Right correct SERMs just block the estrogen receptors but does nothing to lower estrogen, aromatization is where Letro and Adex come into play.
I was assuming the taper method would help lower my estrogen levels before I started my PCT
Again thank you for taking your time to give a response, long before this thread I had determined I would use Nolva for my PCT.
Have yourself an excellent day sir
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Good. Great studies from 40 years ago.
From the first quote: to normal males changes enough
From the second quote: it works, I haven’t said it doesn’t - but too weak to unlock your dormant hypothalamus
Just random, reliable, actual studies done on infertile women with PCOS:
Why are those studies appropriate in your case? Because more stimulated follicles in clomifene’s group means better LH and FSH secretion. But still, clinical trials aren’t necessary here - it’s a common knowledge that clomifene suits PCT more. Good luck, honestly.
No problem man, just sharing my experience and what worked for me and has for so many others. In the medical field, tapering is near enough standard practice, I fail to see why we neglect it with these medications.
Ignore the above poster, not sure what his/her credentials are but just seems like someone on an ego trip. Hope your taper goes well, would love to hear it worked for you or if there were any adjustments required. Whenever we take these drugs, there is ALWAYS the risk of never recovering, but thats something we know about before we use.
SB
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Everyone responds differently to PCT. Remember, you’ve been on a nice “high” from the Test and probably feel great. It’s inevitable to not feel the drastic change going back to “normal” and even below normal do a bit.
Having said that, it’s not something that should affect your work or home life. If you are mentally strong, and remind yourself of the changes going on within your body, it will pass.
You won’t know though unless you try. Suck it up, power through, let it get you angry, and use that to keep crushing the gym.
Mental strength is a wonderful tool to combat PCT. Get after it!
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Tamoxifen may be less effective in relation to being able to simulate LH and FSH, however the side effect profile isn’t as immense. If, in some alternate reality I had to run PCT (in relation to recovery from non 19-nor compounds) I’d choose tamoxifen (or enclomiphene if somehow that managed to legitimately be available)… but it isn’t
Tamox will still facillitate recovery, yet at a slower rate when compared to clomiphene (with potentially comparatively less side effects… though I suppose that depends how long one spends with T concentrations at castrate level)
Yea very sounds sensible in my mind, I always try to think with logic. I mean cold turkey I guess it’s still sort of a taper in a way by waiting for the ester to clear, but still 10-14 days sounds like an insanely quick transition from probably 7 maybe even 10 times the androgen levels all the way down to almost nothing, ouch lol.
To me, having 4 weeks to taper off slowly would compare to walking down a steep hill vs walking completely off the face of this Earth IMO.
Also thank you again, I have faith that this method is going to work well for me and be the easiest transition back to normal. I will report back to this thread in due time and update what I did and how it went for me.
Thank you man that makes me feel more confident in the mental aspect of this situation. This will only be temporary at best I’ll bounce right back
I’m hoping the HCG helps make the transition back to normal softer, in combination with a taper
I know dudes personally that have said to not have PCT’ed whatsoever after a cycle and they’re fine, that alone makes me feel better because I’m taking all the precautions I can for my own health and safety so at the end of the day I can tell myself I did the best I possibly could during my PCT. All in itself its more of a mental thing for me knowing I did what I could
& what would you use in recovery from 19-nor compounds knowing they’re the most
This is just out of curiosity since I’ve considered 19nors
I know nolva and tren don’t mix but haven’t heard anything about nolva for PCT after a tren cycle
Bro’s on other boards will use this reasoning, that the ester itself is a built in taper. However, ester clearance times vary greatly amongst individuals, for me it could be 4 days, for you it could 8 days.
And you’re absolutely correct, think of it logically. How can you expect to feel OK going from something like 2500 ng/dL to 0 in the space of 2 or 3 weeks? It blows my mind.
Slowly tapering up and down is the ONLY way I can see to use these drugs.
In my own experience, if I’m using some orals as a kick start and I go straight to maximum dose from day 1, I’m hit by insane lethargy and all the sides under the sun. If I taper up, I can almost go double the recommended doses without any issues. The body needs time to acclimatise, wether its to drugs, sleep schedule, diet, weather, anything.
SB
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With regards to 19-nors, first rule would be to never use Deca. Stays in the system way too long to ever fully recover.
If I was to PCT after Tren Ace or NPP, I would run TRT test at least 2 to 3 weeks past the 19-nor (preferably Test Prop) and then taper off and standard PCT.
However, if I wasnt on TRT, I just wouldn’t use a 19-nor, period.
SB
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Right, to allow the 19-nor to clear the receptors I could understand running testosterone beyond the 19-nors. My one buddy ran 16 weeks of Deca and he warned me that it was very difficult to come back from. I’m beggining to think I probably won’t run any 19-nors ever even though they sound very beneficial in the aspect of proformance enhancement just the idea of damaging my hypothalamus or Lydig cells isn’t something I’m dedicated to yet.
I can also agree with this statement because I’ve experienced this, there has been times I have adapted my body to sleeping 5 maybe 6 hours a night, working 7 days a week for 12-16 hours a day hard physical labor eating once to twice a day for several years. I surprised myself of what I’m truly capable of because I could never see myself working like that just a couple years ago
Right now I’m sleeping about 8-10 hours thankfully and working 5 days a week for 8-10hours and I eat 3-4 times a day and I feel a lot better mentally and physically. It took a lot to get me to run at that level but I’m sure my cortisol levels were absolutely through the roof, I started getting crows feet under my eyes at 22 years old LOL shit had me aging in dog years
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