Intermittent Fasting: Martin Berkhan

Dolce · July 20, 2010, 2:04am

[quote]Dolce wrote:

To tell you the truth, I’ve been “cutting”, using a carb cycling diet, since the middle of February however I’ve had quite a few “breaks” since then. My birthday was in April, and a planned “refeed birthday dinner” turned into an all out gorge fest for 2.5 weeks. That really set me back, lol. I’ve also had the same situation happen a few times but for not as long, just a few days.

I didn’t start IF till around May and I’ve been much better at staying compliant with dieting. The reason is because I get so full from what I eat post workout, that I don’t feel the need to gorge out on junkfood.

So its difficult for me to say how long I’ve actually been on a steady diet. If I had to guess, I’d say I have about 10-12 weeks worth of successful dieting.

I don’t really count specific macros. I sorta have a rough idea of what I’m eating. I make sure to get enough protein and fat on off days and enough carbs on workout days. I’ll probably have to dial this in very soon, but for now I’m riding it out, because my weight keeps dropping and my strength is staying stable.

To give you an idea of what I eat:

On workout days carbs are high-very high, protein is moderate-low moderate, and fat is just a couple fish oil.

A sample workout day would look like this:

Meal 1: 3 cups of brown rice, stirfry vegetables, 2 chicken breasts, 2 fish oil

Meal 2 (pre/peri workout): 2 scoops SWF, 4 scoops anaconda, 1 scoop MAG-10

Meal 3 (post workout): 1 banana, 1 scoop whey

Meal 4: 5 cups brown rice, kimchee (can’t eat this earlier in the day or no one will talk to me), 2 chicken breasts, yogurt with frozen fruit

On nonworkout days carbs are low, protein is high, and fat is moderate.

Meal 1: Two grass-fed NY strip steaks, 2 cups vegetables, 1 large baked potato

Meal 2: 2 scoops whey, 5 fish oil

Meal 3: 3 chicken breasts, 2 cups vegetables, 2 servings natty PB or walnuts, 5 fish oil
[/quote]

I train 3 days a week, M W F, using a 4 day split. I’ve been using 5/3/1- squat, standing military, deadlift, incline bench press.

forbes · July 20, 2010, 2:10am

[quote]Dolce wrote:

To tell you the truth, I’ve been “cutting”, using a carb cycling diet, since the middle of February however I’ve had quite a few “breaks” since then. My birthday was in April, and a planned “refeed birthday dinner” turned into an all out gorge fest for 2.5 weeks. That really set me back, lol. I’ve also had the same situation happen a few times but for not as long, just a few days.

I didn’t start IF till around May and I’ve been much better at staying compliant with dieting. The reason is because I get so full from what I eat post workout, that I don’t feel the need to gorge out on junkfood.

So its difficult for me to say how long I’ve actually been on a steady diet. If I had to guess, I’d say I have about 10-12 weeks worth of successful dieting.

I don’t really count specific macros. I sorta have a rough idea of what I’m eating. I make sure to get enough protein and fat on off days and enough carbs on workout days. I’ll probably have to dial this in very soon, but for now I’m riding it out, because my weight keeps dropping and my strength is staying stable.

To give you an idea of what I eat:

On workout days carbs are high-very high, protein is moderate-low moderate, and fat is just a couple fish oil.

A sample workout day would look like this:

Meal 1: 3 cups of brown rice, stirfry vegetables, 2 chicken breasts, 2 fish oil

Meal 2 (pre/peri workout): 2 scoops SWF, 4 scoops anaconda, 1 scoop MAG-10

Meal 3 (post workout): 1 banana, 1 scoop whey

Meal 4: 5 cups brown rice, kimchee (can’t eat this earlier in the day or no one will talk to me), 2 chicken breasts, yogurt with frozen fruit

On nonworkout days carbs are low, protein is high, and fat is moderate.

Meal 1: Two grass-fed NY strip steaks, 2 cups vegetables, 1 large baked potato

Meal 2: 2 scoops whey, 5 fish oil

Meal 3: 3 chicken breasts, 2 cups vegetables, 2 servings natty PB or walnuts, 5 fish oil
[/quote]

I train 3 days a week, M W F, using a 4 day split. I’ve been using 5/3/1- squat, standing military, deadlift, incline bench press.[/quote]

Sorry, I must’ve missed that. What are your calorie averages for both rest and workout days if you dont mind sharing?

tworkinhard · July 20, 2010, 2:43am

[quote]Dolce wrote:

I train 3 days a week, M W F, using a 4 day split. I’ve been using 5/3/1- squat, standing military, deadlift, incline bench press.[/quote]

Excellent cut man, looks like you held onto all of your size too… I’m doing the same program, using flat bench instead of incline. Did you lose any strength during course of your diet?

Dolce · July 20, 2010, 3:35am

[quote]forbes wrote:

Sorry, I must’ve missed that. What are your calorie averages for both rest and workout days if you dont mind sharing?[/quote]

Don’t really know. If I had to guess I’d say training days = 2500-3000 calories, and non training days 2000-2500. I try to do steady state cardio or walking a few times a week.

