I find that few people experience life after birth, let alone after death.
[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
Who believes in it, and why?
Your thoughts?[/quote]
While I’m not enlightened or sure headed as some here, I’ll through out some thoughts anyway.
I really don’t think humans are as smart or advanced as we tend to thing ourselves to be. If our infantile understanding of the universe doesn’t humble people, nothing will. And that’s why, it doesn’t matter if there is an afterlife or not. All that matters is how you live your life.
(Not saying you are doing this but) if you are seeking validation for your beliefs or need to put down others for theirs, it says more about you than anyone else.
If someone doesn’t understand 2+2=4, you try and teach them basic math, not shout them down a fool and cast them aside. If they can’t or refuse to learn it, then you evaluate whether they are a good person or not. If they are, then who cares if they know math, assuming they can sustain themselves not knowing it.
Likewise, who cares if someone believes there is life after death, irrelevant of what they call it. Are they a good person while alive?
As for the question, I think its silly to assume the physical world we know is the beginning and end of consciousness. Beginning and end of perception? Sure, maybe… But why assume we, as humans, are even capable of understanding most things, let alone everything, including none physical “life”?
Couple hundred years ago people would have said you were crazy if you told them man would walk on the moon. But I suppose anyone who believes we don’t have all the answers today and our “brains” aren’t, in fact, the beginning and end of everything, are crazy too.
[quote]Severiano wrote:
Nope.
Further, I believe that introducing children to such ideas also introduces existential fear that we all have to deal with as humans. Faith in the afterlife sets up people for a life of fear, as the nature of reason questions, and the nature of questions for humans lies in what happens to us when we die.
When we invest in the idea of an afterlife we subject ourselves to the push pull of fear within faith and reason… Rather than just dealing with and accepting the strong likelyhood that there is no afterlife, people buy into the idea and then have to convince themselves of such over and over out of fear of the contrary. This is the nature of faith in the afterlife, it leads to Existentialism in later life, and the holding onto of the intrinsic fear that there is no afterlife, rather than never buying into the idea at all in the first place.
I’ve gone so far as to call people who are educated and believe in the afterlife; cowards. But really we are wired to be horrified of death, and not everyone is strong enough to look at reality the same way I do. [/quote]
I will bet good money that you have NEVER called anyone a coward to their face for believing in the after life.
And we are wired to be horrified of death? What nonsense.
[quote]IamMarqaos wrote:
And we are wired to be horrified of death? What nonsense.
[/quote]
Agree. In fact I think we are wired to survive, and survive by any means. Whether it be joy, fear, love, or hotdogs doesn’t matter, what does is you fulfill your instinct to survive.
I’m convinced that is where we derive our understanding of natural rights from… A manifestation of our instincts.
I’ve written much about my opinions on this subject.
The main thing I dislike about the afterlife concept: A lot of people use it to believe their time on earth is a dress rehearsal. When you are non-believer you are forced to accept that you DON’T get any do-overs in life.
I derive much motivation for my life goals knowing there’s no arguing with father time.
[quote]therajraj wrote:
I’ve written much about my opinions on this subject.
The main thing I dislike about the afterlife concept: A lot of people use it to believe their time on earth is a dress rehearsal. When you are non-believer you are forced to accept that you DON’T get any do-overs in life.
I derive much motivation for my life goals knowing there’s no arguing with father time. [/quote]
This is what I’m getting at… Whatever belief you may have, as long as you’re a good person, it’s a good belief.
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
[quote]therajraj wrote:
I’ve written much about my opinions on this subject.
The main thing I dislike about the afterlife concept: A lot of people use it to believe their time on earth is a dress rehearsal. When you are non-believer you are forced to accept that you DON’T get any do-overs in life.
