[quote]BuckeyeGirl01 wrote:
mindeffer01 wrote:
Buckeyegirl01 is that your stuff there in the avatar?
Yes, it’s me. Thanks for the compliment! I’ve been working on some improvements, so hopefully sometime soon I’ll be able to take new pictures. :o)[/quote]
Nice work!
[quote]brandon51287 wrote:
I really do not understand how you can say you are training hard as hell and all this shit… I really dont understand why you are not gaining any muscle.[/quote]
I’m not? I’ve put on ten pounds of weight, which would be almost nine pounds muscle in a month. I’ve put 1.75" on my chest, 1/2" on my biceps, 2" in my shoulders and almost an inch in my upper thighs in under a month.
Now, as I said, I’m not yet looking for a pat on the back, but that seems to be a bit more than “not gaining any muscle”.
[quote]BuckeyeGirl01 wrote:
I keep wondering, with regard to “transformation”-type pictures…why do people post their before pics alone?[/quote]
Hmm. I don’t know why “people” do it. Everyone probably has slightly different reasons.
Why did I do it?
OK, that WASN’T one of the reasons.
I have made some progress since I started. I don’t have any pictures of how skinny I was before! (scary) But I don’t expect these pix to awe anyone. Don’t feel obligated to give me a half-hearted pat on the back; I’m not looking for one.
Now the next set, if you can’t see some visible progress, then I’m not working hard enough.
http://images.t-nation.com/forum_images/./1/.1109139810383.Blaine_Street_Solo_2004-08-15_1.jpg
Ah here we go… A scary “before” pic. This is from August 04.
[quote]michaelv wrote:
Did I buy my leathers before I started getting serious about gaining? That’s not really relevant.[/quote]
Bullshit. You know why I asked and your aversion to answering the question gives me my answer. Since you bought this leather suit previously when you were heavier, it makes your comments about not wanting to gain so much muscle that you outgrow it a clear excuse. Excuse me while I call bullshit to nearly every other reason you gave as to why you plan to avoid making progress until next fall.
You are the same size as a girl’s size 4. I don’t know about you, but that alone would have me busting my ass in the gym, leather suit or no leather suit. I am sure you may actually believe that you are training oh so hard. I disagree. You don’t seem to have the desire or the heart. At least I can end this with a “Great Job, guy!”
JMB
Hey, how old do you think I am?? :o)[/quote]
is that a picture of YOUR legs???<3<3<3
[quote]Professor X wrote:
michaelv wrote:
Did I buy my leathers before I started getting serious about gaining? That’s not really relevant.
Bullshit. You know why I asked and your aversion to answering the question gives me my answer. Since you bought this leather suit previously when you were heavier, it makes your comments about not wanting to gain so much muscle that you outgrow it a clear excuse. Excuse me while I call bullshit to nearly every other reason you gave as to why you plan to avoid making progress until next fall.
You are the same size as a girl’s size 4. I don’t know about you, but that alone would have me busting my ass in the gym, leather suit or no leather suit. I am sure you may actually believe that you are training oh so hard. I disagree. You don’t seem to have the desire or the heart. At least I can end this with a “Great Job, guy!”
[/quote]
LOL, shoot from the hip. I love it.
No, I bought the suit when I was lighter. It was too big for me when I bought it. I had no idea I was going to enjoy bodybuilding this much when I first bought it.
Additionally, I had no aversion to answering your question. First, I told you why it was irrelevant, and then I answered it anyway.
I told you why I will stop eating massively during the summer. Let me make it very explicit:
I will be running around in running shorts and a tank top. I don’t want a big-ass belly. Sorry, I know you don’t agree. You think I can eat 6000 cals a week and still not put any noticable fat on my gut. Don’t work that way anymore; maybe when I was younger. I’m not afraid to make that sacrifice now, but I’m not going to run around all summer with a fat lardy stomach.
I will be racing my motorcycle. I want a stable weight, and I want to be comfortable.
I have a suit that fits. It will still fit me with bigger chest and shoulders. It will not fit me if I put 220 lbs and a big-ass gut on.
Therefore, I will not eat massively during the summer. Is that clear?
I will still work out. I will probably add some muscle. But I will not be in gainer mode.
Do you want to take me up on my bet? 190 by May 1st? I’ll buy you a bottle of Spike if I lose.
JMB… you’re 19? You look about 30, and that ain’t good.
[quote]icklemoley wrote:
JMB… you’re 19? You look about 30, and that ain’t good.[/quote]
I look 30 to you?
