I think it’s due to them being insulin resistant (metabolic syndrome), where a fatty liver probably, from being overstuffed with glycogen, is more apt to synthesize lipids from carbs. People with met-s usually have higher trig levels which are from the liver converting into those.
This is one of those subjects that anecdotal evidence simply doesn’t align with scientific evidence.
To be fair, I think there is also scientific evidence to suggest that more protein (upwards of 2.0-2.4g/kg BW) is most effective at building muscle as well.
This makes me wonder if the contrast between studies could be better explained by the differences of “how much protein do you need to build muscle” versus “how much protein do you need to optimally build muscle”.
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Also, individual differences AND how much protein has the person been ingesting. There is some research showing that people who eat more, need more, and those that eat less, need less.
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Massive Protein Intake and Kidney Damage
I remember once reading in “The Nautilus Nutrition Book” that you wrote many years ago that excess protein can cause kidney problems. What, specifically are the problems, and how does this relate to diets like the Adkins diet? Are these folks doing serious, long-term kidney damage?
Kammeraad
Does a high-protein diet cause long-term damage to the body? This is a controversial topic today. In fact, the government is in the process of investigating Adkins’ diet versus the high-carbohydrate low-fat alternatives.
From 1970-1973, I studied nutrition at Florida State University with Dr. Harold Schendel . Dr. Schendel had spent a number of years in Africa working with starving children. I remember him telling me about how his team of doctors initially rushed into a famine country, assembled the starving children, and tried to force feed them high-protein diets. Rather than improve, their conditions went steadily down hill. They quickly realized that what these children needed was calories, calories in the form of simple carbohydrates. Eventually, they found that what worked best was feeding them primarily a mush mixture of water, sugar, and fatty acids — with a very small amount of proteins, vitamins, and minerals.
Later in his career, Dr. Schendel studied the various amino acids and had a hand in establishing the Recommended Dietary Allowances for protein. In 1970, he convinced me to do a two-month study on my body to determine if massive protein intake was beneficial. At that time in my life, I was consuming more than 300 grams of protein a day. I kept accurate records of my food intake and activity for 60 days — and I collected all my urine for the same period. Afterward, I used the Kjeldahl method for determining nitrogen in my urine, which is a measure of protein.
To my surprise, any time I consumed more than the RDA of protein, the excess was excreted in my urine. Dr. Schendel concluded that my kidneys were working overtime to metabolize the excessive amounts of protein. Dr. Schendel also explained that kidneys (and liver) show overuse symptoms in the presence of massive amounts of protein — which, in long-term animal studies, can contribute to shorter life spans of the high-protein consuming animals.
In my own case, when I discontinued my massive protein diet, I felt a surge of energy from unburdening my kidneys and liver from being overworked.
So, to get back to your original question — yes, I believe it’s possible that many of Adkins’ followers could be causing long-term damage to their bodies.
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I’m curious as to what symptoms were being alluded to here.
This does not really chime with more modern research. A meta-analysis of 28 studies looking into this subject showed there was no evidence that a high protein diet adversely affected kidney function (Devries et al, 2018). This misconception is likely linked to the outdated belief that such diets cause kidney stones, which is instead linked to calcium oxalate.
Regarding RDA’s, again, research has moved on. Higher protein RDA is now recommended by the International Osteoporosis Foundation to protect against osteoporosis - especially in older folks - as the research shows protein, not calcium, is associated with greater bone mineral density and slower rates of bone loss.
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There is no storage area for nitrogen in the body. Bro-science will argue that muscles are storage areas for nitrogen, however muscles are active tissues not storage areas.
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Eating in a calorie surplus is valuable for building muscle, protein just happens to be the hardest macronutrient to turn to fat in the body. So you can get a lot of your extra calories from protein and not expect much for fat gain.
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I actually followed a really dumb diet I cooked up in my head some years ago… The rules for the diet were as follows:
- eat as much lean protein and veggies as you want
- eat no more than .5g/lb BW carbs daily
- don’t add any fats to anything you’re eating
And in like 3 months I had a 6 pack lol. It is near impossible to eat so much lean protein that you are in a surplus 
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I challenge this.
I could easily eat 2500kcal in chicken breast and steamed broccoli (no added fats)
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If you have not tried to do this, then I would like you to actually try.
Chicken Breast Macros (per 4oz):
110 cal
Carbs: 0g
Fats: 3g
Protein: 23g
Broccoli Macros (per half-cup, chopped, steamed):
34 cal
Carbs: 6g
Fats: 0g
Protein: 3g
So you could eat 4.5lbs of chicken breast (2,000cal) and 7 cups of steamed broccoli (~500cal) and still be hungry? I’m not calling you a bullshitter, but…
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definitely not still be hungry, but I could eat 4.5lbs of chicken breast and 7 cups of broccoli in a day easily
Chicken breast is expensive so I don’t eat it much (opt for thighs, which is actually more filling IMO)
I usually have ~2lbs as a “serving” and when I finish I usually still have much more room
I used to eat 8-9 cups of veggies ( ~a 2lb bag)/day and it did not in any way interfere with my meat eating.
THe most hyperpalatable food for me is actually fruit.
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Just by reading this i believe i actually started to smell those broccoli farts, lmao.
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my digestion was really really wonky.
I just love the taste of veggies.
Recently, prices have increased and our freezer broke so I couldn’t bulk order as much as I wanted.
After cutting back, my digestion has improved
if id eat that much veggies, my bedroom would make Aushwitz Gas Chambers look like sauna at some fancy SPA, lol.
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Provided that the room was air tight, sufficient sulphur would be deadly 
I have to admit I’m confused by your diet.
2lbs of boneless, skinless chicken thighs is about 1,000cal, and your 8-9 cups of veggies is likely to range from 500-750cal by itself. Are you eating anything but chicken thighs and/or veggies?
oh! I’m not eating that way rn. I don’t have the calorie budget for 2lb of chicken thighs LOL I wish I did
For chicken thighs (skin on), I have ~1lb and have 3-4 cups of veggies
but yeah, that’s basically what I eat except for 2 protein bars a day and a serving of protein powder and a slice or two of GF bread
I’ve recently switched things up to drumsticks and eggs
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Okay, your diet makes more sense now.
I still have doubts about your ability to easily put down 2500 calories of lean protein and veggies (with no fats added), but that doesn’t really matter anyways.
Most people, myself included, will struggle to eat 4.5lbs of chicken breast with an additional 7 cups of broccoli… Which is kind of the point I was banking on in my dumb diet. You can eat all you want and never really have to worry about being in a surplus.
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I did the same and got fat…works differently for everyone
The only difference was i ate fatty protein, i.e. ribeyes, eggs, dark chicken