I derive much motivation for my life goals knowing there’s no arguing with father time. [/quote]
This is what I’m getting at… Whatever belief you may have, as long as you’re a good person, it’s a good belief. [/quote]
While I am a live and let live person and don’t believe it is my job to set anyone on what I may think is the right path, I do understand the feelings behind taking an interest in someone else’s belief if it’s someone you care about. My SIL is a fundamentalist and her parents have a real hard time keeping out of it because they see her warning her life waiting for the afterlife. She is a good person more or less but is banking everything on life after death. To me, that’s her choice but I can see how a parent would have a hard time with it. Similarly she thinks they are going to hell so I guess there is balance 
[quote]debraD wrote:
Count me with those who don’t believe in life after death. I have no reason to think that once my heart stops and my brain dies that I will continue to exist since my brain, while it is alive, is me.
I don’t find that depressing. I enjoy being alive but I won’t know the difference when it ends. It’s a bit harder to stomach that loved ones who die are gone forever. But all I know is there is no point counting on anything more so I best make the most out of this one. [/quote]
but in reality, living in Canada is kinda like being in heaven, if I understand you correctly~
The one thing I can’t stand, no offense to religious people, is when someone dies they say that they have gone to a better place. There isn’t a better place to be than alive and living on this planet.
[quote]strungoutboy21 wrote:
The one thing I can’t stand, no offense to religious people, is when someone dies they say that they have gone to a better place. There isn’t a better place to be than alive and living on this planet. [/quote]
lmao… Yeah, fuck those people who try and comfort their pain, even if temporarily, by wishing well the fallen.
How dare people deal with the death of a loved one in an doubleungood way!
[quote]debraD wrote:
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
[quote]therajraj wrote:
I’ve written much about my opinions on this subject.
The main thing I dislike about the afterlife concept: A lot of people use it to believe their time on earth is a dress rehearsal. When you are non-believer you are forced to accept that you DON’T get any do-overs in life.
I derive much motivation for my life goals knowing there’s no arguing with father time. [/quote]
This is what I’m getting at… Whatever belief you may have, as long as you’re a good person, it’s a good belief. [/quote]
While I am a live and let live person and don’t believe it is my job to set anyone on what I may think is the right path, I do understand the feelings behind taking an interest in someone else’s belief if it’s someone you care about. My SIL is a fundamentalist and her parents have a real hard time keeping out of it because they see her warning her life waiting for the afterlife. She is a good person more or less but is banking everything on life after death. To me, that’s her choice but I can see how a parent would have a hard time with it. Similarly she thinks they are going to hell so I guess there is balance :P[/quote]
Well, it is a bit different for a parent, but at the same time…
If someone wants to wack off with a PB&J sandwich every Thursday while watching Sports Center on repeat, who the hell cares if they aren’t hurting anyone else?
Like I said, try and help her add 2+2 (assuming she says 5, and not just 4 with a different accent) and move on…
Well personally, having never died, it’s not technically scientifically proven that I in fact will. For all I know I cannot be killed.
[quote]Severiano wrote:
Nope.
Further, I believe that introducing children to such ideas also introduces existential fear that we all have to deal with as humans. Faith in the afterlife sets up people for a life of fear, as the nature of reason questions, and the nature of questions for humans lies in what happens to us when we die.
When we invest in the idea of an afterlife we subject ourselves to the push pull of fear within faith and reason… Rather than just dealing with and accepting the strong likelyhood that there is no afterlife, people buy into the idea and then have to convince themselves of such over and over out of fear of the contrary. This is the nature of faith in the afterlife, it leads to Existentialism in later life, and the holding onto of the intrinsic fear that there is no afterlife, rather than never buying into the idea at all in the first place.
I’ve gone so far as to call people who are educated and believe in the afterlife; cowards. But really we are wired to be horrified of death, and not everyone is strong enough to look at reality the same way I do. [/quote]
You profoundly misunderstand dual world theologies. People don’t believe because they are “afraid” of death. People believe because the self needs to understand why it exists at all. Man is condemned to ask why and get no answer. That is nihilism. The only escape from nihilism is meaning. I’m not afraid of suffering or dying. I’m afraid of meaninglessness; of nothingness; of the absurd; of oblivion. The fact that you are not afraid of these things does not make you less of a coward; it just makes you less of a deep thinker.