Dolce · July 20, 2010, 3:47am

[quote]tworkinhard wrote:

Excellent cut man, looks like you held onto all of your size too… I’m doing the same program, using flat bench instead of incline. Did you lose any strength during course of your diet?[/quote]

thanks dude. i actually hurt my back pretty bad when I first started cutting. i just over did it. squatting really heavy and deep with a tad bit of pelvic tilt in the hole combined with working on my car and I couldn’t flex my lower back for a week or so. so my strength in that tanked. went from a personal best of 325x8 to 275x10- two weeks ago I did 315x9 which I was happy with though.

i also started working a full time job for the first time around this same time, so waking up early really screwed with my training. i’m just now starting to get close to what I was pre cut, strength wise. another thing that tanked was my military press. my best strict military was 170x 7. I started cutting/ work and it dropped to 175x3 the next week, lol. my deadlift is the only thing that’s stayed fairly consistent.

my body and brain really doesn’t like going from all out eating to restricted calories. i think it really switches to survival mode and i initially lose strength more than i’d like. that’s one thing that’s cool about IF- the big meals are mentally satisfying and i believe that’s one reason why i’ve been able to put some strength back on recently.

i can’t wait to start bumping up the calories though. i’m going to try and do my best not to get fat like i did before. probably will be IF’n here and there and throwing in a couple cardio sessions a week.

ADvanced_TS · July 20, 2010, 12:16pm

Wanted to be leaner? You’re pretty fucking lean if you ask me, considering I can see striations in your quads.

Congrats on the cut. I’ve been hovering around 9-11% since getting off of the RFL diet. I’ve dialed in the cardio and the cals for IF and hope to be at 7-8%% by the end of August.

Dolce · July 20, 2010, 1:52pm

thanks man. my limbs (arms and quads) always tend to stay fairly lean compared to the rest of my body. right now, most of my fat is concentrated on my lower stomach, lower back and hamstrings.

what are you doing for lifting? you should definitely be able to drop a few bf%'s in a little over a month.

i REALLY need to start waking up earlier and doing cardio/ walking but until my sleep improves, i think sleep takes priority.

ethanwest · July 20, 2010, 2:17pm

Dolce, awesome progress man. That’s a great transformation, and you’ve got killer muscle mass even after that massive cut. Huge quads. I’ve been following this thread and reading more and more about IF and it’s really getting me interested. I think it seems like a great maintenance diet.

I have a real bad habit of fattening up after a diet. I can cut pretty well and keep motivation, but I can’t seem to maintain it because I love sitting down and crushing a huge ribeye more often than I should.

By the way, where do you work out? I live in Arlington, pretty close to you I would assume (depending where in Maryland). Looking for some more hardcore gyms than Gold’s.

ADvanced_TS · July 20, 2010, 2:24pm

[quote]Dolce wrote:
thanks man. my limbs (arms and quads) always tend to stay fairly lean compared to the rest of my body. right now, most of my fat is concentrated on my lower stomach, lower back and hamstrings.

what are you doing for lifting? you should definitely be able to drop a few bf%'s in a little over a month.

i REALLY need to start waking up earlier and doing cardio/ walking but until my sleep improves, i think sleep takes priority. [/quote]

I’m doing a push-pull with 5RM on compound exercises, Mon-Fri with a 15 min jog after each workout. One week I have 3 pushes, the next I have 3 pulls.

I want to keep the fat loss slow an steady for the next month to minimize muscle loss. While I love the RFL, I did lose some muscle while on it.

tworkinhard · July 20, 2010, 2:53pm

[quote]Dolce wrote:

i can’t wait to start bumping up the calories though. i’m going to try and do my best not to get fat like i did before. probably will be IF’n here and there and throwing in a couple cardio sessions a week.
[/quote]

Same here. This winter I’m going to bulk ala Leangains, trying to gain “pure” LBM, or as close to it as possible. Relative strength and the mirror will be my markers for success. That is, trying to gain strength in major compound exersizes (bench, squat, deads, O.H. press and their variations) while SLOWLY gaining a couple pounds. I’m trying to get to the holy grail of 2.5x B.W. deadlifts, 2x B.W. squats, 1.5 - 1.75x B.W. Bench, 1.5 B.W. Pull Ups. Tougher than it looks for a tall, lanky gent like myself.

tworkinhard · July 20, 2010, 2:58pm

[quote]ADvanced TS wrote:

I’m doing a push-pull with 5RM on compound exercises, Mon-Fri with a 15 min jog after each workout. One week I have 3 pushes, the next I have 3 pulls.