I now agree with prof x entirely, here is why?
[quote]michaelv wrote:
LOL, shoot from the hip. I love it.
No, I bought the suit when I was lighter. It was too big for me when I bought it. I had no idea I was going to enjoy bodybuilding this much when I first bought it.
[/quote]
I don’t know what makes you think you’ll have a gut, or that you’ll get fat. On 6000 cals, sure. But at 4000 cals, you should gain nicely wothout putting on much fat. If you are so afraid of gaining fat, you are in the wrong place. You should check out weight watchers. They usually have summer discounts.
I’m not sure what you think is going to happen if you eat 4000 cals, but adding 54 lbs in a couple of months? That’s 216,000 cals worth of fat.
You think you will gain ona sub-maintanace diet? Because if you eat any less than you are eating now, you WILL be sub-maintenance.
[quote]
Do you want to take me up on my bet? 190 by May 1st? I’ll buy you a bottle of Spike if I lose.[/quote]
Smart. How about you wager that you’ll end up a fat-ass with diabetes and high blood pressure. Betting against yourself? Could you try any harder to set yourself up for failure?
I can tell, based on what you have written, that you haven’t been reading any of Berardi’s stuff. In the last month, I have gained 3lbs, 5 of that being LBM (ie, +5 LBM, -2 fat). If you eat well, you don’t have to worry about getting “fat” or anything. Any fat you do put on, you can take off in a 3-4 weeks no problem.
[quote]Aleksandr wrote:
I’m not sure what you think is going to happen if you eat 4000 cals, but adding 54 lbs in a couple of months? That’s 216,000 cals worth of fat.
You think you will gain on a sub-maintanace diet? Because if you eat any less than you are eating now, you WILL be sub-maintenance.
I can tell, based on what you have written, that you haven’t been reading any of Berardi’s stuff. In the last month, I have gained 3lbs, 5 of that being LBM (ie, +5 LBM, -2 fat). If you eat well, you don’t have to worry about getting “fat” or anything.[/quote]
No, I am currently around 166. 190 would be +24 pounds in a couple months. Hard, yes, but not impossible.
My point about 6000 cals was that it sounds like to me ProfX wants me to continue bulking non-stop. If 4000 becomes maintenance, then I will continue to have to add more. I just pulled 6000 out of my ass, but you agree that 4000 won’t be enough.
I already acknowledged I am not eating enough. I can know that without being told so here, because I can feel it and see it on the scale. I need to step up my food intake another notch. Already noted.
Here is the crux of my concern. On the current run I have already put a little gut on. If I continue to eat enough to put on significant weight, that will continue. I’m talking massive eating here. At the time I started, my calorie intake was enough to put on 10 pounds in a month, not 3. If I step up my calories to do another 10 to 13 pounds in another month, more gut along with a bunch more muscle. I’m ok with that for the short term.
And that is in my plan, right there, in May.
Look, don’t get me wrong, I freely acknowledge I don’t have everything figured out yet. If 4000 cals becomes maintenance when I hit May 1, then 4000 cals will be what I eat through the summer. Let’s not fixate on the number.
I am not going to cut during the summer. I am going to cut in May, then go to whatever maintenance calories are required. In fact, calories that will allow me to put on 3 lbs of muscle a month would be fine. Because, as you acknowledged, I will probably put on muscle while maintaining or reducing fat.
But that is a much different calorie intake than I am shooting for before May 1st, which is eating massive, putting on a LOT of weight, including some inevitable fat.
I guess I come across stronger refuting the good Professor. But the fact is that one of the reasons I posted this thread is that I AM looking for advice. Within certain parameters anyway.
Those parameters are bulk like there’s no tomorrow until May 1st. Cut the fat in May. Then, during the summer, go on a calorie intake that will be just enough to slowly build muscle mass while maintaining or slightly reducing fat. Once fall hits full swing, go on another massive gain phase.
BTW to the dude who complained about me taking up the top-10 list “defending how skinny I am”: So, don’t post in this thread; you’re just making it worse. But I do truly appreciate the constructive criticism. Besides, after I get roasted a bit, this thread will die out until I post my next update, which may be in a month or two.
First, your 10 lbs in 1 month gains… I’m skeptical about how much of that is muscle. I did 5 lbs of LBM in 1 month, the fastest growth I have ever had (it was 3 lbs net, like I said before, I lost 2 lbs of fat). The only reason I put it on so fast is I am just coming back to working out after being out for a while.
