How difficult would it be to drive down to the South and obtain some firearms?
[quote]Aragorn wrote:
One thing to note is that a large amount of small business owners are in this tax bracket. They are “rich” on paper, but re-invest a large portion of their income into their business, effectively making them significantly poorer than they are on paper when they file IRS paperwork. An increase on taxes will hurt these people significantly, and hurting small business is bad for the economy, because they do not have the resilience of large corporations. They will have to lay off people or go under. [/quote]
Ara…help me out on this one since I am an IT idiot who knows nothing about corp taxes.
If you are significantly poorer on paper, wouldn’t that be a plus ?
If a business owner re-invests in his/her own business, is there some kind of business re-investment tax credt ? Don’t some business owners forgo income on the personal side onto the corporate side, so they can be offset by losses, depreciation, etc. ?
I know some increase wages of their employees with profits as opposed to giving out bonuses to board members/owners as another method, which would also help with retaining employees.
Are there more ways to tax shelter on the corp side than the personal side ? Is one of them incorporate in Delaware ?
[quote]PRCalDude wrote:
The thinking went like this. “Hey, we know we’re making crap loans, but at least we sell them to someone else for 10 cents on the dollar and they, in turn, can sell them to the former third world for trillions!” Worked for awhile. [/quote]
PR…who made all the money !!!
[quote]therover wrote:
PRCalDude wrote:
The thinking went like this. “Hey, we know we’re making crap loans, but at least we sell them to someone else for 10 cents on the dollar and they, in turn, can sell them to the former third world for trillions!” Worked for awhile.
PR…who made all the money !!!
[/quote]
The financial class. They pushed the bailout through as well. They are an insular, self-affirming, self-aggrandizing cabal of Davos men.
[quote]Aragorn wrote:
Professor X wrote:
bigflamer wrote:
You can’t understand that we would bitch less when taxes are actively being cut? Or that I would bitch more when a president promises to raise taxes?
Why is that so hard to wrap your head around? I know plenty of people, myself included, who fundementaly disagree with the current structure of taxation in the US. This is nothing new.
But he isn’t raising taxed to anyone but those who are already wealthy. I don’t know about you, but if I were making 250K a year, I would not be worried about where my next meal is coming from.
One thing to note is that a large amount of small business owners are in this tax bracket. They are “rich” on paper, but re-invest a large portion of their income into their business, effectively making them significantly poorer than they are on paper when they file IRS paperwork. An increase on taxes will hurt these people significantly, and hurting small business is bad for the economy, because they do not have the resilience of large corporations. They will have to lay off people or go under. [/quote]
You are absolutely correct, but this still misses the point. Even if socialism worked as advertised it is immoral to forcibly relieve a private concern of it’s money in the name of artificially elevating some other private concern.
Taxes are for doing the inherently public business of government on behalf of the public. Business, such as national defense which is mandated in our constitution and is by definition public, despite what some might say.
Fairness, justice, equality, retirement, food, clothing, housing, fine art, and the grooviest damn TV and radio stations around are not what the first constitutional convention had in mind.
[quote]Zap Branigan wrote:
Inner Hulk wrote:
Zap Branigan wrote:
Inner Hulk wrote:
A hard days work used to be rewarded in this country from what I hear, but no more. Unless you’re a college grad who’s pulling in at least 80k+ a year, you’re a lazy bum who “don’t do shit”.
Sick.
What the fuck are you talking about? People used to work sun up to sun down and could barely feed themselves.
Why the hell do people think they all deserve to own ipods, cell phones, have HD Cable TV and drive fancy cars?
What the fuck are YOU talking about?
Why the hell do people think they deserve 10 houses, 3 yachts, and 2 Ferraris? Living lavishly off the back breaking work of the lower and middle class.
Those people are not begging me for handouts and when they are I staunchly oppose them, such as the bank bailout the Dems rammed down our throats.
If you want something in this life you have to earn it.
[/quote]
Agreed. They don’t have to beg. They already took it and it is our fault for letting it happen.
I think the following article states what has been going on through this election.
http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/12699486/paul_krugman_on_the_great_wealth_transfer/print
[quote]orion wrote:
Professor X wrote:
jawara wrote:
At what point will the “rich” stop working because they refuse to pay these high taxes?
If they quit working and shut down how will that effect unemployment?\
Utter bullshit.
