[quote]miniross wrote:
hi, i will, but i am very fair skinned. is a sunblck allowed for “responsible worship”?[/quote]
I formally welcome you to the sun-worshipping cult. Aloha.
Yes, bring sunblock, a pair of sunglasses is recommended, and ice. One of the tenets of our new faith is that the beer must be cold. It’s kinda like a sacrament… 
Anybody else? It’s gonna be perfect weather down here in sunny Florida… the weekend’s here!
[quote]lothario1132 wrote:
stellar: So your whole life is just some big preparatory event, then, huh?
[/quote]
EXACTLY.
Not really. Man’s soul has an affinity of straying far from “home base” despite human willingness, myself included. The more slower (sinful) we realize we are, the more we understand the need to stay closer to home base (God).
lothario, it’s not God’s will for you to experience pain & torment when you come into full union with His infinite love. Jesus Christ came to save us from our fallen condition but you can’t be cured if you don’t believe you’re sick. Nobody seeks out a doctor if they believe themselves to be physically healthy. By the same token, you won’t seek out Jesus Christ because you don’t believe you suffer from the spiritual malady of sin. But just like people who feel fine & dandy for months/years, only to later learn they’ve been diagnosed as terminally ill with cancer, so too it shall be for countless men upon death in the spiritual sense.
And before you think I’m trying to convert you into some Bible-thumping fundamental pessimist, think again. You may perceive the Christian Faith as being depressing, but it’s actually the light at the end of the tunnel for many who suffer here on earth.
And the flip side to that aspect is that enough people are partying in this life, so what spiritual good would it do to encourage them to party even more? If I have a friend who feels sad, I offer to take them for a cruise, go for coffee, drink some beers, or to hit up a lounge so they can cheer up. Christianity preaches everything in moderation. Instead, because I come to admonish some of you, I’m classified as having a dreadful outlook and a gloomy disposition? I can only laugh at that.
Analogy-time:
If Tom’s at a party and runs into a friend named Jack, who’s totally wasted, and Jack wants to drive home drunk to impress some chick he’s trying to bang, should Tom let Jack drive home in that condition? At the risk of sounding self-righteous, I hung around this forum trying to be a good friend by taking away people’s keys. Like Jack will probably regard Tom as a “party-pooper” and a “downer” or a “cock-block”, it’s inevident you’d feel the same way about me. But anyways.
This dialogue between us purely boils down to faith. Thanks for allowing me to express my views and thanks for providing me with yours.
Peace be with you all!
Okay. I like the analogy. But what if Jack isn’t really wasted? That’s basically where the faith thing comes into it. You have faith, I don’t.
Once again, that question still begs an answer. And once again, I’m seeing the christian faith as fundamentally depressing or a downer or whatever. We got guys or this book telling us that we’re in for it unless we do stuff or don’t do stuff or believe in something or not believe in something. Why start off with the premise that we are all going to suffer UNLESS blah blah blah? That’s the “stained by original sin” thing as I understand it… am I right? Assuming I am, that just smacks of fearmongering to me.
Don’t get me wrong, now. I’m not saying that it’s all bad here. I like the idea of pitting yourself against some obstacle like following a path of righteousness and faith in the unknown. The challenge of sticking to your guns in spite of the things that are thrown at you is pretty cool. I’m just not buying into the suffering part.
Admit it: that’s a big part of the belief system. It’s not everything… but it’s big. I don’t see why a post-mortem punishment should have anything to do with the life you’re living now. Especially when there’s no good reason to think that it even exists. A bunch of dudes or some book aren’t convincing me to be afraid of squat. I don’t need a religion to give me hope. I don’t need anybody telling me what’s right and what’s wrong for me. I can see that fairly clearly most times just fine by myself. The times that I can’t… those times when the answers aren’t obvious… well, it’s okay to say “I don’t know”.
However, there’s still one thing that I DO know: it’s good to mack the babes at my pool.
Ummm, Lothario, you might want to focus more on the new testament than the old. The new one supersedes the old testament.
