[quote]Boffin wrote:
How soon before 98lb steroid guru’s in their bedroom advise other newbs to inject the grapefruit juice…LOL[/quote]
Don’t be daft, you put it in your sock.
I just started this today… I’ll update if I notice any difference.
[quote]AlteredState wrote:
lil_azn wrote:
…would suggest fresh grapefruit juice if possible - niagrin, the active ingredient in grapefruit is found mostly in the peel and flowers.
niagirin inhibits the breakdown of the xanthines in caffeine in the liver. i learned this in dan duchaine’s book.
i faithfully chase my 1/2 can Spike with a glass of grapefruit juice every AM before working out - and i stay pretty energized for most of the day.
Well I use the ‘not from concentrate’ stuff, but would struggle to get actual fresh juice.
I do have 3 pink g’fruit in my fridge though so eating one of these would probably do, especially if I squeeze some of the oil from the skin onto my tongue.
What do you think lil_azn?
You know you are fast becoming my ‘go to girl’ for alternative, effective treatments ;)[/quote]
i use the zest (juse a peeler - don’t use the white pith) myself in my juice. i think that could work. question though - could the grapefruit work on injections? do they not bypass the liver? grapefruit interactions take place in the liver…just a thought…
i don’t use the concentrate stuff - no grapefruit i get the regular juice. do you notice sweating a heck of a lot more when you work out?
also, grapefruit has also been found to inhibit cancer - s’pose it’s the luck of the draw.
it’d be nice if Biotest would make a product like this 
if not, go to this link, click muscle optimizers and scroll down the the product called “Exceler8 DHB”
It is a supplement that you could take instead of downing grapefruit juice.
Not that it matters, either way seems to work, but I think this could just add to the thread hopefully.
DG
[quote]Makavali wrote:
Boffin wrote:
How soon before 98lb steroid guru’s in their bedroom advise other newbs to inject the grapefruit juice…LOL
Don’t be daft, you put it in your sock.[/quote]
Mak, I think you should be more specific with your posts. It’s only the left sock that should be used.
RSGS (aka Right-Socked-Grapefruit-Syndrome) can be very dangerous and sometimes fatal. Be careful what you say on open forums.
Just trying to help,
Dave
[quote]Dave_ wrote:
Makavali wrote:
Boffin wrote:
How soon before 98lb steroid guru’s in their bedroom advise other newbs to inject the grapefruit juice…LOL
Don’t be daft, you put it in your sock.
Mak, I think you should be more specific with your posts. It’s only the left sock that should be used.
RSGS (aka Right-Socked-Grapefruit-Syndrome) can be very dangerous and sometimes fatal. Be careful what you say on open forums.
Just trying to help,
Dave[/quote]
So sorry, I just assumed everyone was well aware of RSGS and it’s sides. I won’t make that mistake again!
[quote]Makavali wrote:
Dave_ wrote:
Makavali wrote:
Boffin wrote:
How soon before 98lb steroid guru’s in their bedroom advise other newbs to inject the grapefruit juice…LOL
Don’t be daft, you put it in your sock.
Mak, I think you should be more specific with your posts. It’s only the left sock that should be used.
RSGS (aka Right-Socked-Grapefruit-Syndrome) can be very dangerous and sometimes fatal. Be careful what you say on open forums.
Just trying to help,
Dave
So sorry, I just assumed everyone was well aware of RSGS and it’s sides. I won’t make that mistake again![/quote]
No probs. Of course an RSGSI (inhibitor) is always an option but why take the risk?
[quote]Dave_ wrote:
No probs. Of course an RSGSI (inhibitor) is always an option but why take the risk?[/quote]
The hepatoxicity of an RSGSI is greatly overstated. I’d use one.
But seriously, let’s get back on topic… 
LOL, I’m hijacking my own thread.
Anyway, here’s some interesting stuff;
A (by no means exaustive) list of interactions from wiki:
The following drugs interact with CYP3A4:
The benzodiazepines triazolam and quazepam
Statins such as atorvastatin, lovastatin, and simvastatin
Dihydropyridines including felodipine (Plendil), nicardipine (Cardene), difedipine, nisoldipine (Sular), nitrendipine (Bayotensin)
losartan (Cozaar)
repaglinide (Prandin)
verapamil (Calan SR, Covera HS, Isoptin SR, Verelan)
Antiarrhythmics including amiodarone (Cordarone), quinidine (Quinidex, Cardioquin, Quinora), disopyramine (Norpace), propafenone (Rhythmol), and carvediol
The male impotence drugs sildenafil (Viagra), tadalafil (Cialis), and vardenafil (Levitra)
The anti-migraine drugs ergotamine (Cafergot, Ergomar) and nimodipine (Nimotop)
Fluvoxamine (Luvox, Faverin, Fevarin and Dumyrox)
Codeine and Tramadol. It reduces the amount of codeine converted by CYP3A4 into norcodeine thus increasing the amount metabolised into morphine
Cyclosporine.
