Jesse Ventura ?'s 9/11 Story

Off Topic Politics and World Issues
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He needs a tin foil hat…right???

Former Governor Jesse Ventura Questions Official 9/11 Story
Goes further than ever before, cites Northwoods, Gulf of Tonkin, NORAD stand down, staged war provocations

Former Minnesota Governor, actor and wrestling star Jesse Ventura has publicly questioned the official version of events behind 9/11 and gone further than ever before in citing Operation Northwoods and the Gulf of Tonkin as examples of how the government has planned and carried out staged war provocations in the past.

Ventura has temporarily left his Baja Mexico surfing lifestyle to lend support to Texas gubernatorial candidate Kinky Friedman. At a press conference yesterday
http://www.casperstartribune.net/articles/2006/09/26/ap/politics/d8kcepp00.txt
Ventura said that the Republicans and Democrats were “destroying our country” and its political process. Sporting a beard and dreadlocks, the former Vietnam veteran also criticized the Iraq war.

Alex Jones and his film crew were able to set up a last minute interview with Ventura at a San Antonio restaurant after his appearance before a packed house at UTSA.

Ventura first stated that he had many unanswered questions about 9/11. The former Governor cited Operation Northwoods

, a 1963 Joint Chiefs of Staff plan to stage terror attacks and kill American citizens to start a war with Cuba, as an example of how the U.S. government wanted to kill its own people and blame it on foreign enemies to justify war. Ventura found it painful, having dutifully served himself, that elements within the government would go to such barbaric and deceitful lengths to con its own populace into supporting militarism.

Ventura then raised the issue of the Gulf of Tonkin, citing recently released declassified information
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB132/tapes.htm
confirming that American ships were never attacked and the incident was manufactured in order to provide the entree to the Vietnam war. This was particularly unpalatable for Ventura because he joined as a Navy Seal on September 11 1969, fought in Vietnam and lost many friends there.

Ventura asked that if the U.S. government were prepared to stage such a gargantuan historical event in terms of its significance in leading a nation to war then, why they would they refrain from doing so again today?

Ventura also highlighted 9/11 itself in contrasting the lax response of NORAD air defense to the four commercial airliners on 9/11 compared with the immediate interception of golfer Payne Stewart’s Lear Jet in October 1999.

Ventura said that the argument that Americans should give up liberty in exchange for security in the war on terror was horrible and that government should never be trusted. He encouraged Americans to be skeptical of anything the government claims in light of their past duplicity.

Ventura seemed visibly upset during the interview, calling the American public apathetic, seemingly wanting to say more, and was very cynical that any real investigation would take place having already witnessed the 9/11 Commission’s whitewash.

Ventura had previously aired his skepticism of the official version of events on Jay Leno and elaborated on a 2004 radio show but the former Governor went further than ever before during this interview.

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The Body? Then it must be true!

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[quote]jlesk68 wrote:
Ventura also highlighted 9/11 itself in contrasting the lax response of NORAD air defense to the four commercial airliners on 9/11 compared with the immediate interception of golfer Payne Stewart’s Lear Jet in October 1999.

[/quote]

See, why do people state ‘facts’ they’ve read off some conspiracy site? They just keep repeating each other’s misinformation.

It took roughly 76 minutes to intercept Stewart’s Jet. Note the change in time zones when you read the link. There was nothing at all “immediate” about that intercept.
www.ntsb.gov/Publictn/2000/AAB0001.htm

"At 0933:38 EDT (6 minutes and 20 seconds after N47BA acknowledged the previous clearance), the controller instructed N47BA to change radio frequencies and contact another Jacksonville ARTCC controller. The controller received no response from N47BA. The controller called the flight five more times over the next 4 1/2 minutes but received no response.

About 0952 CDT,7 a USAF F-16 test pilot from the 40th Flight Test Squadron at Eglin Air Force Base (AFB), Florida, was vectored to within 8 nm of N47BA. About 0954 CDT, at a range of 2,000 feet from the accident airplane and an altitude of about 46,400 feet, the test pilot made two radio calls to N47BA but did not receive a response".

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[quote]Sloth wrote:
See, why do people state ‘facts’ they’ve read off some conspiracy site? They just keep repeating each other’s misinformation.

It took roughly 76 minutes to intercept Stewart’s Jet. Note the change in time zones when you read the link. There was nothing at all “immediate” about that intercept.
www.ntsb.gov/Publictn/2000/AAB0001.htm

"At 0933:38 EDT (6 minutes and 20 seconds after N47BA acknowledged the previous clearance), the controller instructed N47BA to change radio frequencies and contact another Jacksonville ARTCC controller. The controller received no response from N47BA. The controller called the flight five more times over the next 4 1/2 minutes but received no response.

