MMAfightin’ Irish has still enough brain-tissue and ego left for at least one fight.
After Edgar I’m not sure, because dang did he eat those hooks without flinching - he can’t go on like that!
Which brings me to the bout itself:
Conor looked like garbage compared to his highlight reel.
Actually, this was a weird clash altogether.
Rhythm, Angles, superb footwork - alles kaputt.
Klitschkoish reach and power, plus this irritatingly ferocious offense.
Conor wasn’t Bruce Lee tonight, he was the Terminator.
When he wasn’t putting his rangy straights to good use he was eating those hooks left and right.
I have to rewatch if Chad really tried to fingerbang Conors newfound headgina, but if true, I’m sure he would have get stuck on titanium.
Both looked a bit desperate.
Chad, while springy and powerful as expected, was either trapped against the cage or full on swinging or lying on Conor, fondling his privates.
There was no middle ground.
I don’t want to downplay the champ. While he lacked his usual finesse and looked irritatingly pale his kicks were a delight.
His front kick was never better.
The cardio excuse I do not buy for one second.
Team Alpha Male are no slouches, their stable has great stamina and work ethic.
Conor pressured relentlessly, every second, every heartbeat . This is something people who don’t fight simply don’t get.
Usually you work for a breather, even unintentionally. Sometimes a second of not worrying about a jab can mean the world.
However, the mad Champ radiates an aura of savagery inside the ring and backs it up by stalking permanently. (Also talking and mumbling to himself)
It’s like going against a hungry carnivore. Yeah he’s gonna pounce!
This usually gives some respite in form of assurance to the defender:
You can counter! Thereby seizing the rhythm and going from there.
And that’s what Chad did- he threw some mean bombs but the Irish chin didn’t even seem to notice.
The normal flow of attacking, defending, countering, scrambling, pause and reset just wasn’t there.
Chad crumbled from a combination of strong body abuse, permanent pressure and very heavy punches to the head.
The last punch was btw more Chad gifting it to the irish crowd then thanks to Conor’s dextrous feet.
Still- what a fight.
Maybe we can later talk about Lawler-McDonald?
Where did I say you said Mcgregor didnt fight back? Where did I say you said Mcgregor isn’t a talented fighter?
I just pointed out these awefull kicks take the wind out of the fighter.
[quote]Panopticum wrote:
I just pointed out these awefull kicks take the wind out of the fighter. [/quote]
He was winded in the FIRST FREAKIN ROUND!
This is a guy that went 5 rounds with Aldo. But McGregor is so great that after a few of his magical kicks Mendes was winded? Ha ha…please stop it.
Mendes was not nearly ready for a fight of this caliber. Yet, he still cut McGregor, won the first round and would have won the second round had he held him down the remaining 45 seconds or so and didn’t attempt a submission. But he had to make that attempt because he knew he couldn’t go even 3 rounds much less 5.
Mendes taking this fight on two weeks notice is what caused him to lose so early, (as hoped and planned for by Dana White). Could he have beaten him had he had a full and proper training camp? We have no idea but I think it would have been closer and I think he would have won. As I said I take nothing away from McGregor he’s a really good fighter. Either way Mendes certainly would not have shown fatigue in the first round.
Again, someone tell me why Edgar who is perpetually in great condition was not given the title shot? But, Mendes who was OBVIOUSLY not in fight shape was given the shot. What is the reason other than Mendes was more beatable? How would the UFC have increased their ppv’s in Ireland had Edgar fought and beat McGregor?
Here’s a clue: IT’S ABOUT M O N E Y!!
Also, I’m never going to be so grateful to see an mma fight that I don’t look behind the curtain and ask a few questions when something smells bad.
Not necessarily you, but there are many young and naive fans that just don’t fully understand the money aspect that the UFC is constantly focused on. The UFC wants to build their brand world wide (I don’t blame them for that) and McGregor being Irish helps builds that world wide brand.
However the typical fan just wants to sit back and see fights and the UFC certainly supplies them. So…apparently nothing else matters to them. The rest of the story is just not important to them–Fine. But I will NEVER spend my hard earned dollars paying for a UFC event. At least not until they stop the manipulation of certain fights.
The thing is, even though it is a sport, UFC makes the money by entetraining the people who pay for gate and PPVs. Most fighters don’t really get this. You can be a great fighter but if your stylistically you are about as entertaining as Jon Fitch and you don’t really want to generate interest by putting your face out there then great, you can get the glory you want by beating everyone but don’t be surprised when nobody is paying you big money and giving you all the perks. You might be the champ and absolutely dominate every opponent in front of you, but if you don’t generate numbers, then you don’t make the money some kid from Ireland does.