How much of your 10 lbs was LBM? I’m not trying to tell you off, I am trying to help you understand why everyone is pissed off. My point was, right now, 4000 cals is plenty for a clean bulk. It leaves you with like 500-600 cal surplus on non-training days. If you start a clean bulk right now, and follow Dr. Berardi’s advice to the letter, I assure you, you will lose fat and gain muscle for at least 1 month.
But it keeps coming back to this. You are ignoring your nutrition, and this makes me question your dedication. Eating right is hard, at first. But it does get easier IF you make the effort. Just do a clean bulk, and don’t stop. After you have something to cut TO, then worry about that. Aslong as your bulk is clean, your clothes will still fit just fine.
Next time you reply, I hope to god to it’s to say you finally read massive eating I and II, and massive eating reloaded I and II. After you realize how your current diet is crappy, you may want to get his recipe e-book. At the very least, go to his web-site, look at sample recipes, and figure out what you need to do.
Then, you’ll tell us you changed your mind, and we will all be happy for you. In a year, you’ll post pictures of yourself, and people will say “awesome work, keep going”.
Tell you what…I’ll try to be helpful but before I do I have to say that you do seem to have “issues” with the idea of gaining fat…still you will probably give me an essay back to prove you never said that so…whatever. If you trained a bit harder you would not have to worry about gaining fat whilst eating massively. Plus- how predisposed are you to gaining fat anyway? Looks to me from your before pic that you couldnt get fat if you tried.
Of course, if you ate massively without the requisite intensity in the weight-room, then maybe you could.
As far as upping calories goes:
I would eat Sunflower seeds (600 cals per 100g), Walnuts (ridiculous number of cals per 100), various oils on salads etc. normally 150 cals per tablespoon.
The quickest way to add cals is with good fats- the old 9 cals per gram come in handy. I dont really know which ones are the best choices, but with all the research you have done you will probably know better than I the best one(s) to eat.
If you really want to add cals why not post a food diary with macros and meal times and maybe people will point out places where you can add some cals in?
Jaime
[quote]BuckeyeGirl01 wrote:
mindeffer01 wrote:
Buckeyegirl01 is that your stuff there in the avatar?
Yes, it’s me. Thanks for the compliment! I’ve been working on some improvements, so hopefully sometime soon I’ll be able to take new pictures. :o)[/quote]
I can’t wait 
[quote]Aleksandr wrote:
First, your 10 lbs in 1 month gains… I’m skeptical about how much of that is muscle. I did 5 lbs of LBM in 1 month, the fastest growth I have ever had (it was 3 lbs net, like I said before, I lost 2 lbs of fat). The only reason I put it on so fast is I am just coming back to working out after being out for a while.[/quote]
Considering my bf% has risen only slightly, most of that is LBM. Of course, the equipment I have is notoriously inaccurate, so maybe I’m under-reporting my bf%. I’m currently using an Omron hand-held thingie because it seems most consistent. My bf% is around 12%. So, if I gained 10 pounds, that would be 8.8 pounds LBM.
But then again, maybe I’m niave. I am still somewhat of a beginner, and maybe that’s why the weight went on so easy at first. My increased calories, then, were the largest increase I had in long time. Now they’re not enough. I need to eat more, yes.
Understood. Am I wrong in the analysis of my progress so far? I mean seriously, if I am, I want to know.
Why do you think I’m ignoring my nutrition? I have spent an enormous amount of time figuring out Berardi and peers. I am utilizing the principles. There is nothing ignored.
That’s the crux of the problem. I was getting enough calories to bulk a month ago. Now it’s slowed down, which means I need to increase calories again.
Yes, it’s harder, IMHO to do this high-clean-calorie diet than a cutting diet. Finding the time and finding the food, to be eating enough at work, is quite a challenge. But I have already made adjustments to address that.
I guess it depends on how many excess calories I’m eating.
I have already read them. I printed them out. I still have to get his recipe book, but hadn’t gotten around to it. I’ll download it tonight. Please tell me what makes you think I am ignoring my nutrition? Is it because I put on a little belly fat?
OK, I changed my mind.
No, not really, but not because I’m trying to be a dick. The thing is, I’m already in agreement with you, but for some reason that’s not coming across. Maybe people are fixated on how skinny I am. For god’s sake, take a look at my before picture. I may look skinny now but I’m way bigger than I started.
However, here is what I will “change”: I will continue to eat a helluva lot of calories, upping as needed (like I just did recently), and I will continue to work hard in the gym, most likely a Waterbury workout. I will not cut or diet until I weigh at least 180lbs TBW -AND- my bf% is over 14%. I predicted that would happen in May, and set that as a goal. If I hit May, and my bf% is still around 12% (or less), I’ll just keep bulking. Does that seem reasonable?