About 0952 CDT,7 a USAF F-16 test pilot from the 40th Flight Test Squadron at Eglin Air Force Base (AFB), Florida, was vectored to within 8 nm of N47BA. About 0954 CDT, at a range of 2,000 feet from the accident airplane and an altitude of about 46,400 feet, the test pilot made two radio calls to N47BA but did not receive a response".

[/quote]

That was a private jet not a commercial airliner. Payne’s jet didnt dissapear off the radar, the hijacked planes on 9/11 did. Two COMPLETELY different situations.

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[quote]PGA200X wrote:
Sloth wrote:
See, why do people state ‘facts’ they’ve read off some conspiracy site? They just keep repeating each other’s misinformation.

It took roughly 76 minutes to intercept Stewart’s Jet. Note the change in time zones when you read the link. There was nothing at all “immediate” about that intercept.
www.ntsb.gov/Publictn/2000/AAB0001.htm

"At 0933:38 EDT (6 minutes and 20 seconds after N47BA acknowledged the previous clearance), the controller instructed N47BA to change radio frequencies and contact another Jacksonville ARTCC controller. The controller received no response from N47BA. The controller called the flight five more times over the next 4 1/2 minutes but received no response.

About 0952 CDT,7 a USAF F-16 test pilot from the 40th Flight Test Squadron at Eglin Air Force Base (AFB), Florida, was vectored to within 8 nm of N47BA. About 0954 CDT, at a range of 2,000 feet from the accident airplane and an altitude of about 46,400 feet, the test pilot made two radio calls to N47BA but did not receive a response".

That was a private jet not a commercial airliner. Payne’s jet didnt dissapear off the radar, the hijacked planes on 9/11 did. Two COMPLETELY different situations.[/quote]

You’ll note that I didn’t make the initial comparison. And, your statement supports the idea that the Airliners would have been even harder to find and intercept.

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Jessie “The Mind” has every reason to think what he wants. I myself think the Gulf of Tonkin incident was a pure fabrication. Watch the movie Fog of War. In this documentary Robert Macnamara talks quite a bit about the incident and how Our leaders at the time overreated to get us into Vietnam.

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[quote]Skystud wrote:
Jessie “The Mind” has every reason to think what he wants. I myself think the Gulf of Tonkin incident was a pure fabrication. Watch the movie Fog of War. In this documentary Robert Macnamara talks quite a bit about the incident and how Our leaders at the time overreated to get us into Vietnam.[/quote]

You need to brush up on your history. We were already in Viet Nam - helping out the French. The Gulf of Tonkin was used to escalate our involvement.

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Is this the kind of guy that would say something outrageous just to keep himself in the public eye?

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“Ventura seemed visibly upset during the interview, calling the American public apathetic”

This much you have to agree with. The American public knows more about the menu @ McDonalds than anything that may affect the future of the country.

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“Those that can’t beat the donkey, beat the saddle.”

— old Italian proverb

You figure it out.

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[quote]rainjack wrote:
Skystud wrote:
Jessie “The Mind” has every reason to think what he wants. I myself think the Gulf of Tonkin incident was a pure fabrication. Watch the movie Fog of War. In this documentary Robert Macnamara talks quite a bit about the incident and how Our leaders at the time overreated to get us into Vietnam.

You need to brush up on your history. We were already in Viet Nam - helping out the French. The Gulf of Tonkin was used to escalate our involvement.

[/quote]

Uh, no. The french were already out. We had advisers there, but not 150,000 troops that were put there after the Gulf of Tonkin incident. I think you need to brush up on your history.

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I agree with a few of Ventura’s points, and I agree largely with his sentiments vis-a-vis government; however, I just don’t think those in control of this government are capable of pulling off such a massive deception (and thus far, pretty much all of the evidence presented in support of such a conspiracy has been bunk).

I think he’s giving our government too much credit–as do most conspiracy theorists.

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[quote]Skystud wrote:

Uh, no. The french were already out. We had advisers there, but not 150,000 troops that were put there after the Gulf of Tonkin incident. I think you need to brush up on your history.[/quote]

Key point here sparky - we were already there. Tonkin was an opportunity to escalate our involvement - not “get us over there”.

Next time you google something you know nothing about - read a little more on the subject than you think you need to.

Now try it again.

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[quote]Skystud wrote:
rainjack wrote:
Skystud wrote:
Jessie “The Mind” has every reason to think what he wants. I myself think the Gulf of Tonkin incident was a pure fabrication. Watch the movie Fog of War. In this documentary Robert Macnamara talks quite a bit about the incident and how Our leaders at the time overreated to get us into Vietnam.