Conor is an absolute workhorse when it comes to media obligations, and when you factor in all the work he has had to put in to promote himself and this fight, then I wonder if in the end all the private training camps etc actually did provide him such a massive advantage when you factor in all the pressure of constantly having cameras on you and making public appearances on weekly, sometimes daily basis. There is no reason why Aldo etc. couldn’t oblige in the same game, and guaranteed, they would be making more money and getting more perks, but it is completely within their rights to choose not to, and they’ll still get a fair contest, with independent judges, drug testing etc., and will not be forced to fight injury free. That is the bottom line, and whatever favoritism UFC will take part in will never have as huge impact as you would get with bribed judges etc. Its just that if you are like Chael Sonnen, then you can afford to get manhandled a few times and still get to headline cards and fight for titles, just because your boss knows that you will sell the shit out of his product. Its a free economy though, so if you don’t agree with that, you are always free to set up your own organization. Many have tried, and in the end of the day, some have even failed to pay their athletes.
[quote]Red69 wrote:
Who were you rooting for? I was rooting for McGregor until the actual fight then I started wanting mendez to win.
[/quote]
I like watching both guys, I guess I was rooting for McGregor since he has made 145 lot more interesting as of late. Still, I’m a huge fan of Mendes as well, and my money was on him, but I was still pretty happy with the outcome.
[quote]Schwarzfahrer wrote:
Conor wasn’t Bruce Lee tonight, he was the Terminator.
When he wasn’t putting his rangy straights to good use he was eating those hooks left and right.
I have to rewatch if Chad really tried to fingerbang Conors newfound headgina, but if true, I’m sure he would have get stuck on titanium.
[/quote]
That is exactly what I said when watching the fight, Conor was a terminator tonight. After eating all those bombs, then getting smashed in the head with some mean elbows and complaining to the ref that Chad isn’t working hard enough pretty much said it all, and after that it was a matter of time before he would eventually destroy him on the feet. Apparently you have to sub this guy if you want to take him out, him taking those bombs and laughing them off almost reminded me of Mark Hunt eating shots from Sefo with his hands down and laughing. Hunts chin is still to this day holding up pretty well, so I don’t know if we should expect his chin to degrade any time soon, especially considering that he has made it quite clear that he plans to get out before its too late.
In the end are not all sports about the money? It’s the bottom line man…McGregor sells the shit out of the company and himself, like any smart man would do to get ahead! Add to this his ability to brawl, and take punishment to dish it out, you have the ultimate product…a wise ass, hard hitting, shit talking bad ass that for all intents and purposes takes us back to the glory days of Shamrock or Ortiz!!!
I don’t fully agree with what ZEB is presenting but I feel there is certainly some truth to it.
What we did see the other night was McGregor is for real, if that wasn’t clear already. He’s not a one trick pony being fed cans.
That said, I feel like the UFC has built him up way too fast. He’s already being lionzed and turned into nothing short of a god in the media. I just watched the hour long feature they did on him and while it was a nice watch, it was a little sickening. It was nothing short of watching a religious idol being made before your eyes. No other fighter has gotten this treatment, not even jon jones.
Maybe Mcgregor is the Ali of MMA, or maybe his career crashes and burns in a few fights when chinks in the armor get exposed or he gets distracted by the trappings of fame and what not. Either scenario is likely at this point.
McGregor is definitely stepping the striking game up, his stand up is spectacular. A large featherweight using a variety of attacks to keep his opponents at bay. However, his ground game is obviously shit, and his opponents have been handpicked to keep this weakness from being exploited. The first time he faces a wrestler in a division stock full of them, Mendes is given two weeks notice to prepare and gases by the end of the first. Watch him sitting on the stool between rounds. Mendes with a full camp takes Conor down at will and grapple fucks him to death. Watch Joe Duffy vs McGregor for an example
One thing is clear: McGregor is tough, sure, but he doesn’t do much on the ground against a bonafide wrestler and couldn’t seem to defend the takedowns very well. Not his strenght I guess! But his striking is amazing (elusive and powerfull).
Side note: Ground work isn’t Lawler’s strenght either, but he defends like a champ!
ANYWAYS
It would’ve been nice to see this fight go to the championship rounds if Mendes could’ve kept him on his back one more round. If he had stayed on the mat at the end of the second and keep pounding instead of taking a chance with a sub, then it would’ve been crazy interesting to see McGregor dig deep…
[quote]slimjim wrote:
McGregor is definitely stepping the striking game up, his stand up is spectacular. A large featherweight using a variety of attacks to keep his opponents at bay. However, his ground game is obviously shit, and his opponents have been handpicked to keep this weakness from being exploited. The first time he faces a wrestler in a division stock full of them, Mendes is given two weeks notice to prepare and gases by the end of the first. Watch him sitting on the stool between rounds. Mendes with a full camp takes Conor down at will and grapple fucks him to death. Watch Joe Duffy vs McGregor for an example[/quote]
Hey Jim, how have you been?
Good post