Tried the slight incline today as my last chest session, it was awesome.
The clusters kinda sneak up on you, rep 1 feels like you 10 more in you… Then rep 4 is killer
The 54321 HDL was BRUTAL. Way more work than it looks like on paper. Definitely did not feel like I had to do more when I was done. Can’t exactly say I’m looking forward to TDBL 54321…
Really great stuff CT, thanks for putting this out there
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]brandon76 wrote:
@CT: In regards to peridization and 4 week blocks i noticed you recommended a 4 week strength block in an earlier post, as you thought the hyper cycle lost effectiveness after a certain time. Could i build these strength cycles in each 4 weeks between the 3 different stages of periodization you mentioned up top?[/quote]
Yes, I actually prefer that approach over doing 4 blocks of hypertrophy in a row.[/quote]
Is the strength layer the multiple ramp/cluster one? Ramp to max,cluster, ramp to 2rm, cluster, etc…??
Lonnie…Let me enlighten you,
Per CT:
"I also found that while HDL-type work (5-4-3-2-1, extended sets, hard 5, etc.) can help you build more muscle, they work best when used in short cycles. For the first 3-4 weeks they lead to rapid changes in muscle mass and look. However much past that it will actually have detrimental effect on strength progression which will eventually hurt your overall progress.
So every 4-5 weeks it is a good idea to use a strength-based layer phase.
Here’s a good one that I did this morning for the slight decline bench from pins (but it can be applied to other big lifts used in the layer system).
@Lonnie…LOL yeah thats the one.
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]brandon76 wrote:
@CT: Perfect. So to confirm until the Program is released (tying to put the puzzle together), you do:
4 weeks of the first Period.
4 weeks Strength Period.
4 weeks of the second Period.
4 weeks of the Strength Period.
4 weeks of the 3rd Period.
Etc…[/quote]
Yes that would be a good way to do it. [/quote]
So this is basically interjecting a strength phase as described above between the accumulation, intensification and transformation phases? Still with the objective of attaining maximum muscle mass?
Do you periodize the 4-week strength macro cycle as well (similar to how you periodize the other phases) or does its structure remain identical throughout the 4 weeks?
[quote]Khaine wrote:
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]brandon76 wrote:
@CT: Perfect. So to confirm until the Program is released (tying to put the puzzle together), you do:
4 weeks of the first Period.
4 weeks Strength Period.
4 weeks of the second Period.
4 weeks of the Strength Period.
4 weeks of the 3rd Period.
Etc…[/quote]
Yes that would be a good way to do it. [/quote]
So this is basically interjecting a strength phase as described above between the accumulation, intensification and transformation phases? Still with the objective of attaining maximum muscle mass?
Do you periodize the 4-week strength macro cycle as well (similar to how you periodize the other phases) or does its structure remain identical throughout the 4 weeks?[/quote]
The strength phases are more autoregulatory than periodized so the planned work remains the same for all the 4 weeks.
For the hypertrophy blocks I like to gradually decrease HDL work and increase cluster work.
For example:
WEEK 1: 3 cluster sets / 3 HDL sets
WEEK 2: 4 cluster sets / 2 HDL sets
WEEK 3: 5 cluster sets / 1 HDL set
WEEK 4: 3 cluster sets / 1 HDL set
CT, for max muscle gains, is it advisable to cycle in Reverse grip pressing every 3 or 4 sessions?
[quote]Lonnie123 wrote:
CT, for max muscle gains, is it advisable to cycle in Reverse grip pressing every 3 or 4 sessions?[/quote]
No, as I mentionned, stick with the same main movement for the whole training block. HOWEVER once the main/layered lift is done, you can do 3-4 sets of 4-6 or 6-8 reps on an assistance lift, including the reverse grip bench press.
@CT: In terms of a OHP from pins (eye level takeoff) assistance exercise, 6-8 would be more for hyper and 4-6 more for strength focus?
@CT: Also for the height of the bar off blocks for rows and high pulls, etc. I always try to set to as close to just above knee as possible…however I noticed its higher for your video stuff. It may be better for the back a bit higher. Mid- Thigh seems to be the more natural position for me setting up. What do you think?
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]Khaine wrote:
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]brandon76 wrote:
@CT: Perfect. So to confirm until the Program is released (tying to put the puzzle together), you do:
4 weeks of the first Period.
