Everytime I try to order this stuff its out so Im tierd of waiting. Is there something like it I can just buy at GNC? Also is there such thing as a fat burner without the jitters or something that wont keep you up at night?
take them earlier in the day. AtLargeNutrition has a decent one, can’t think of the name. Hot-Rox is legit tho
advancedsupplements.com carries them as well for a good price.
Are you taking 1 or 2 per dose? Thibs mentioned years back that he only ever took 1 capsule per dose because it worked just fine. Have you ramped up to 2 per dose after taking 1 per dose for 1 - 2 weeks? That may curb the jitters.
When I take HOT-ROX, I take the first 30-min before breakfast (6:30 a.m.) and either noon or just before my afternoon snack to avoid bed time problems. You may also take 2 in the a.m. dose and 1 in the p.m. Eitehr way, just make sure it is 6-8 hours before bed time.
MIND YOU, imo fat-burner pills should really only be utilized when already in significantly low BF%s, and trying to reach an extremely low BF% simply using them to cut excess fat is a bit extreme.
[quote]eightohfive wrote:
MIND YOU, imo fat-burner pills should really only be utilized when already in significantly low BF%s, and trying to reach an extremely low BF% simply using them to cut excess fat is a bit extreme. [/quote]
for the non-advanced - just using a supplement like HRX can help them learn to dial in their macros, stay disciplined etc
for the advanced - you’re right in that the results would be more conspicuous than a beginner (to the whole nutrition side of things)
[quote]eightohfive wrote:
MIND YOU, imo fat-burner pills should really only be utilized when already in significantly low BF%s, and trying to reach an extremely low BF% simply using them to cut excess fat is a bit extreme. [/quote]
I agree. Stuff like HOT-ROX should be used after a significant amount of BF has already been shed but continued progress has stagnated. It should almost be treated like a reward, at least in my opinion.
[quote]eightohfive wrote:
MIND YOU, imo fat-burner pills should really only be utilized when already in significantly low BF%s, and trying to reach an extremely low BF% simply using them to cut excess fat is a bit extreme. [/quote]
We’re talking fat burners… OTC Fat burners, not DNP, Clen or T3. Yeah, yeah supplements should be the final touches to a diet and training program but honestly…
[quote]PimpBot5000 wrote:
[quote]eightohfive wrote:
MIND YOU, imo fat-burner pills should really only be utilized when already in significantly low BF%s, and trying to reach an extremely low BF% simply using them to cut excess fat is a bit extreme. [/quote]
I agree. Stuff like HOT-ROX should be used after a significant amount of BF has already been shed but continued progress has stagnated. It should almost be treated like a reward, at least in my opinion. [/quote]
I wouldnt consider taking a fat burner a reward I dont think most peeps enjoy sleepless nights or jittery feelings. I quess if you like being geeked out its fun. Personally I dont enjoy it. As far getting toward lower BF whats the diff weather you are at 20% or 10%? The whole idea is to speed up the process thats what they sell the stuff for. I was at 13% when I started just becuase I wanted to get to 10 or 8% faster but if I was 20% chasing 15% I dont see how it would matter.
Hebrew, you can get it on amazon.
[quote]thehebrewhero wrote:
I wouldnt consider taking a fat burner a reward I dont think most peeps enjoy sleepless nights or jittery feelings. I quess if you like being geeked out its fun. Personally I dont enjoy it. As far getting toward lower BF whats the diff weather you are at 20% or 10%? The whole idea is to speed up the process thats what they sell the stuff for. I was at 13% when I started just becuase I wanted to get to 10 or 8% faster but if I was 20% chasing 15% I dont see how it would matter.[/quote]
I’m talking about people who are trying to aspire to get lean. Going from 20% to 15% isn’t much of a goal, in my opinion…it’s a start. But yes, if you’ve set your sights on a svelte 15%, HOT-ROX would help take the weight off faster.