PUBMED: interactions between grapefruit and CV drugs
“Although altered drug response is variable among individuals, the outcome is difficult to predict and avoiding the combination will guarantee toxicity is prevented.”
I hope to be running a 3 weeker of test prop, winstrol, and dbol soon. I was going with 50mg dbol 50mg winstrol, but I may try halving the dose and smacking a glass of GFJ everyday.
I will up the dose gradually, but I’ll be keeping an eye on signs/symptoms of hepatitis…
I suggest you inkect the grapefruit juice.
it runs great alongside of the apple and pear
its absorbed better thru the colon walls anyways,in the industry we call it an ass rocket.
oh ya I am up in weight also
I am now 103 pounds and feeling really bloated on my cycle of grapefruit hopefully I can get back down to 99
[quote]Dave_ wrote:
A (by no means exaustive) list of interactions from wiki:
The following drugs interact with CYP3A4:
The male impotence drugs sildenafil (Viagra), tadalafil (Cialis), and vardenafil (Levitra)
[/quote]
This could be very nasty guys. Not in terms of huge raging boners, but nasty as in BAD. These are all potent vasodialators. Meaning that they relax the walls of the blood vessels causing them to dialate or open wider. This can cause a drop in BP. So much so that you could die. This is why you aren’t supposed to take these with nitroglycerin or even NO boosters.
[quote]Dave_ wrote:
PUBMED: interactions between grapefruit and CV drugs
“Although altered drug response is variable among individuals, the outcome is difficult to predict and avoiding the combination will guarantee toxicity is prevented.”
I hope to be running a 3 weeker of test prop, winstrol, and dbol soon. I was going with 50mg dbol 50mg winstrol, but I may try halving the dose and smacking a glass of GFJ everyday.
I will up the dose gradually, but I’ll be keeping an eye on signs/symptoms of hepatitis…[/quote]
Please keep us updated.
[quote]Nich wrote:
I suggest you inkect the grapefruit juice.
it runs great alongside of the apple and pear
its absorbed better thru the colon walls anyways,in the industry we call it an ass rocket.
oh ya I am up in weight also
I am now 103 pounds and feeling really bloated on my cycle of grapefruit hopefully I can get back down to 99[/quote]
Do you cut your injections with prune juice to ease the inject pain. I have to. I guess I’m one of the unlucky ones who are sensitive to grapefruit juice injection pain. Leaves my colon and sphincter sore for days!
[quote]AlteredState wrote:
xXDevilDogXx wrote:
This could be very nasty guys. Not in terms of huge raging boners, but nasty as in BAD. These are all potent vasodialators. Meaning that they relax the walls of the blood vessels causing them to dialate or open wider. This can cause a drop in BP. So much so that you could die. This is why you aren’t supposed to take these with nitroglycerin or even NO boosters.
.
I would think that if you did experience a massive drop in BP, all that would happen is you would faint. Assuming you didn’t crack your head on the way down (god bless thick rubber lifting mats in gyms ), once your legs were the same level as your heart, sufficient blood would return to the vena cave to provide the brain with consciousness again.
I have read of clubbers passing out from a compo of viagra and poppers (essentially a form of nitroglycerine), due to the combined vasodilatory effects.[/quote]
Not trying to argue with you, but my understanding is that what you mentioned may be true for something not related to medicine. I’m basing this off the fact that Cialis can be effective for up to 36 hours. It is touted as the medicine that lets you and the Mrs. get frisky when the time is right for you guys.
I could list an example, but it would give away too much about me and my profession.
I guess it would depend a lot on how long the drug is active in the system.
Hopefully no one here is gonna be popping viagra before they go to the gym anyways.
As far as I understand, you are both right.
The reason I highlighted the viagra part is exactly as devildog mentions - the exaggerated vasodilation causing bp to plummet.
Of course, if bp becomes too low, the defense mechanism is to faint. This eases the strain on the heart as it no longer needs to fight against gravity to circulate blood.
