What a great business model - own a business and don’t pay the employee enough to live on, then expect the customer to pony up.
It is the greedy owners who are the jerkoffs.
[quote]medevac wrote:
No she took home $20 total with her tips and pay. And $5 an hour to run around and bust your ass like she was is fucking criminal. I would have less problem not tipping if their wages weren’t garnished so heavily. And some places make you claim a percentage of your tips (though most don’t enforce it around here).
…
[/quote]
When I was younger I loaded and unloaded pottery out of trucks for $6/hr. It wasn’t like I was stuck in the gulag, but it was pretty hard work that left me sore and tired at the end of my shift.
Your coworker’s ‘horror story’ had her earning $20 for one particularly bad half-day, while my normal half-day had me getting $24.
I don’t mean to sound like a hard-ass, but I don’t have much pity to spare her.
[quote]treco wrote:
What a great business model - own a business and don’t pay the employee enough to live on, then expect the customer to pony up.
It is the greedy owners who are the jerkoffs.[/quote]
That’s a government regulated thing. The owners have nothing to do with it. Here in Texas it’s regulated by the TABC. I’m sure there is something similar in each state. I found it interesting that one poster said he makes $7.13 an hr at minimum wage [here it’s $5.35] plus tips. That’s getting it done.
[quote]jp_dubya wrote:
tmoney1 wrote:
I usually tip 20%. People in the service industry are trying to make a living as well, so I feel they deserve closer to 20% than 15%.
When it comes to food, if the server doesn’t charge me for a soft drink/dessert/etc., then I make up that cost on the tip. So if a Coke is 2.19, I put that 2.19 on their tip plus extra to make up for not getting charged for those particular items.
so the waiters are paid $2.13 because of poor profitability in bars/restaurants, but you tip when they commit theft and give you something?
Tip the owner by insisting you pay for everything you order and get.
Tip the waiter according to the service they provide instead of the theft they commit.[/quote]
it’s not theft, it’s investing in a customer. any good business gives back to it’s customers because it generates good will and repeat business. this is especially effective in bars and small independent restaurants which people typically use as an escape to feel good about themselves. spending your dinner worrying about measuring the monetary worth of your server does jack-all for bringing someone back to your restaurant next week. where-as giving them free stuff, and making them feel like it’s their birthday, like they’re on the inside getting the hooked up, does. nothing is a more powerful draw than getting stuff for “free”. yes it looks like a “loss” on paper but the gain is in the buzz about your business. the gain is about always being busy and having a scene in your place. the gain is in compelling your customers to return even when they can’t afford it because they’ll get “the special treatment”.
[quote]swivel wrote:
it’s not theft, it’s investing in a customer. any good business gives back to it’s customers because it generates good will and repeat business. this is especially effective in bars and small independent restaurants which people typically use as an escape to feel good about themselves. spending your dinner worrying about measuring the monetary worth of your server does jack-all for bringing someone back to your restaurant next week. where-as giving them free stuff, and making them feel like it’s their birthday, like they’re on the inside getting the hooked up, does. nothing is a more powerful draw than getting stuff for “free”. yes it looks like a “loss” on paper but the gain is in the buzz about your business. the gain is about always being busy and having a scene in your place. the gain is in compelling your customers to return even when they can’t afford it because they’ll get “the special treatment”. [/quote]
Agreed (even if our taste in wine differs 
). I worked for a short time in this business and the management actively told us to give away free drinks etc to customers to make them feel special.
As a bartender in every bar I have worked in and all the ones my friends work in there is usually a “bar” tab or a comp tab to buy drinks for people. they’ll give you like a $50 budget and you can buy drinks for your regulars or if it’s someones birthday or something. The owner of my bar, a friend of mine, has told me consistently to buy some people drinks. You buy someone a draft beer and they are happy and it cost the bar $.60 the cost is nothing compared to them feeling special. Hell we have one guy we end up usually buying a quarter of his beers when he comes in if not more, but he’s a mechanic and works on all our cars for cheap and has saved the owner a couple grand on a transmission. In the restaurant biz it pays to “buy” a few drinks.
the tip jar crap is getting out of control though. The workers just figure why not though. I mean if they can make an extra $5 a shift or something why not put it out.