Example: God of OT sent bears to kill children who ridiculed a prohet for being bald. New OT God doesn’t do that.
Also, yeah, God is dynamic and changing. God 10 minutes from now is not how he is now. It’s a very vague and daunting subject. But thats essentially the essence.
Okay Garrett, but really, Old testament, New testament, Hamburger, Cheesburger, it’s still the same damn thing. It’s still just “do this or else”. Just like pretty much any religion that features an afterlife.
When we stop pretending that we don’t have to die when we die, then we will have made some real progress around here.
Until then, I will be getting my SPF on. The time is now for getting a good tan.
[quote]Garrett W. wrote:
Other guy…
That stuff you posted hasn’t been proven it is just a theory.[/quote]
This statement is perhaps the worst attack that can ever be made against a scientific theory. There are several things that are “just theories” which have been proven to a standard of evidence that any reasonable person must accept. I don’t think you were addressing any of them with that statement, but that doesn’t take away from the invalidity of that statement when used in a way so as to cast doubt.
[quote]
Miniross,
Would it help if I said true vaccuum? Devoid of matter, energy, dark matter, dark energy, photons, ANYTHING. Yeah, outspace is a “vaccuum”, it doesn’t have air, but it has stuff. Try starting from exactly zero and moving on from there.[/quote]
But this is exactly what modern big bang theory does…in actuality it starts from less than zero in the fact that before the initial event there exists no spacetime at all. That is the thing that I think you need to deal with first here. Spacetime itself is something! You can’t have some volume of nothing…because to have volume to measure you must already have something. Even spacetime completely devoid of any matter still MUST have the potential for some finite level of energy greater than zero, and thus the potential for particle pair generation (a phenomenon that is fairly well established). This is the result of just a basic application of the principles of quantum mechanics, namely the uncertainty principle and its relation to energy.
To truly grasp these aspects of modern science you need to have a decent working knowledge of relativity and quantum mechanics on a fundamental level. If you don’t know how spacetime really seems to work, or how energy really seems to work…it’s easy to create strawmen to convince yourself that you have a very good reason to believe a god is necessary.
Mordred: This is all old news. Fellas, quantum mechanics isn’t confusing at all. It’s very old. Try “The Dancing Wu Li Masters”, it’ll help a lot.
Well…if quantum mechanics is so old and easily understood…why is it that I have to constantly explain it to people? Just personal experience, but the majority of the people on the planet likely have very little clue about quantum mechanics. There is of course another segment of the population that thinks they understand quantum mechanics but actually has little to no idea. Reading A Brief History of Time does not make you a theoretical physicist people…
I hate it when people start slapping together Zen and QM…but I have to use this rather zen-like line now…if you think you understand quantum mechanics, you probably don’t understand quantum mechanics.
Just for some background (not that this makes any of my opinions any more valid) I have degrees in physics and computer science, and my senior year I completed a research project dealing with quantum computers, specifically the construction of an optically based quantum logic gate. I spent a year and a half in graduate school studying physics before I decided to chuck it all and become a tennis pro.
[quote]Mordred wrote:
Well…if quantum mechanics is so old and easily understood…why is it that I have to constantly explain it to people?[/quote]
Maybe because you think they care about it?
Yeah, but don’t you think it’s kinda funny that old ideas concerning the makeup of the universe present in the Hindu religion and found in Taoist writings, for example, are remarkably similar to modern quantum theory?
So why is it that you, who “have to explain it to people all the time” (paraphrasing you there) are expounding upon it now? Do you think that YOU understand quantum theory? Well… you know the rest.
Just for some background (not that this makes any of my opinions any more valid) I have degrees in physics and computer science, and my senior year I completed a research project dealing with quantum computers, specifically the construction of an optically based quantum logic gate. I spent a year and a half in graduate school studying physics before I decided to chuck it all and become a tennis pro.[/quote]
That’s very impressive. Good for you. I’m glad that you found something that you like doing instead of staying a pasty-skinned quantum mechanics-spewing melvin.
Hehehe… just f’n with ya, bro.