You need to brush up on your history. We were already in Viet Nam - helping out the French. The Gulf of Tonkin was used to escalate our involvement.

Uh, no. The french were already out. We had advisers there, but not 150,000 troops that were put there after the Gulf of Tonkin incident. I think you need to brush up on your history.[/quote]

Good thing RJ does not teach history.

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[quote]Marmadogg wrote:

Uh, no. The french were already out. We had advisers there, but not 150,000 troops that were put there after the Gulf of Tonkin incident. I think you need to brush up on your history.

Good thing RJ does not teach history.[/quote]

Libs can’t handle the truth. So, in that sense and by your example, you are correct. He’d want to strangle you all.

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[quote]rainjack wrote:
Skystud wrote:
Jessie “The Mind” has every reason to think what he wants. I myself think the Gulf of Tonkin incident was a pure fabrication. Watch the movie Fog of War. In this documentary Robert Macnamara talks quite a bit about the incident and how Our leaders at the time overreated to get us into Vietnam.

You need to brush up on your history. We were already in Viet Nam - helping out the French. The Gulf of Tonkin was used to escalate our involvement.

[/quote]

Ummmm…wrong…the French were gone by then. We had already had troops in a ‘support’ mission but nothing as large as the numbers on the ground after the Gulf of Tonkin “incident”. Please, don’t jump to discount someone’s opinion by mistating facts!!

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[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
rainjack wrote:
Skystud wrote:
Jessie “The Mind” has every reason to think what he wants. I myself think the Gulf of Tonkin incident was a pure fabrication. Watch the movie Fog of War. In this documentary Robert Macnamara talks quite a bit about the incident and how Our leaders at the time overreated to get us into Vietnam.

You need to brush up on your history. We were already in Viet Nam - helping out the French. The Gulf of Tonkin was used to escalate our involvement.

Ummmm…wrong…the French were gone by then. We had already had troops in a ‘support’ mission but nothing as large as the numbers on the ground after the Gulf of Tonkin “incident”. Please, don’t jump to discount someone’s opinion by mistating facts!!
[/quote]

I think you guys need help with your reading comprehension.

RJ did not say the French were there at the time of the Tonkin incident.

He said we already had troops there because we went over to help the French. The French abandoned ship and left us trying to prop up the country under the communist onslaught. Thanks France.

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[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
You need to brush up on your history. We were already in Viet Nam - helping out the French. The Gulf of Tonkin was used to escalate our involvement.

Ummmm…wrong…the French were gone by then. We had already had troops in a ‘support’ mission but nothing as large as the numbers on the ground after the Gulf of Tonkin “incident”. Please, don’t jump to discount someone’s opinion by mistating facts!!
[/quote]

Umm, did you read what RJ wrote? He said the US had a presence there to originally assist the French, then used the Gulf of Tonkin incident to escalate our presence there. How does that contradict what you said?

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[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
rainjack wrote:
Skystud wrote:
Jessie “The Mind” has every reason to think what he wants. I myself think the Gulf of Tonkin incident was a pure fabrication. Watch the movie Fog of War. In this documentary Robert Macnamara talks quite a bit about the incident and how Our leaders at the time overreated to get us into Vietnam.

You need to brush up on your history. We were already in Viet Nam - helping out the French. The Gulf of Tonkin was used to escalate our involvement.

Ummmm…wrong…the French were gone by then. We had already had troops in a ‘support’ mission but nothing as large as the numbers on the ground after the Gulf of Tonkin “incident”. Please, don’t jump to discount someone’s opinion by mistating facts!!
[/quote]

What I said was the truth. I misstated nothing. Zap and Thunder understood what I said. Why can’t you or Marm?

Let me type slower. We had troops in country. Call them “advisors” if it makes you feel better. The French turned tail and ran after 10-12 years or so and left us there. We were there. Let me say that again - WE WERE THERE. Then came Tonkin. Then came the escalation.

Now really…how hard is that to understand? Do I need to use liberal anti-war buzz words to be understood?

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[quote]rainjack wrote:
Skystud wrote:
Jessie “The Mind” has every reason to think what he wants. I myself think the Gulf of Tonkin incident was a pure fabrication. Watch the movie Fog of War. In this documentary Robert Macnamara talks quite a bit about the incident and how Our leaders at the time overreated to get us into Vietnam.

You need to brush up on your history. We were already in Viet Nam - helping out the French. The Gulf of Tonkin was used to escalate our involvement.

[/quote]

…“The Gulf of Tonkin was used to escalate our involvement”. Exactly!