I’ve read this on several places on the forum and Im interested to understand how it works.
In what way the anti - androgen effects of DIM are expressed? Is it harmful for men on TRT, for their libido, does it inhibit the functions of testosterone or DHT?
I found only studies that it has anti prostate cancer effect and anti-cancerous effect at all that doesnt seem bad.
Is taking Indole-3-Carbinol any different than taking DIM?
No its not.
Zinc is also not an effective aromatase inhibitor (at normal dose).
In fact I found something.
“Using fluorescence imaging with green fluorescent protein androgen receptor and Western blot analysis, we demonstrated that DIM inhibited androgen-induced androgen receptor (AR) translocation into the nucleus. Results of receptor binding assays indicated further that DIM is a strong competitive inhibitor of DHT binding to the AR. Results of structural modeling studies showed that DIM is remarkably similar in conformational geometry and surface charge distribution to an established synthetic AR antagonist, although the atomic compositions of the two substances are quite different. Taken together with our published reports of the estrogen agonist activities of DIM, the present results establish DIM as a unique bifunctional hormone disrupter. To our knowledge, DIM is the first example of a pure androgen receptor antagonist from plants.”
If you want to eat 1kg of brussels sprouts per day to get any effect than maybe. But theoretically you can also die from 25kg of bananas due to hyperkalemia
I was thinking about 200mg DIM or Indole-3-Carbinol supplement what is the standard serving of it
So are on TRT because of symptoms of androgen deficiency and want to take a high enough dose of a substance that potentially work as an antiandrogen? Hmmm
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This was my original question, does it work this way?
Vonko, I started TRT in June and have been running DIM the entire time. I have never had any bloat, water retention or any estrogen related sides. My pre trt blood showed my E2 at 30 and my total t at 610. I was high SHBG. My follow up bloods at week 15 or so showed my E2 at 31 and total T close to 1200. I do not know if DIM is the reason I never aromatized to E2 or if its just the way my body works but I continue to take it. On TRT my libido is insane and DIM has not diminished that.
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Good feedback. Thanks
So you also started TRT with 600 total t? How high was your SHBG?
SHBH was 68 and I think my free t was 8 or so
Similar here
Are you actually experiencing real side effects you think trying to reduce/better clear estrogen will help?
I’ve read HCG could also cause issues with estrogen.
Your mind just won’t let you stay on testosterone only for 8-10 weeks and see how you feel there. Why are you adding these things? Maybe ask your famed TRT doctor what he thinks of DIM and take his advice?
Keep it simple and be patient.
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How would you know, if you have taken DIM the entire time while on TRT?
Prior to TRT my libido sucked… Started TRT with DIM and my libido is insane. I guess your right… but if DIM is diminishing my libido I honestly cant fathom it getting higher without DIM.
I did some intensive research and it turns out that DIM is a powerful anti androgen if combined with lowering your sustanone dose.
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I was waiting for the post where, 6 weeks in to your very first protocol, you already want to start adding stuff.
DIM crashes my libido within three days.
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Ive taken it before, it did not crash it and for many other guys havent as well. I’ve taken i3c that is the dim’s precursor.
What you have written to experience with many things crushing your libido for three days, Ive experienced with many things myself, but in my case this is just initial reaction of the organism to the new compound. I had my libido crashed when I started fish oil, when I started metformin, multivitamins and etc. I’ve also felt more anxiety from them initially, sleep disturbances for some and so on. The worst is when I start a new type of magnesium I’ve never taken before. When I stick to them for 2-3 weeks I stop feeling anything unusual and these substances just do on the background what they are intended to do. Except metformin, which makes me less hungry but this is off-topic.
DIM is complicated as it can be both pro and anti estrogenic and also anti Androgenic but this might be only in the Prostate. It also has an effect on inhibiting mTor which could be even worse as inhibiting mTor will prevent protein synthesis and muscle growth. But yet again it also can do both things here depending on the path it takes it can do the opposite and inhibit cortisol. It’s signals Myostatin in some way to either prevent muscle wasting or promote it. Soooooo
In the name of science I will do an experiment for all of us. I’m starting back at the gym Saturday after a 6 month brake due to an injury.
If my gains don’t come back good as they always do then DIM loses
If I get all my muscles back big and thick like before and quick then DIM stays. Because it’s benefits on clearing bad estrogen metabolites and positive effects on Prostate are worth it.
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