I guess you find similarites where you want to find them.
doesn’t necessarily mena that they are there. just look at astrology.
To Garret ? I think I?m ‘Other Guy’ ? (I?m a schizo mild mannered individual, by day; ie me, by night someone else who is also nondescript), the point about my post re ZPE was that it was a perfect vaccum (ok I?m assuming it was as perfect as one can get in a laboratory). For a layman like myself, it shows energy came from nothing, and yet didn?t break any of the newtonian or einstienian physics rules. Cool. Mordred?s stolen the rest of my thunder re QM and string theory.
And on Adam and Eve ? is anyone aware of Lilith the Queen? I?m buggered if I remember where I read it, but it was supposed to be taken from a real early bible; Old testement ? God made the first man and woman out of clay ? but the woman was too earthy, lustfull, had carnal thoughts, etc (ie was just like a man!) so god tossed her on the garbage heap and made Eve from Adam?s rib. Apparently Lilith then rejected God for this slight, and went somwhere else, and is boss of all the monsters, etc. Only one reference is of her in the modern bible, and the KJ version adulterates that:
Isaiah_ 34:14
King Jame version: Isaiah_ 34:14
The wild beasts of the desert shall also meet with the wild beasts of the island, and the satyr shall cry to his fellow; the screech owl also shall rest there, and find for herself a place of rest
Isaiah_ 34:14
The wild animals of the desert shall meet with the wolves, and the wild goat shall cry to his fellow; yes, the night-monster shall settle there, and shall find her a place of rest.
Another translation written in Modern Hebrew language:
Isaiah 34:14
Wildcats shall meet hyenas,
Goat-demons shall greet each other;
There too the lilith shall repose
And find herself a resting place.
For a bit more info
http://users.erols.com/bcccsbs/lilith1.htm
just though I?d throw this into the mix of interesting discussion. For a religion that rejects other?s mythology, it sure has some interesting roots.
On the rest of the recent thread. We?ve established that one can pray, meditate or just zone out and feel rapture, loss of time, and reach the ?ineffable oneness? regardless of one?s religious leanings. Our brains are wired in such a way as to achieve this, and it?s completely biological ? no spirituality required ? we can call it whatever we like, and no race or creed or faith has a monopoly over it ? in fact we can now purchase machines which can drop us into that state after 5mins (do a google seach on Entrainment and Photo-Stimulation and the Little Calm Machine).
Why then anymore discussion on religion? ? it?s all just a matter now of wait to die, then find out.
[quote]lothario1132 wrote:
Maybe because you think they care about it? :)[/quote]
No, I know they don’t care…I just think the state of science education in this country is a crime
I definately find it interesting, but I think it has more to do with the struggle that the human mind has with duality and how our view of matter evolved historically in the west than any profound clairvoyance of philosophy. The very fact that we discuss and view wave/particle dynamics as a duality speaks to the philosophical underpinnings of modern science as rooted in the logic of Aristotle and the line of thought that can be traced back to him.
In other words, I don’t really think it bolsters QM or eastern philosophy that there are apparent similarities
I would say I have a better than average understanding. The point really is that even people who know QM forwards and backwards, people who have studied it their whole lives can sometimes be baffled by what seems to be the easiest problem. Every time you think you’ve tamed the beast it rears up and kicks you in the nuts. You have to stay humble.
So you can imagine what it can do to people who have no formal instruction in QM or the mathematical background to make a serious study of it. The conclusions that can be drawn are really quite horrific.
[quote]That’s very impressive. Good for you. I’m glad that you found something that you like doing instead of staying a pasty-skinned quantum mechanics-spewing melvin.
Hehehe… just f’n with ya, bro.
[/quote]
Well…I’m still pasty-skinned (outside of my face, forearms, and lower legs…I have tan lines in the form of a polo shirt and short already). I think of it as a hazzard of the profession.
Good show, Mordred.
miniross: We may have to indoctrinate another brother into the cult. It sounds like Mordred here needs to do some worshipping!