If RICH people quit working just so they don’t have to pay taxes, that makes them WORSE than the poor people who simply can’t pay much in taxes because they don’t make much to begin with.
If people quit pursuing goals because they need to pay taxes, that is about as Un-American as you can get.
It is utter BS because you think it should not be this way?
It is un-American not to want to work for someone else?
Is servitude American?
Wasn´t the whole war of independence a giant tax-revolt?[/quote]
Everyone note that even this guy, who is not an american, realizes this.
[quote]RebornTN wrote:
orion wrote:
Professor X wrote:
jawara wrote:
At what point will the “rich” stop working because they refuse to pay these high taxes?
If they quit working and shut down how will that effect unemployment?\
Utter bullshit.
If RICH people quit working just so they don’t have to pay taxes, that makes them WORSE than the poor people who simply can’t pay much in taxes because they don’t make much to begin with.
If people quit pursuing goals because they need to pay taxes, that is about as Un-American as you can get.
It is utter BS because you think it should not be this way?
It is un-American not to want to work for someone else?
Is servitude American?
Wasn´t the whole war of independence a giant tax-revolt?
Everyone note that even this guy, who is not an american, realizes this.[/quote]
why don’t you make an epic picture? That seems to be your response for everything else.
[quote]Aragorn wrote:
Professor X wrote:
bigflamer wrote:
You can’t understand that we would bitch less when taxes are actively being cut? Or that I would bitch more when a president promises to raise taxes?
Why is that so hard to wrap your head around? I know plenty of people, myself included, who fundementaly disagree with the current structure of taxation in the US. This is nothing new.
But he isn’t raising taxed to anyone but those who are already wealthy. I don’t know about you, but if I were making 250K a year, I would not be worried about where my next meal is coming from.
One thing to note is that a large amount of small business owners are in this tax bracket. They are “rich” on paper, but re-invest a large portion of their income into their business, effectively making them significantly poorer than they are on paper when they file IRS paperwork. An increase on taxes will hurt these people significantly, and hurting small business is bad for the economy, because they do not have the resilience of large corporations. They will have to lay off people or go under. [/quote]
Bingo.
I employ a number of people. When things are slow I cover their wages instead of laying them off. If I pay more in tax, my incentive to do things like that goes away. In fact if my costs go up for any unproductive reason such as higher taxes then I need to cut costs somewhere else. Workers are the first to go. Overhead first, then direct bills who aren’t as productive as the next guy.
Friends of mine who own small companies are in the same boat and we all have the same plans if higher tax’s come into effect. I can’t compensate in this slower economy and my workers are going to suffer. It will snowball and that will be sad and will prolong the downturn.
[quote]jawara wrote:
Tiribulus wrote:
Now I’m sorry I sold my AK several years ago.
I don’t think the economy is going to come to a screeching stop to this degree, at least right away, but severely limited private ownership of arms in the form of everything they can get away with is coming for certain. And quick.
Get em while you can.
I know the economy won’t stop right away. I’m just just getting ready for some shit to go down. I’m holding out for the Bushmaster ACR to come out but I am going to start stocking up on ammo. I already have a few 5.56 mags saved.[/quote]
1st of all thanks from the bottom of my heart for your service! thank you!!
But, You did write that you came back from Iraq correct? Well your mentality is still there, get a re-grip on reality now that your back. This countries political process does not allow for those kind of drastic changes to happen so quickly. Remember, he only has 4 years to prove his worth or his happy ass is GONE!!!
What the fuck are YOU talking about?
Why the hell do people think they deserve 10 houses, 3 yachts, and 2 Ferraris? Living lavishly off the back breaking work of the lower and middle class. [/quote]
WHY!! WHY!! WHAT THE FUCK R U TALKING ABOUT!!!
Because if they had the ambition & drive to become the CEO & have that kind of money he or she DOES deserve what ever the fuck his money could buy!!! this is the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA & we have (or had till last night) the right to do what ever we want with our money!!!
Several years ago I thought Atlas Shrugged was the most over rated book in the library.
I have reconsidered. We should HOPE he doesn’t shrug in the next 4 years. I’m no fan of the profit motive but taking it away
might not prove prudent. Look at England
after WWII. Socialism didn’t work. I’m no fan of Exxon Mobil either but look at the size of the investment they made to reap those enormous profits. By the way, they pay
a higher per centage in taxes than they reap in profits. Anyone care to sit in line for hours to pay $20 a gallon for Chinese gasoline?