4 weeks Strength Period.
4 weeks of the second Period.
4 weeks of the Strength Period.
4 weeks of the 3rd Period.
Etc…[/quote]
Yes that would be a good way to do it. [/quote]
So this is basically interjecting a strength phase as described above between the accumulation, intensification and transformation phases? Still with the objective of attaining maximum muscle mass?
Do you periodize the 4-week strength macro cycle as well (similar to how you periodize the other phases) or does its structure remain identical throughout the 4 weeks?[/quote]
The strength phases are more autoregulatory than periodized so the planned work remains the same for all the 4 weeks.
For the hypertrophy blocks I like to gradually decrease HDL work and increase cluster work.
For example:
WEEK 1: 3 cluster sets / 3 HDL sets
WEEK 2: 4 cluster sets / 2 HDL sets
WEEK 3: 5 cluster sets / 1 HDL set
WEEK 4: 3 cluster sets / 1 HDL set[/quote]
CT- in your system we incline & decline press from pins…would you recommend for a brief period switching to regular incline and decline pressing? same for front squat. thanks
[quote]wreaking havoc wrote:
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]Khaine wrote:
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]brandon76 wrote:
@CT: Perfect. So to confirm until the Program is released (tying to put the puzzle together), you do:
4 weeks of the first Period.
4 weeks Strength Period.
4 weeks of the second Period.
4 weeks of the Strength Period.
4 weeks of the 3rd Period.
Etc…[/quote]
Yes that would be a good way to do it. [/quote]
So this is basically interjecting a strength phase as described above between the accumulation, intensification and transformation phases? Still with the objective of attaining maximum muscle mass?
Do you periodize the 4-week strength macro cycle as well (similar to how you periodize the other phases) or does its structure remain identical throughout the 4 weeks?[/quote]
The strength phases are more autoregulatory than periodized so the planned work remains the same for all the 4 weeks.
For the hypertrophy blocks I like to gradually decrease HDL work and increase cluster work.
For example:
WEEK 1: 3 cluster sets / 3 HDL sets
WEEK 2: 4 cluster sets / 2 HDL sets
WEEK 3: 5 cluster sets / 1 HDL set
WEEK 4: 3 cluster sets / 1 HDL set[/quote]
CT- in your system we incline & decline press from pins…would you recommend for a brief period switching to regular incline and decline pressing? same for front squat. thanks [/quote]
I answered this many times. Yes, the system can be used with regular lifts (not from pins) but you can’t do clusters that way,m it drains too much energy to rack and unrack the bar 5 times per set. In that case we do straight sets of 3-5 reps instead of clusters.
[quote]brandon76 wrote:
@CT: In terms of a OHP from pins (eye level takeoff) assistance exercise, 6-8 would be more for hyper and 4-6 more for strength focus? [/quote]
Not really, I see it more as movement-specific… 6-8 is better for rows, leg press and isolation exercises if you chose to go that route, 4-6 is better for basic presses (e.g. push press) and other basic movements like squats.
[quote]brandon76 wrote:
@CT: Also for the height of the bar off blocks for rows and high pulls, etc. I always try to set to as close to just above knee as possible…however I noticed its higher for your video stuff. It may be better for the back a bit higher. Mid- Thigh seems to be the more natural position for me setting up. What do you think? [/quote]
Yes, might thigh is generally best for high pulls
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]wreaking havoc wrote:
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]Khaine wrote:
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]brandon76 wrote:
@CT: Perfect. So to confirm until the Program is released (tying to put the puzzle together), you do:
4 weeks of the first Period.
4 weeks Strength Period.
4 weeks of the second Period.
4 weeks of the Strength Period.
4 weeks of the 3rd Period.
Etc…[/quote]
Yes that would be a good way to do it. [/quote]
So this is basically interjecting a strength phase as described above between the accumulation, intensification and transformation phases? Still with the objective of attaining maximum muscle mass?
Do you periodize the 4-week strength macro cycle as well (similar to how you periodize the other phases) or does its structure remain identical throughout the 4 weeks?[/quote]
The strength phases are more autoregulatory than periodized so the planned work remains the same for all the 4 weeks.
For the hypertrophy blocks I like to gradually decrease HDL work and increase cluster work.