[quote]lothario1132 wrote:
Good show, Mordred.
miniross: We may have to indoctrinate another brother into the cult. It sounds like Mordred here needs to do some worshipping! :)[/quote]
Lothario - Grab your Sun Cult and come to Australia. Heaps of beer, plenty of sun, and plenty of chicks in bikinis - you’ll love it. I live in Queensland (known as the Sunshine State) and have just come back from the Sunshine Coast. Sign me up!
[quote]stellar_horizon wrote:
T-chick wrote:
I think you’re missing my point - that being: There is absolutely no reason to believe the intangible force which creates the spark of life in the universe, which you may choose to call God, has any interest in humans in general and in sexual activity in particular.
You may not have a reason, but I do. My reason is that Jesus Christ, God Incarnate, preaches contrary to you. You keep your doubts. I’ll keep my Faith in the Lord and Savior.
[/quote]
Okay, I absolutely accept that there was a guy called Jesus who preached Essenian principles and was a delightful man, but what is your reason for believing he is divine, not just a regular guy? Given all the engineering of, not just the bible, but the entire Christian faith by guys like Constantine and who knows how many others?
[quote]Massif wrote:
Lothario - Grab your Sun Cult and come to Australia. Heaps of beer, plenty of sun, and plenty of chicks in bikinis - you’ll love it. I live in Queensland (known as the Sunshine State) and have just come back from the Sunshine Coast. Sign me up![/quote]
Yay! Another cultist! I’m from Florida – also known as the Sunshine State – and we got the bikinis and all that, too!
Would love to visit Australia buddy. Miniross is a bloody limey, and I’m a friggin southerner, so if we all conglomerate, we’ll have all kinds of f’d up accents when we talk.
P.S. I started using the term “salad dodger” over here. That is entirely your fault.
[quote]lothario1132 wrote:
Massif wrote:
Lothario - Grab your Sun Cult and come to Australia. Heaps of beer, plenty of sun, and plenty of chicks in bikinis - you’ll love it. I live in Queensland (known as the Sunshine State) and have just come back from the Sunshine Coast. Sign me up!
Yay! Another cultist! I’m from Florida – also known as the Sunshine State – and we got the bikinis and all that, too!
Would love to visit Australia buddy. Miniross is a bloody limey, and I’m a friggin southerner, so if we all conglomerate, we’ll have all kinds of f’d up accents when we talk.
P.S. I started using the term “salad dodger” over here. That is entirely your fault.
[/quote]
Salad Dodger rocks!!
Small hijack -
I heard another description for fatties the other day. A friend of mine stated that this chick was so fat, she had “an ass like two plastic bags full of custard”.
Love it.
End hijack
Should we start this as a new thread…?
I am sitting here and it is pissing it down.
shame, we had a lovely weekend.
i was on my roof sacrifycing next doors tabby cat to the sun god.
must have annoyed the rain god. he is strong in the UK. to make the balance, i am off to find the next doors rottweiller. wish me luck!
[quote]lothario1132 wrote:
Massif wrote:
Lothario - Grab your Sun Cult and come to Australia. Heaps of beer, plenty of sun, and plenty of chicks in bikinis - you’ll love it. I live in Queensland (known as the Sunshine State) and have just come back from the Sunshine Coast. Sign me up!
Yay! Another cultist! I’m from Florida – also known as the Sunshine State – and we got the bikinis and all that, too!
Would love to visit Australia buddy. Miniross is a bloody limey, and I’m a friggin southerner, so if we all conglomerate, we’ll have all kinds of f’d up accents when we talk.
P.S. I started using the term “salad dodger” over here. That is entirely your fault.
[/quote]
We Dont have many bikinis over here, and seeing the state of young women, thats no bad thing, the fat slags.
Australi/NZ for me, my GF is doing physio and i am trying to talk her into moving!
[quote]Massif wrote:
I heard another description for fatties the other day. A friend of mine stated that this chick was so fat, she had “an ass like two plastic bags full of custard”.
Love it.
End hijack[/quote]
Ah yes, another “Jabba the Butt”. How I love to hate them.