[quote]
BabyBuster wrote:
AC1 wrote:
However, it has always been one of dana White’s goals to distinguish the UFC from wrestling. That makes me wonder if Lesnar would ever get a shot at the big time. What would it say about the UFC if a 'rastler came in there and laid waste to his heavyweights?
Are you talking about pro-wrestling or amateur wrestling he’s trying to distinguish from? Either way, Lesnar has a huge name, if he’s a good fighter, I see no reason not to give him a title shot and promote the heck out of him.[/quote]
Professional wrestling. Dana White wants to keep UFC as far from the WWE as he can.
White would probably disagree with you on promoting Lesnar just because he’s a big name. If that was the case he’d give Tito a lot more work, but obviously his personal feelings come into play there. So I have no reason to expect they wouldn’t come into play when it came time to seriously consider Lesnar.
However, if White keeps Pride up and running, I could see him signing Lesnar up over there.
[quote]Ruggerlife wrote:
In all seriousness, you have a point, and it’s not like Dana is hard up for heavyweights these days. Still if Zuffa did pick him up, they could play up his NCAA achievements and not mention the pro wrestling career.[/quote]
It would be impossible to squash his wrestling history. Not with people having discussions like this on the internet. And it would only get ramped up if Lesnar was becoming a contender.
The difference between making the olympic team and collegiate champ is similar to the difference between highschool state champ and college wrestler. While Lesnar’s size would present a problem, I fully believe Couture would outwrestle Lesnar and, that being Lesnar’s one strength(at this point in time,) it would not turn out well for him. Given time Lesnar will probably develop into a very imposing fighter, but it is too early to be talking title shots.
[quote]slimjim wrote:
The difference between making the olympic team and collegiate champ is similar to the difference between highschool state champ and college wrestler. [/quote]
Randy never made the Olympic team either. He was an alternate. Olympic experience ain’t all it’s cracked up to be in MMA. What really matters is how well a fighter can adjust his game to integrate striking and submissions.
Heck, the most successful wrestler in the history of MMA (Matt Hughes) didn’t even manage to win a national championship or make the Olympic team. He was ‘just’ an all-american.
[quote]Steve4192 wrote:
slimjim wrote:
The difference between making the olympic team and collegiate champ is similar to the difference between highschool state champ and college wrestler.
Randy never made the Olympic team either. He was an alternate. Olympic experience ain’t all it’s cracked up to be in MMA. What really matters is how well a fighter can adjust his game to integrate striking and submissions.
Heck, the most successful wrestler in the history of MMA (Matt Hughes) didn’t even manage to win a national championship or make the Olympic team. He was ‘just’ an all-american.[/quote]
At this point it is much harder to make a case for Lesnar as being adapted to the MMA game because he has not been training nearly as long as Hughes or Randy, he went from collegiate champ to “pro”-wrestling and until he has proven to have made the switch, any talk of a title shot is premature at best.
He is a LONG LONG way from a title shot. The top 12-15 current MMA heavyweights in the world would all be favored against him right now. The guy he fought was very average with a losing record in MMA bouts.
That being said, it will be interesting to follow his development (if he does develope) over the next 2-3 years. I think he has potential and has picked the right trainers, but we will see. He is certainly marketable if he is sucessful in the ring or cage.
[quote]slimjim wrote:
…until he has proven to have made the switch, any talk of a title shot is premature at best.[/quote]
Agreed.
But I’d be interested to see how he fairs against some of the good (but not great) heavyweights, such as Yoshito(?), Alexander E. (Fedor’s brother), Jeff Monson, etc…
Side Note: I don’t want to seem like I’m on his bandwagon because I have no idea how good he is. I just find him interesting since he tried to make the transition to NFL player (without playing in college) and now to MMA.
At this point it is much harder to make a case for Lesnar as being adapted to the MMA game because he has not been training nearly as long as Hughes or Randy, he went from collegiate champ to “pro”-wrestling and until he has proven to have made the switch, any talk of a title shot is premature at best.[/quote]
I completely agree.
I was just making the point that you don’t need to be a ‘world class’ wrestler to be an effective MMA takedown-and-control guy. People get way too wrapped up in Olympic medals and forget that guys like Hughes, Ortiz, and Faber have been able to dominate in MMA despite being ‘only’ all-americans (or less in Ortiz’s case).
All pro wrestlers are marketing vehicles to sell an image- and that’s it.
Calling a pro wrestler an athlete is like calling a cat a skunk.
These men…most of them…might have been able to enter some professional sport but opted for theatrics, because it pays a lot better.
Yeah some damn fools died in the ring because they came flying down from the ceiling like they were criss angel, but lacking the fuckin brains god gave a screwdriver.
Do they get hurt? yeah, an errant table edge in the face…ladder across the jaw…misjudged kick. There is zero skill involved. It’s as much skill as is involved in reading your part on a sheet of paper–" ok cena, you’re actually gonna LOSE to k-fed this time…and here’s how he’s gonna take you out.
" In actuality, cena would have broken his head and put him in a bodybag inside 10 seconds…and that might be 5 seconds too much credit I’m giving k-fed.
There are people, believe it or not, who actually believe that shit on WWE is real. They think they are really fighting and hitting eachother with crowbars and shit.
All it really is, is life-sized version of fights we used to have with he-man action figures.
Calling a pro wrestler an athlete is like calling a cat a skunk.
These men…most of them…might have been able to enter some professional sport but opted for theatrics, because it pays a lot better.
[/quote]
I couldn’t disagree more.
Prior to the MMA boom, what professional sport could an NCAA champion wrestler enter and make a decent living?
For guys like Brock Lesnar, Kurt Angle, and Sylvester Terkay, there really was no choice. They could get rich doing the wrasslin’ thing or they could get a 9-to-5 job and toil in obscurity. Does that mean they ceased being athletes because of their career choice? Did their world class athleticism just evaporate at the moment they made the decision to become wrasslers?
Of course not.
What we are seeing now is more and more collegiate wrestlers chooising the MMA career path over pro wrestling. Being able to spend time with your family and fighting for real a half-dozen times a year certainly beats living out of a suitcase and faking it 250 times per year.
[quote]USNS physique wrote:
All pro wrestlers are marketing vehicles to sell an image- and that’s it.
Calling a pro wrestler an athlete is like calling a cat a skunk.
These men…most of them…might have been able to enter some professional sport but opted for theatrics, because it pays a lot better.
Yeah some damn fools died in the ring because they came flying down from the ceiling like they were criss angel, but lacking the fuckin brains god gave a screwdriver.
Do they get hurt? yeah, an errant table edge in the face…ladder across the jaw…misjudged kick. There is zero skill involved. It’s as much skill as is involved in reading your part on a sheet of paper–" ok cena, you’re actually gonna LOSE to k-fed this time…and here’s how he’s gonna take you out.
" In actuality, cena would have broken his head and put him in a bodybag inside 10 seconds…and that might be 5 seconds too much credit I’m giving k-fed.
There are people, believe it or not, who actually believe that shit on WWE is real. They think they are really fighting and hitting eachother with crowbars and shit.
All it really is, is life-sized version of fights we used to have with he-man action figures.[/quote]
Why are some people stuck in the 50’s where its not well known and well documented that professional show wrestling is choreographed entertainment?
Sometimes I wonder if people like this guy go to a Jackie Chan movie and leave saying “OH COME ON YOU KNOW HE WASNT ACTUALLY KICKING THOSE GUYS ITS JUST ACTING STOP BELIEVING THAT HE REALLY FOUGHT 600 PEOPLE IN ONE DAY AND BEAT THEM ALL! ITS FAKE!!!”