You guys are so full of shit. It’s called capitalism. If you are too mentally shaken or financially weak to be able to thrive because of a 3-4 % tax hike then guess what? I guess you go out of fuckin business and someone takes your place. Just imagine you’re in good with the mob and you pay for certain “protections”. They hike the rent and guess what, Either pay or Don’t play motherf#ckers. I bet AIG wasn’t complaining about Socialism when they were beggin at the government teat 2 months ago! Suck it up bitches!!
[quote]Odogg wrote:
You guys are so full of shit. It’s called capitalism. If you are too mentally shaken or financially weak to be able to thrive because of a 3-4 % tax hike then guess what? I guess you go out of fuckin business and someone takes your place. Just imagine you’re in good with the mob and you pay for certain “protections”. They hike the rent and guess what, Either pay or Don’t play motherf#ckers. I bet AIG wasn’t complaining about Socialism when they were beggin at the government teat 2 months ago! Suck it up bitches!! [/quote]
Taxes are capitalism and we are full of shit?
Thank you for your contribution, it is much appreciated.
[quote]Odogg wrote:
You guys are so full of shit. It’s called capitalism. If you are too mentally shaken or financially weak to be able to thrive because of a 3-4 % tax hike then guess what? I guess you go out of fuckin business and someone takes your place. Just imagine you’re in good with the mob and you pay for certain “protections”. They hike the rent and guess what, Either pay or Don’t play motherf#ckers. I bet AIG wasn’t complaining about Socialism when they were beggin at the government teat 2 months ago! Suck it up bitches!! [/quote]
Well, you’ve got to look at numbers. A small corporation with earnings of $360,000,000 would face a tax hike of $10,800,000 going from 36% to 39%. That expense has to be offset somewhere, and there’s a good chance it will come from payroll. The current unemployment levels will only compound.
As someone else has said, a small business will be more likely to suffer because of this, since there is less room to play around with finances.
As for the AIG thing, that’s what happens when the safety net of government eliminates possible losses from risk. This is what destroys capitalism. Big brother “encouraged” this type of behavior. Of course these companies will be lobbying for bailouts, the government set the tone.
Get a grip. That’s one of the dumbest things I’ve ever heard. No one ‘stops working’ because their taxes are raised. No work = no money. Work = money. Whether there’s low taxes, high taxes, or no taxes.
That doesn’t mean there will be no negative consequences like employee pay cuts, so the top brass can take home more at the end of the day. But even that line must be tread very carefully. Use some logic please.
Benjamen Franklin… probably the one of the greatest American ever… one of the countries founding fathers_…he was a politician, engineer, scientist, inventor, entrepreneur, philosopher, publisher, journalist, philanthropist and medical practitioner…/
/?When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic.? ? Benjamin Franklin
No one works for poor people!
[quote]gtdh wrote:
Benjamen Franklin… probably the one of the greatest American ever… one of the countries founding fathers_…he was a politician, engineer, scientist, inventor, entrepreneur, philosopher, publisher, journalist, philanthropist and medical practitioner…/
/?When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic.? ? Benjamin Franklin
quote]
Uh, you do know this comment can be applied to any politician that claims tax cuts? Or one that is tied heavilyt into special interests. So to claim that this comment is applicable to only Obama or democratis is a fallacy.
[quote]Odogg wrote:
You guys are so full of shit. It’s called capitalism. If you are too mentally shaken or financially weak to be able to thrive because of a 3-4 % tax hike then guess what? I guess you go out of fuckin business and someone takes your place. Just imagine you’re in good with the mob and you pay for certain “protections”. They hike the rent and guess what, Either pay or Don’t play motherf#ckers. I bet AIG wasn’t complaining about Socialism when they were beggin at the government teat 2 months ago! Suck it up bitches!! [/quote]
My business will survive and so will I. Some of my employees will need to find other jobs. So will the manufacturers of some of the equipment I buy since I won’t invest as much in the business because I don’t have the funds. I’ll have to use my capital to pay taxes. I’m not thinking about hiring anyone either. I put on 4 workers this time last year to handle our backlog of work.
See how this works now. I can still play. Just can’t afford to hire as many other people to play with…cause I’m paying them.
By the way. The government is far less understanding then the mob when it comes to doing business.