I Feel Best on a Protocol That Puts Me Above Range. Advice?

Pharma TRT
1

So ive tried a few dosing protocols and have a journal where I log the side effects after 6-12 weeks.

20mg eod puts me at

Total Testosterone 830 ng/dl (250-1100)

Free Testosterone (151 pg/mL (35.0-155.0)

Sensitive Estradiol 27 pgmL (< or = 29)

I feel flat and low energy… also irritable on this dose… like a slightly better version of when I was hypogonadal pre testosterone, despite my bloodwork looking great . it sucks.

at 25mg eod My bloodwork is

Total Testosterone 907 ng/dl (250-1100)

Free Testosterone (167 pg/mL (35.0-155.0)

Sensitive Estradiol 44 pgmL (< or = 29)

Feel a little better but almost like Im teetering on the edge of feeling good some days and feeling bad other days.

at 30 mg eod my bloodwork is

Total Testosterone 1257 ng/dl (250-1100)

Free Testosterone (226 pg/mL (46-224)

Sensitive Estradiol 61 pgmL (< or = 29)

Here I feel amazing… 0 anxiety, Perfect sleep, libido and erection quality, high energy, and I can actually wake up and get out of bed without feeling like Im wearing a weighted vest.

However my bloodwork is in supra physiological territory so this concerns me. I rn this dose for 8 months and got bloodwork. my hematocrit and hemoglobin were fine ( 45.6 HCT and 15.6 Hemoglobin). along with my other health markers. is it a bad idea to run my TRT this high?

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This is the number I’d focus on. 200-300pg is fine

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Listen to your body, if you feel unwell on the other two protocols, this is telling you that’s unhealthy.

The top and bottom 1% of the population are excluded from the normal ranges, so you may not necessarily be supraphysiological.

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4

Hi,
The free T range changed between protocols. Was it a typo ?

Where were your levels set before the replacement ?

5

I’m in the same boat as you. I feel best just above “normal” range. Docor is letting me stay there as long as bloodwork looks good. Are you going to a clinic or self administer?

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Got a discount for a TRT bloodwork package on Discounted labs. Was unaware that the Free Testosterone test had a different range until after the fact… unfortunately.

7

Im going through a HRT clinic. How long have you been on this protocol? How is your HCT?

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A key thing to note is that my erection quality was perfect at 30 mg eod.
For the other 2 doses it was mediocre and experienced a lack of sensation.

My theory is that I do better with an E2 reading of above 50, but I need higher T levels to achieve it. Another piece of evidence that supports this theory is the fact that When I was dosing twice a week back in the day, my Total T was 1300 ng/dL and my E2 was 40… but my erection quality was awful. at 30 mg eod my Total T is 1200 and my E2 is 60, yet my erection quality is great.

9

I have been on TRT since last july. Started at 200mg/wk in one shot and then split into 2. HCT has been 45-52. That was with a Total test of 1337. I went to 160mg/wk split ion 2 shots. Latest blood test from last week has total test at 1147 and HCT at 47.3. This is the protocol I’ve been running since December.

10

If all other lab markers are in range… who cares. Do what makes you feel best. PSA and cholesterol in check?

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Thats where Im at. Just go with how you feel. Or go by the numbers and dont feel great, but at least you look good on paper

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No, it is not.

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This is where you should be at.

This is a total of 105 mg a week.

14

Echo @blshaw

Keep an eye on psa and lipids as well as your other blood markers (hematocrit and heamoglobin), if they all stay in range then happy days!

Keep an eye on blood pressure too.

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15

My physician says that what is wrong is that the current “reference ranges” for T and TT are improper guides, because they do not reflect what are healthy levels but what are the DEGRADED levels currently found amongst men, that 50 years ago the reference ranges were much higher. He says:

THE REFERENCE RANGES ARE NOT THE RANGES OF HEALTHY, VITAL MEN, but, rather, the range that the majority (95%?) fall within.

The reference ranges are corrupted by inclusion of hormonally ill men in the calculation of the “normal” ranges.

Analogy: 1. It would be like including the PSAes of men with prostate cancer in calculating what healthy PSAes should be.

Analogy 2. If years from now “the average man weighed 300 lbs and was at 50% body fat” though that would then be “normal” it would not mean it was healthy.

He is not at all bothered that my total T has been a bit over 1,200, as he says that 50 years ago that would not have been considered high.

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He says that psuedo- estrogens, from pesticides, other pollutants, junk food, etc. have wrecked the T levels of men. It may sound illiberal, or politically backwards, but he says it IS true that men are not as manly (in the good ways) as they used to be.

I am, on social issues, very liberal. But I agree. The quiet courage of a John Wayne persona has faded to a degree. It may be sexist, but I believe a key, and proper role of men (and women who so choose) is to be protectors, and, so, when necessary, warriors.

I do not count play soldiers, like some who stormed the capital, or criminals who would loot, using Floyd’s murder as cover, as warriors.

I suspect that falling T levels have contributed to the decline in proper masculine strength, courage, and character.

So, the use of current reference ranges likely leads to incorrect evaluations, by using a wrong measure of what is healthy and beneficial.

17

I think there’s some truth to this, but honest opinion it’s used by ppl that want to justify higher TRT doses.

My labs for TT say men 19-39 healthy and non-obese. There is lots of interpretation for “healthy” I guess

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18

I have no doubt that some use the fact of fallen average T in the way you describe.

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Was there ever really a time where men were walking around with 1200 ng/dl total test though, naturally?