However, it is not just fainting that we need to worry about. There comes a point where the bp is so low that even syncope cannot compensate for the drop in blood pressure.
As far as duration of action goes… The GFJ extends this significantly, and so multiple doses of cialis/viagra etc may become cumulative when spaced apart as recommended. Not sure if this is what devildog meant though?
Dave
PS: Alt you have a PM
[quote]AlteredState wrote:
Now I’m confused, lol.
What would the duration of action have to do with the pathomechanics of low BP?
It is, to my mind, a simple ‘plumbing’ issue. The venous system holds a certain amount of blood, based upon vasomotor tone of the venous walls. Reduce the tone of the walls (as would happen in vasodilation) and suddenly, the veins hold more blood. Since the cardiovascular system is effectively a closed loop, increasing capacity in one area causes a reduction in volume in another area, especially when gravity is involved.
So the blood pools in the legs and suddenly the brain is starved of O2, resulting in syncope (fainting).
Part of the function of syncope is to ‘drop’ the level of the head, heart and legs to the same level wrt gravity. You get the same result during times of real or percieved blood loss.
If I’ve got it wrong, please tell me as I love to learn about this stuff :)[/quote]
I see you know what you are talking about! Good discussion here.
This is what I was trying to say. I’m just not very elegant online…lol
[quote]Dave_ wrote:
As far as I understand, you are both right.
The reason I highlighted the viagra part is exactly as devildog mentions - the exaggerated vasodilation causing bp to plummet.
Of course, if bp becomes too low, the defense mechanism is to faint. This eases the strain on the heart as it no longer needs to fight against gravity to circulate blood.
However, it is not just fainting that we need to worry about. There comes a point where the bp is so low that even syncope cannot compensate for the drop in blood pressure.
As far as duration of action goes… The GFJ extends this significantly, and so multiple doses of cialis/viagra etc may become cumulative when spaced apart as recommended. Not sure if this is what devildog meant though?
Dave
PS: Alt you have a PM
[/quote]
The only thing I should add is that Viagra, Cialis, and Levitra all block the PDE5 binding site. Kinda like proviron binding to SHBG. This blocking of the PDE5 (and some effect on PDE6) means that excess cGMP is floating around. Thats how the erections come about. Well that doesn’t apply too much to our syncopal episode. What does is the the erection drugs also increase NO production. Levitra and Cialis working for about 4 hours and Cialis having a 17.5 hour half life, means that these effects could last longer than you just passing out and the body returning to homeostasis.
I could be wrong, but this is how I interpreted this.
BTW, Alt, I’m thrilled to finally be able to participate in a discussion with someone as brilliant minded as you.
Tangelos and Seville Oranges also are very similar in there effects on these same medicines.
Some more research about GFJ:
**Despite results that demonstrated higher intensity after repeated ingestions (Lilja et al, 2000a), it appears that in most cases, ingestion ofa single glass (250 ml) of regular strength grapefruit juice is enough to produce the maximum effect (Rau et al, 1997; Kane & Lipsky, 2000)
**Grapefruit juice does not need to be taken simultaneously with the medication, in order to produce the interaction. The bioavailability of lovastatin has been reported to be doubled, even when taken 12 h after the juice intake (Rogers et al, 1999), and the effects of grapefruit juice on felodipine have been shown to exist at about 30% of its maximum even when the drug was taken 24 h after the juice intake (Lundahl et al, 1995). The prolongation of the interaction is consistentwith the pharmacological mechanism of the interaction, since biosynthesis of a new enzyme is necessary. Up to 3 days persistence of the juice impact is reported (Takanaga et al, 2000); however, it appears that an interval of 24 h between ingestion of grapefruit juice and a drug can usually prevent a potential clinically relevant interaction (Lilja et al, 2000b).
And regarding Viagra…**Sildenafil citrate is used for the oral treatment of erectile dysfunction. It acts by enhancing the ability of nitric oxide to inhibit phosphodiesterase type 5. Sildenafil undergoes extensive metabolism through CYP3A4 (Hyland et al, 2001). The ingestion of 250 ml grapefruit juice 1 h before and concomitantly with sildenafil increased the oral bioavailability of sildenafil by 23% (Jetter et al, 2002). One case report indicated a 42% increase in Cmax but no change in AUC value for 100 mg of sildenafil taken with grapefruit juice (Lee & Min, 2001). Consequently,sildenafil pharmaco-kinetics becomes less predictable with grapefruit juice, and it is advisable to avoid this combination.