For example:
WEEK 1: 3 cluster sets / 3 HDL sets
WEEK 2: 4 cluster sets / 2 HDL sets
WEEK 3: 5 cluster sets / 1 HDL set
WEEK 4: 3 cluster sets / 1 HDL set[/quote]
CT- in your system we incline & decline press from pins…would you recommend for a brief period switching to regular incline and decline pressing? same for front squat. thanks [/quote]
I answered this many times. Yes, the system can be used with regular lifts (not from pins) but you can’t do clusters that way,m it drains too much energy to rack and unrack the bar 5 times per set. In that case we do straight sets of 3-5 reps instead of clusters.[/quote]
sorry CT, yes I have seen you comment on how you do full range presses but I am asking would you recommend it. I have read the value of pin pressing but if we have been doing this for 12+ weeks should we consider full range presses for a period of time. will you work full range presses back into your routines or stick with the pin pressing? thanks
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
Periodize:
Week 1: Ramp to 3RM, 3 cluster sets, 3 HDL sets
Week 2: Ramp to 2RM, 4 cluster sets, 2 HDL sets
Week 3: Ramp to 1RM, 5 cluster sets, 1 HDL set
Week 4: Ramp to 1RM, 3 HDL sets, 2 max pump sets
Repeat
(…)
For example:
WEEK 1: 3 cluster sets / 3 HDL sets
WEEK 2: 4 cluster sets / 2 HDL sets
WEEK 3: 5 cluster sets / 1 HDL set
WEEK 4: 3 cluster sets / 1 HDL set
[/quote]
So these are just different alternatives; how would you decide which one to use when?
And how would you feel about something like this:
Week 1: Ramp to 3RM, 3 cluster sets, 3 HDL sets
Week 2: Ramp to 2RM, 4 cluster sets, 2 HDL sets
Week 3: Ramp to 1RM, 5 cluster sets, 1 HDL set
Week 4: Ramp to 1RM, 1 giant cluster, 1 HDL set, 1 max pump set
For someone that just can’t bench without some discomfort, but is strong enough on dips (a BW dip is roughly 60% 1RM), would it be OK to do overhead press and dips instead of the incline and decline bench presses?
[quote]SirValeq wrote:
For someone that just can’t bench without some discomfort, but is strong enough on dips (a BW dip is roughly 60% 1RM), would it be OK to do overhead press and dips instead of the incline and decline bench presses?[/quote]
Have you tried the slight incline/decline? Many who have had pain benching can do those. Also, if you have access or can afford it, the deadsquat bar has also been said to allow pain-free benching.
Overhead presses have been okayed, but I just don’t know if dips would allow for the overload necessary. CT has said which exercises work best with the layers and dips have been mentioned several times as only being used as an assistive exercise at the end.
[quote]Khaine wrote:
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
Periodize:
Week 1: Ramp to 3RM, 3 cluster sets, 3 HDL sets
Week 2: Ramp to 2RM, 4 cluster sets, 2 HDL sets
Week 3: Ramp to 1RM, 5 cluster sets, 1 HDL set
Week 4: Ramp to 1RM, 3 HDL sets, 2 max pump sets
Repeat
(…)
For example:
WEEK 1: 3 cluster sets / 3 HDL sets
WEEK 2: 4 cluster sets / 2 HDL sets
WEEK 3: 5 cluster sets / 1 HDL set
WEEK 4: 3 cluster sets / 1 HDL set
[/quote]
So these are just different alternatives; how would you decide which one to use when?
And how would you feel about something like this:
Week 1: Ramp to 3RM, 3 cluster sets, 3 HDL sets
Week 2: Ramp to 2RM, 4 cluster sets, 2 HDL sets
Week 3: Ramp to 1RM, 5 cluster sets, 1 HDL set
Week 4: Ramp to 1RM, 1 giant cluster, 1 HDL set, 1 max pump set[/quote]
Looks like something I would do myself.
Thanks, GeneticSynergy9. I’ll try to see if the slight decline works for me.
I do have another question though: what about failure within the layer system? I didn’t see it mentioned anywhere. Is going to failure permitted in the 2nd, 3rd and 4th layer or should it be avoided at all cost, stopping 1 rep short every time? (let’s assume that muscle mass is a priority, not strength)
One last thing: the system looks really great. I think it must be the best system I’ve seen so far, just because it’s so customizable and autoregulatory. Can’t wait to see the whole of it!