[quote]rainjack wrote:
duncanidaho wrote:
tedro wrote:
Finally, I only wash my hands after number 2. I don’t pee on my hands so there is no need to wash.
Do you generally shit on your hands?
It’s not the shitting that get’s you in trouble. It’s the wiping.
[/quote]
That’s what I forgot this morning.
[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:
treco wrote:
What a great business model - own a business and don’t pay the employee enough to live on, then expect the customer to pony up.
It is the greedy owners who are the jerkoffs.
That’s a government regulated thing. The owners have nothing to do with it. Here in Texas it’s regulated by the TABC. I’m sure there is something similar in each state. I found it interesting that one poster said he makes $7.13 an hr at minimum wage [here it’s $5.35] plus tips. That’s getting it done.[/quote]
It is more of a lack of government regulation because they don’t apply the minimum wage to these positions.
It puts the power back in the hands of the consumer (and the owner). Don’t like the service? Don’t tip as much.
Owners can pay their employees more if they chose and put out signs saying tips are not accepted. This happens in some places but not many.
[quote]swivel wrote:
jp_dubya wrote:
tmoney1 wrote:
I usually tip 20%. People in the service industry are trying to make a living as well, so I feel they deserve closer to 20% than 15%.
When it comes to food, if the server doesn’t charge me for a soft drink/dessert/etc., then I make up that cost on the tip. So if a Coke is 2.19, I put that 2.19 on their tip plus extra to make up for not getting charged for those particular items.
so the waiters are paid $2.13 because of poor profitability in bars/restaurants, but you tip when they commit theft and give you something?
Tip the owner by insisting you pay for everything you order and get.
Tip the waiter according to the service they provide instead of the theft they commit.
it’s not theft, it’s investing in a customer. any good business gives back to it’s customers because it generates good will and repeat business. this is especially effective in bars and small independent restaurants which people typically use as an escape to feel good about themselves. spending your dinner worrying about measuring the monetary worth of your server does jack-all for bringing someone back to your restaurant next week. where-as giving them free stuff, and making them feel like it’s their birthday, like they’re on the inside getting the hooked up, does. nothing is a more powerful draw than getting stuff for “free”. yes it looks like a “loss” on paper but the gain is in the buzz about your business. the gain is about always being busy and having a scene in your place. the gain is in compelling your customers to return even when they can’t afford it because they’ll get “the special treatment”.
[/quote]
unless they have the owners full consent it is theft, period. It isn’t up to an employee to decide on their own.
Ever owned a bar/restaurant?
There is an invisible underground in career service industry circles. “A” goes to “B” place, gets “hooked up”, and drops a fat tip. B brags he had a $500 night, but then goes where A works and the same “courtesy” is extended. “A” then has a huge night. No real money is made as all this good will is extended at the owners expense. Some will actually short pour a few to make up for the hookup that was extended so that it looks good on paper.
It’s theft.
I have been in the service industry for 33 of my 41 years. Seen every aspect of it from corner saloon to stiff collar hotel. In every venue, there is this seedy side to an honest business.
I have an idea everyone! stop tipping!
then two things would happen: either the income waiters make would go up, or every server would quit.
The best part? It doesn’t cost anything! Well maybe food prices would go up, but who needs to eat out anyway?
I usually do 2x the sales tax in CA and round it up.
[quote]Chris82362 wrote:
I have an idea everyone! stop tipping!
then two things would happen: either the income waiters make would go up, or every server would quit.
The best part? It doesn’t cost anything! Well maybe food prices would go up, but who needs to eat out anyway?
[/quote]
WOW! You’re an economic genius!
[quote]
treco wrote:
What a great business model - own a business and don’t pay the employee enough to live on, then expect the customer to pony up.
It is the greedy owners who are the jerkoffs.
WhiteFlash wrote:
That’s a government regulated thing. The owners have nothing to do with it. Here in Texas it’s regulated by the TABC. I’m sure there is something similar in each state. I found it interesting that one poster said he makes $7.13 an hr at minimum wage [here it’s $5.35] plus tips. That’s getting it done.
Zap Branigan wrote:
It is more of a lack of government regulation because they don’t apply the minimum wage to these positions.
It puts the power back in the hands of the consumer (and the owner). Don’t like the service? Don’t tip as much.