I want to keep the fat loss slow an steady for the next month to minimize muscle loss. While I love the RFL, I did lose some muscle while on it.
[/quote]

Do you find that jogging competes with your squat? I actually enjoy running, but have decided to eliminate it cause my squat numbers take a serious shit when I run any more than 8-10 mi. a week…

ADvanced_TS · July 20, 2010, 3:40pm

[quote]tworkinhard wrote:

[quote]ADvanced TS wrote:

I’m doing a push-pull with 5RM on compound exercises, Mon-Fri with a 15 min jog after each workout. One week I have 3 pushes, the next I have 3 pulls.

I want to keep the fat loss slow an steady for the next month to minimize muscle loss. While I love the RFL, I did lose some muscle while on it.
[/quote]

Do you find that jogging competes with your squat? I actually enjoy running, but have decided to eliminate it cause my squat numbers take a serious shit when I run any more than 8-10 mi. a week…
[/quote]

Prepare yourself…I don’t squat.

Mutiple disc injuries, its not worth it anymore. I let leg presses and deathlifts take care of my leg work. Deads have successfully de-compressed my spine to a point where I’m not in constant pain anymore, no sense recompressing it with heavy squats.

I just incorporated the jogging because with diet and weight training I couldn’t seem to break past the 9% bf mark. I used to run alot in the Marine Corps (involuntarily), but now I actually do enjoy short jogs, 15-20 min.

Dolce · July 20, 2010, 5:33pm

[quote]ethanwest wrote:
Dolce, awesome progress man. That’s a great transformation, and you’ve got killer muscle mass even after that massive cut. Huge quads. I’ve been following this thread and reading more and more about IF and it’s really getting me interested. I think it seems like a great maintenance diet.

I have a real bad habit of fattening up after a diet. I can cut pretty well and keep motivation, but I can’t seem to maintain it because I love sitting down and crushing a huge ribeye more often than I should.

By the way, where do you work out? I live in Arlington, pretty close to you I would assume (depending where in Maryland). Looking for some more hardcore gyms than Gold’s.[/quote]

I feel you on fattening up after a diet. I’ve never successfully cut and maintained leaness. In the past, as soon as I start to see my ab’s I’m like “fuck it” and eat a ton of food for a few weeks. I attribute this as the reason why I haven’t made much progress in gaining muscle mass in the past 3-4 years due to see-sawing. However, THIS time is different. I’ve learned from my mistakes, and I know my body better than ever and i keep learning.

I live about 30 miles N/E from Baltimore so I’m a ways from you. There’s a couple gym’s in DC that you might find decent. I went to school at College Park and worked as a personal trainer in DC for about half a year.

I’d be careful of too much volume while you’re on restricted cals. I’ve made the mistake before and have really cut my training back while I’m cutting. 3 days a week works good for me, however I don’t have that great of recovery capacity- even when bulking.

try trap bar if you have access to one. its a great squat alternative if you use a little more knee flexion. its a lot easier to keep a neutral spine compared to conventional squats and deads. my gym has one, and i also bought one for my house for 169.00 shipped from jesupgymequipment.

as for getting past the 9% mark, try steady state fasted cardio keeping your heart rate around 120. work up to 60 minutes on off days. this won’t sacrifice strength and will help increase blood flow to subcutaneous fat.

[quote]
Same here. This winter I’m going to bulk ala Leangains, trying to gain “pure” LBM, or as close to it as possible. Relative strength and the mirror will be my markers for success. That is, trying to gain strength in major compound exersizes (bench, squat, deads, O.H. press and their variations) while SLOWLY gaining a couple pounds. I’m trying to get to the holy grail of 2.5x B.W. deadlifts, 2x B.W. squats, 1.5 - 1.75x B.W. Bench, 1.5 B.W. Pull Ups. Tougher than it looks for a tall, lanky gent like myself. [/quote]

same here man. those are pretty much my goals as well, in addition to putting on as much LBM as possible with little fat gain.

in regards to your question on running, i would personally try to space running as far away from your squat training as possible. running is pretty hard to recover from, and when you throw that into the mix with heavy weight training and restricted cals, decreases in strength are pretty common.

ethanwest · July 20, 2010, 5:53pm

[quote]Dolce wrote:
I attribute this as the reason why I haven’t made much progress in gaining muscle mass in the past 3-4 years due to see-sawing. However, THIS time is different. I’ve learned from my mistakes, and I know my body better than ever and i keep learning.
[/quote]

Yeah I’m in the same boat. I think I’ve finally learned enough to maintain a healthier lifestyle. I’m real bad about trying to diet too quickly as soon as I start fattening up, and it ends up having bad consequences. This time I’m doing a real slow cut. I’m trying to eat very close to a maintenance diet and pack on muscle while very slowly trimming away body fat. It seems to be working a lot better because I don’t feel the urge to binge on the weekends. My only real problem is too much drinking on weekends. Three nights in a row of heavy drinking can put a significant drain on progress, haha.

I would definitely agree. I ran way too much last year while trying to train at the same time on my summer cut and ended up with no energy, low t-levels, and higher body fat because I was crushing my muscle mass.

ADvanced_TS · July 20, 2010, 6:14pm