Going from 20% to 8% is a whole different ballgame. With some basic discipline and nutritional know-how, it’s really not that hard to go from 20% to say 14%. You don’t need a supplement to do it…progress will be fast and measurable on a week-to-week basis. After prolonged dieting, things start to slow down…progress can stagnate, and it is at this point I think something like Hot-Rox should be taken…a “reward” that will restart fat-burning to some extent and help you make continued progress.
I cringe whenever I see a fat guy in a supplement store shelling out money for a fat-burner. You don’t need it…what you need to do is go easy on the Ben and Jerry’s and perhaps walk for 30 minutes a day!
[quote]PimpBot5000 wrote:
[quote]thehebrewhero wrote:
I wouldnt consider taking a fat burner a reward I dont think most peeps enjoy sleepless nights or jittery feelings. I quess if you like being geeked out its fun. Personally I dont enjoy it. As far getting toward lower BF whats the diff weather you are at 20% or 10%? The whole idea is to speed up the process thats what they sell the stuff for. I was at 13% when I started just becuase I wanted to get to 10 or 8% faster but if I was 20% chasing 15% I dont see how it would matter.[/quote]
I’m talking about people who are trying to aspire to get lean. Going from 20% to 15% isn’t much of a goal, in my opinion…it’s a start. But yes, if you’ve set your sights on a svelte 15%, HOT-ROX would help take the weight off faster.
Going from 20% to 8% is a whole different ballgame. With some basic discipline and nutritional know-how, it’s really not that hard to go from 20% to say 14%. You don’t need a supplement to do it…progress will be fast and measurable on a week-to-week basis. After prolonged dieting, things start to slow down…progress can stagnate, and it is at this point I think something like HOT-ROX should be taken…a “reward” that will restart fat-burning to some extent and help you make continued progress.
I cringe whenever I see a fat guy in a supplement store shelling out money for a fat-burner. You don’t need it…what you need to do is go easy on the Ben and Jerry’s and perhaps walk for 30 minutes a day![/quote]
No one NEEDS a fat burner.
At any BF%, it will make the process faster, less painful, and will help hold muscle. No reason not to use it.
Shit won’t do shit if you don’t already have your diet together. It’s not like people save creatine and protein powder until they’re already muscular; it’s silly.
[quote]Vicomte wrote:
No reason not to use it.
[/quote]
Your body will adapt to any thermogenic, and often quickly. Your first week of ephedrine/caffeine or clen will feel much, much different from your fourth week. I noticed the same thing with HOT-ROX. Yes you can “cycle” these during a cutting phase but you start to get into the law of diminishing returns.
If you’re looking to go from a flabby 20% to a lean 8%, I think there is a very good reason not to use it until your progress stagnates. But yeah, if you just want to drop a few % over a month or two, no reason not to use it.
Protein powder, no, absolutely no reason to “save” it. It’s food. However, if I could go back in time to when I started going to the gym, I would have held off on the creatine until I gained 20-30lbs just by eating lots and lifting heavy. Teenage hormone levels + caloric surplus + heavy resistance training = a hurricane of anabolic awesomeness. I would have told myself to start creatine when progress started to slow and when I had built up a decent base.
(“Younger me” wouldn’t have listened though, as I inhaled almost every bullshit supplement known to man as a teenager)
[quote]PimpBot5000 wrote:
[quote]Vicomte wrote:
No reason not to use it.
[/quote]
Your body will adapt to any thermogenic, and often quickly. Your first week of ephedrine/caffeine or clen will feel much, much different from your fourth week. I noticed the same thing with HOT-ROX. Yes you can “cycle” these during a cutting phase but you start to get into the law of diminishing returns.
If you’re looking to go from a flabby 20% to a lean 8%, I think there is a very good reason not to use it until your progress stagnates. But yeah, if you just want to drop a few % over a month or two, no reason not to use it.
Protein powder, no, absolutely no reason to “save” it. It’s food. However, if I could go back in time to when I started going to the gym, I would have held off on the creatine until I gained 20-30lbs just by eating lots and lifting heavy. Teenage hormone levels + caloric surplus + heavy resistance training = a hurricane of anabolic awesomeness. I would have told myself to start creatine when progress started to slow and when I had built up a decent base.