Owners can pay their employees more if they chose and put out signs saying tips are not accepted. This happens in some places but not many.[/quote]
Wait - is there some regulation that if the owner allows servers to accept tips he can’t pay more than some set amount?
I knew there was a separate, lower minimum wage for servers - and obviously the government regulated minimum wage. But I thought the owners could pay more if it makes sense for their businesses - or if they just felt like it - without having to disallow tipping?
*edited
The only rule with regards to wage and tipping is that if the worker does not make minimum wage from pay and tips the business must pay the difference to make it minimum wage. So technically a server can never make less than minimum wage averaged over a pay period. However that is rare to force the issue. mostly the business would just declare for them.
So, for whatever reason, we’ve settled on a less efficient system of compensation for service people, at least in food - if restaurant owners were forced to pay the minimum wage, they could deduct the expense from their income. Instead, we have shifted that cost to the consumer, who cannot deduct it. This makes little sense - but whatever - not like I’m going to be able to change it.
[quote]BostonBarrister wrote:
So, for whatever reason, we’ve settled on a less efficient system of compensation for service people, at least in food - if restaurant owners were forced to pay the minimum wage, they could deduct the expense from their income. Instead, we have shifted that cost to the consumer, who cannot deduct it. This makes little sense - but whatever - not like I’m going to be able to change it.[/quote]
But the higher food prices would be subject to sales tax.
[quote]Zap Branigan wrote:
BostonBarrister wrote:
So, for whatever reason, we’ve settled on a less efficient system of compensation for service people, at least in food - if restaurant owners were forced to pay the minimum wage, they could deduct the expense from their income. Instead, we have shifted that cost to the consumer, who cannot deduct it. This makes little sense - but whatever - not like I’m going to be able to change it.
But the higher food prices would be subject to sales tax.[/quote]
I don’t think there is anything wrong with the current system. For most of the service industry, having servers dependant on your tips insures that they will give good service. If they got paid a flat rate, there would be little incentive for them to go the extra mile.
I think the only problem is when servers think they are entitled to a tip regardless of how poor their service was. That and the tip jars. I also don’t think tips should be taxed, but most servers don’t report all of their tips anyway.
how about tipping strippers?
I talked with a guy that tipped on top of the table dance cost. Seemed pretty silly
Has anyone else come across the situation where you get a bill for $21, give them two twenties and they take forever to come back? This has happened to me more than once. You give them the cash and you wait and wait while they hope you get frustrated and leave. It is completely obvious when the whole meal takes thirty minutes and they take forty five minutes to give you your change. This results in a one dollar tip.
What about the situation where you buy a four dollar drink with a five and the bartender takes your dollar and puts it in the tip jar?
Or how about the situation where the same drink costs a different price depending upon the bartender who serves you?
[quote]tGunslinger wrote:
medevac wrote:
No she took home $20 total with her tips and pay. And $5 an hour to run around and bust your ass like she was is fucking criminal. I would have less problem not tipping if their wages weren’t garnished so heavily. And some places make you claim a percentage of your tips (though most don’t enforce it around here).
…
When I was younger I loaded and unloaded pottery out of trucks for $6/hr. It wasn’t like I was stuck in the gulag, but it was pretty hard work that left me sore and tired at the end of my shift.
Your coworker’s ‘horror story’ had her earning $20 for one particularly bad half-day, while my normal half-day had me getting $24.
I don’t mean to sound like a hard-ass, but I don’t have much pity to spare her.[/quote]
Well thats a bit of a context shift don’t you think? You were paid to do a hard job and not paid well. She was paid to do a hard job and expected to make a certain amount of money (what she would usually get paid for busting her ass) and someone pretty much robbed her. So it sucked from her perspective.
That’s like saying it didn’t matter that she got ripped off because she lives in uber-rich america and there’s a mexican kid working for 5 cents an hour and she should feel lucky.
The thread is about why tipping? And I was showing that due to their poor hourly wage, tips make or break them due to the crappy nature of some patrons (in this case they totally screwed her over, as well as her boss who made her cover the cost). What does you working hard have to do with anything?
For the record, I worked landscaping for two seasons here (also not gulag work) for $5 an hour. Doesn’t change the fact that the system as it is only allows for some service industry workers to eat only if the tips are good.