Seriously, I appreciate the feedback.
[quote]jaimeo wrote:
Tell you what…I’ll try to be helpful but before I do I have to say that you do seem to have “issues” with the idea of gaining fat…still you will probably give me an essay back to prove you never said that so…whatever.[/quote]
I’m not in denial on purpose. 
I think you’re right that maybe I do, once summer rolls around. I don’t right now. My strategy was to gain as much as possible, including any extra fat, during the winter and early spring. Then to cut that fat and go into slow-gain mode without fat gain for the summer.
I think where I will say something you interpret as denying is that I’m not so afraid of fat during the summer that I’m going to diet all summer. I’m not. I’m going to eat “normal” calories.
But here is where I will agree with you. I have already seen my bf% rise slowly as I’ve been bulking. I expect it to continue rising slowly, and eventually it will have to be dealt with. On the other hand, if it levels off while I keep gaining, then problem averted. Yes, I am worried about it getting too high if it continues to rise for several more months. No, I’m not worried about fat if it levels off, and in that case, the cutting phase won’t be necessary.
How can I train harder? I’m borderline over-training as it is. I am doing Waterbury Method at the moment. And, to be frank, I’m ecstatic with the results so far.
Keep in mind that the before photo was after I had spent several months on reduced calories, around 1500~1600 per day. I DID have a belly before I got serious about my physique, which is how I started on this whole odyssey in the first place. I hated being a “skinny” guy with a gut.
You’re right that I had that body type as a kid. But at 39 years old, my metabolism has slowed enough that I can gain fat now. I can also gain muscle now, which is why this is a good thing.
[quote]As far as upping calories goes:
I would eat Sunflower seeds (600 cals per 100g), Walnuts (ridiculous number of cals per 100), various oils on salads etc. normally 150 cals per tablespoon.
The quickest way to add cals is with good fats- the old 9 cals per gram come in handy. I dont really know which ones are the best choices, but with all the research you have done you will probably know better than I the best one(s) to eat.
If you really want to add cals why not post a food diary with macros and meal times and maybe people will point out places where you can add some cals in?
Jaime[/quote]
Jaime, those are some great ideas.
Yes, I already add olive oil, flax seeds and peanut butter to my nighttime smoothie. I also add flax seeds to my afternoon Low-Carb Grow! shake. I use skim milk instead of water in my morning Grow! shake. Eating some nuts during the day is probably a really good idea. I’ll add some in. I’ve also picked up some beef jerky to munch on during the day.
I’ll post up a diet plan once I get the new one finished.
Thanks for the ideas.
I’m glad to hear you are reading Berardi, I asked several times, and beause you didn’t respond, I assumed you weren’t. So, just do bi-weekly check-ins.
Every two weeks, check all your stats (measurements, weight, bf). As far as bf goes, take a bunch of measurements in a row, and don’t stop until you get the same number every time. All you need to worry about is being able to compare yourself at various time.
If at a measuring point, you haven’t made progress (or if you fail to beat the log book a coiuple of times), add a couple of hundred cals. If your bf is rising, fix your carb timing, eat more, smaller meals, or increase your protein intake and lower carbs/fat slightly.
Do this, and you’ll do just fine. You can bulk for a very long time, and gain very little fat.
[quote]Aleksandr wrote:
I’m glad to hear you are reading Berardi, I asked several times, and beause you didn’t respond, I assumed you weren’t.[/quote]
Ah, sorry, I guess I missed the query.
[quote]If at a measuring point, you haven’t made progress (or if you fail to beat the log book a coiuple of times), add a couple of hundred cals. If your bf is rising, fix your carb timing, eat more, smaller meals, or increase your protein intake and lower carbs/fat slightly.
Do this, and you’ll do just fine. You can bulk for a very long time, and gain very little fat.[/quote]
Excellent advice. Thanks.
[quote]michaelv wrote:
I spent a lot of freakin time reading and reading and reading trying to figure out how get here. Knowledge isn’t instantaneous. I don’t expect you to pat me on the back, but at least acknowledge that this stuff isn’t figured out overnight.
[/quote]
That’s your whole problem.
Stop FUCKING reading and actually lift some weights. Talk about total nonsense excuses - are you serious here? It actually is so simple, it’s astonishing - lift weights, put weights back down - wash, rinse, repeat. Then go eat something…
Not that you’ll even read this, since this thread is ancient.