[quote]SexMachine wrote:
[quote]Severiano wrote:
Nope.
Further, I believe that introducing children to such ideas also introduces existential fear that we all have to deal with as humans. Faith in the afterlife sets up people for a life of fear, as the nature of reason questions, and the nature of questions for humans lies in what happens to us when we die.
When we invest in the idea of an afterlife we subject ourselves to the push pull of fear within faith and reason… Rather than just dealing with and accepting the strong likelyhood that there is no afterlife, people buy into the idea and then have to convince themselves of such over and over out of fear of the contrary. This is the nature of faith in the afterlife, it leads to Existentialism in later life, and the holding onto of the intrinsic fear that there is no afterlife, rather than never buying into the idea at all in the first place.
I’ve gone so far as to call people who are educated and believe in the afterlife; cowards. But really we are wired to be horrified of death, and not everyone is strong enough to look at reality the same way I do. [/quote]
You profoundly misunderstand dual world theologies. People don’t believe because they are “afraid” of death. People believe because the self needs to understand why it exists at all. Man is condemned to ask why and get no answer. That is nihilism. The only escape from nihilism is meaning. I’m not afraid of suffering or dying. I’m afraid of meaninglessness; of nothingness; of the absurd; of oblivion. The fact that you are not afraid of these things does not make you less of a coward; it just makes you less of a deep thinker.[/quote]
That is true, death is nothing, the lack of meaning is just a tad demotivating.
To those that don’t believe in anything at all after death, how do you explain near-death experiences?
[quote]Tyler23 wrote:
To those that don’t believe in anything at all after death, how do you explain near-death experiences?[/quote]
Some freak, weird, random brain thingies that get interpreted through a cultural filter.
[quote]Tyler23 wrote:
To those that don’t believe in anything at all after death, how do you explain near-death experiences?[/quote]
A near-death experience is actually the subjective experience of “depersonalisation”. The exact same effect can be reproduced with drugs called “dissociatives” - the most well known being Ketamine. People given high doses of Ketamine intravenously regularly report the sensation of being “outside” themselves and even of watching themselves from above. The other experiences reported in near-death are more of an hallucinatory nature and likely relate to:
- Hypoxia - the effect of deprivation of oxygen to the brain
And
- Neurotransmitters/chemicals such as serotonin/DMT, adrenaline/adrenochrome, endorphins etc
YES! I’ll see you all in HELL!
[quote]EmilyQ wrote:
I have determined that there are no facts upon which to base a sound conclusion, hence the only valid response is to treat it as a mystery. I’m comfortable with that as I have no particular investment in either outcome. I’m not driven to support religious beliefs or to disown them in the name of science. There is no knowing, therefore I don’t know. If there is an afterlife, good, if not, okay. [/quote]
I have determined that there are no facts upon which to base the conclusion that you aren’t a prostitute, meth addict, and Obama supporter; therefore, I choose to believe that you are all of the above because it amuses me to do so. Feelings over facts. See how that works?
[quote]belligerent wrote:
[quote]EmilyQ wrote:
I have determined that there are no facts upon which to base a sound conclusion, hence the only valid response is to treat it as a mystery. I’m comfortable with that as I have no particular investment in either outcome. I’m not driven to support religious beliefs or to disown them in the name of science. There is no knowing, therefore I don’t know. If there is an afterlife, good, if not, okay. [/quote]
I have determined that there are no facts upon which to base the conclusion that you aren’t a prostitute, meth addict, and Obama supporter; therefore, I choose to believe that you are one because it amuses me to do so. See how that works?[/quote]
I beg your pardon, Emily is not a meth addict.