(“Younger me” wouldn’t have listened though, as I inhaled almost every bullshit supplement known to man as a teenager)
[/quote]
The effects of most thermogenics persist long after the initial buzz wears off.
That said, I can understand the reasoning behind saving it, but it seems largely arbitrary as to when or for how long. It’s extra fat lost, no matter your BF.
But I have always been a fan of the quick and dirty approach. I’ve never had any problems with fat loss stalling because I’ve never used a more moderate cutting diet. If you’re eating 2400 kcal a day with medium carbs, then yeah, you’ll need something extra after a month or two.
So at ~12% is it acceptable to use a fat burner? I’m starting off at 1/2 dosage. I’m planning to get sub-8%.
[quote]cct wrote:
So at ~12% is it acceptable to use a fat burner? I’m starting off at 1/2 dosage. I’m planning to get sub-8%.[/quote]
Use one any time you like. I just prefer to implement them after I’ve dropped a lot of weight just by diet and exercise, and when my progress has started to slow.
[quote]cct wrote:
So at ~12% is it acceptable to use a fat burner? I’m starting off at 1/2 dosage. I’m planning to get sub-8%.[/quote]
From 12 to 8 I’d say you’re good to go.
sure, it’s not a “xXhardcoreXx” supplements like clen, however, what kind’ve lazy-assed person can’t dial in a diet in order to cut the weight? I think it’s a shortcut, that in the long run, for most, will have negative effects. Like someone said above, they don’t work year round, your body will become accustomed to the caffeine and other ingredients, and it’s quite possible that along with becoming desensitized, you could experience withdrawals.
back and forth we go, good read and food for thought
So I’m doing intermittent fasting (15-22 hours fasting per day) and using EC (12.5mg + 200mg) twice daily to suppress appetite in the morning. How much of a daily calorie deficient would be enough to lose 8 pounds of pure fat (no water or muscle weight included) in six weeks? And how does EC compare to HOT-ROX?
This is my first time cutting and it’s been a week, so I don’t really know what to expect. It’s been a week and can’t really see much of a difference in the mirror since I have very shallow abs.
[quote]eightohfive wrote:
sure, it’s not a “xXhardcoreXx” supplements like clen, however, what kind’ve lazy-assed person can’t dial in a diet in order to cut the weight? I think it’s a shortcut, that in the long run, for most, will have negative effects. Like someone said above, they don’t work year round, your body will become accustomed to the caffeine and other ingredients, and it’s quite possible that along with becoming desensitized, you could experience withdrawals.[/quote]
Umm… how about only take stims/fat burners 5-6 days a week and incorporate off days from them (works pretty well if these coincide with off days from training).
Or as another option, you can start with a minimum effective dose and gradually work up to the higher end of the recommended dosing range over the course of several weeks. For HOT-ROX, this would look like:
Week 1: AM Dose- 1 cap
Week 2: AM Dose- 1 cap, PM Dose- 1 cap
Week 3: AM Dose- 2 caps, PM Dose- 1 cap
Week 4: AM Dose- 2 caps, PM Dose- 2 caps
After that you can crank through the rest of the bottle at the max recommended dose before taking a week or so off to resensitize yourself. You could also just take the off week after “week 4” and start again with the minimum dose.
I suppose you could also cycle stims with entirely different profiles of active ingredients, but I don’t think it’s very healthy to be stimmed out 100% of the time (masking neural fatigue with stims is a great way to spend a lot of UNPRODUCTIVE time in the gym). It’s also pretty fucking hard to find stims that don’t contain caffeine lol.
Off days/weeks in either of the first two scenarios should be completely free of stims- no coffee/tea/etc. Stims/fat burners are a great tool and there’s no reason why you can’t take advantage of them MOST OF THE TIME. You just have to be smart about it and approach them like a lifter who is supplementing intelligently rather than a speed tweaker trying to get a fix. I’ve done it both ways (currently doing it the right way), and yeah- the latter leads to some pretty fucking awful withdrawals. I was into stronger stims than you find in a cup of coffee, so it was particularly unpleasant lol.