Gossamer - My TRT Journey

Pharma / TRT Testosterone Replacement
1

Hi all,

I’m new to the forum, and fairly new to TRT. Here’s the info the forum requests of new members:

-age-44
-height-5’5.5"
-waist-32"
-weight-165ish lbs
-describe body and facial hair-hairy legs,somewhat hairy chest, can grow beard(but I don’t because it’s gray)
-describe where you carry fat and how changed-since teenager, carried fat on torso. Now carry more fat in neck as well. Almost no fat in legs
-health conditions, symptoms [history]-At start of TRT on July 9, 2013-short term memory poor, poor concentration, lack of motivation, tired, poor libido, moody, lifted weights with very minimal results
-Rx and OTC drugs, any hair loss drugs or prostate drugs ever-took accutane as a teenager, and some antibiotics for sinus infections as recently as 4 years ago. No hair loss
– real dangers! see this http://propeciahelp.com/overvi…
-lab results with ranges-first lab results taken 6/24/2013
Actual Reference Range
White blood cell count- 5.80 3.5-11.0
Red blood cell count 5.34 4.2-5.8
Hemoglobin 15.4 13.0-17.2
Hematocrit 45.2 38.0-50.1
MCV 84.6 80-98
MCH 28.8 26-34
MCHC 34.1 32-36
RDW 14.0 12.0-15.4
Platelet Count 319 150-400

Segmented Neotrophils 51 35-75
Lymphocytes 38 17-43
Monocytes 10 0-12
Eosinophils 0 0-6
Basophils 1 0-2
Anisocytosis Normal Normal
Platelet Estimate Adequate Adequate
Occasional large platelets present

                                   Alert

Vitamin b12 319 213-816
Vitamin D, 25-hydroxy 42 Sufficiency 30-96
TSH .92 .35-4.94
Free T3 3.34 1.71-3.71
Free T4 .99 .70-1.48
Albumin 4.3 3.4-5.0
Testosterone, Total 170.2 Low 196-782 Male 20-49YO
Testosterone, Free 5.06 Low 5.2-18.0 Male 20-49YO
Testosterone, Bioavailable 119 119-470 Male 20-49YO
Testosterone, percentage free 3.0 1.5-3.1 Male 20-49YO
SHBG 12 12-59
Estradiol 18 11-44
DHEA-Sulfate 386 140-484
Cortisol 11.1 AM 3.7-19.4
PM 2.9-17.3

Total PSA .41 0-4.0

Test performed on an Abbot Architect system

My test time was approx. 9:30 AM

-describe diet [some create substantial damage with starvation diets]-Eat 5-6 small meals a day
-describe training [some ruin there hormones by over training]-pretty much on target with this-

-testes ache, ever, with a fever? no
-how have morning wood and nocturnal erections changed Haven’t had morning erections in a while. Can’t remember when I last had morning wood(of course my memory sucks)

Will post more including recent update later.

2

[quote]Gossamer wrote:
Hi all,

I’m new to the forum, and fairly new to TRT. Here’s the info the forum requests of new members:

-age-44
-height-5’5.5"
-waist-32"
-weight-165ish lbs
-describe body and facial hair-hairy legs,somewhat hairy chest, can grow beard(but I don’t because it’s gray)
-describe where you carry fat and how changed-since teenager, carried fat on torso. Now carry more fat in neck as well. Almost no fat in legs
-health conditions, symptoms [history]-At start of TRT on July 9, 2013-short term memory poor, poor concentration, lack of motivation, tired, poor libido, moody, lifted weights with very minimal results
-Rx and OTC drugs, any hair loss drugs or prostate drugs ever-took accutane as a teenager, and some antibiotics for sinus infections as recently as 4 years ago. No hair loss
– real dangers! see this http://propeciahelp.com/overvi…
-lab results with ranges-first lab results taken 6/24/2013
Actual Reference Range
White blood cell count- 5.80 3.5-11.0
Red blood cell count 5.34 4.2-5.8
Hemoglobin 15.4 13.0-17.2
Hematocrit 45.2 38.0-50.1
MCV 84.6 80-98
MCH 28.8 26-34
MCHC 34.1 32-36
RDW 14.0 12.0-15.4
Platelet Count 319 150-400

Segmented Neotrophils 51 35-75
Lymphocytes 38 17-43
Monocytes 10 0-12
Eosinophils 0 0-6
Basophils 1 0-2
Anisocytosis Normal Normal
Platelet Estimate Adequate Adequate
Occasional large platelets present

                                   Alert

Vitamin b12 319 213-816
Vitamin D, 25-hydroxy 42 Sufficiency 30-96
TSH .92 .35-4.94
Free T3 3.34 1.71-3.71
Free T4 .99 .70-1.48
Albumin 4.3 3.4-5.0
Testosterone, Total 170.2 Low 196-782 Male 20-49YO
Testosterone, Free 5.06 Low 5.2-18.0 Male 20-49YO
Testosterone, Bioavailable 119 119-470 Male 20-49YO
Testosterone, percentage free 3.0 1.5-3.1 Male 20-49YO
SHBG 12 12-59
Estradiol 18 11-44
DHEA-Sulfate 386 140-484
Cortisol 11.1 AM 3.7-19.4
PM 2.9-17.3

Total PSA .41 0-4.0

Test performed on an Abbot Architect system

My test time was approx. 9:30 AM

-describe diet [some create substantial damage with starvation diets]-Eat 5-6 small meals a day
-describe training [some ruin there hormones by over training]-pretty much on target with this-

-testes ache, ever, with a fever? no
-how have morning wood and nocturnal erections changed Haven’t had morning erections in a while. Can’t remember when I last had morning wood(of course my memory sucks)

Will post more including recent update later.[/quote]

Gossamer,

Please post LH/FSH data. This will give us a starting point as to where the problem is.

3

No LH/FSH data prior to TRT?

fT3 and TSH look great. Seems odd that fT4 is a bit below mid scale.

Started TRT now? If not, do LH/FSH first. LH alone is not useful.

4

I missed the second page of my test results.

Thyroid Peroxidase Ab 4 Ref range <9
T3 Reverse. 19. 18-25
Dihydrotestosterone 11. 16-79

That’s all that was tested.

I had another blood test last Tuesday (9/3/13). Haven’t gotten results yet. My first injection was July 9. 200mg/ml. Was told to inject once per week, but 2 days after first injection, I felt like crap with very strong anxiety. So I’ve injected 100mg every 3.5 days since. For 6 weeks, I felt really good, with a few days here and there that I didn’t feel so good. Then after the sixth week, I started getting tired more often, more moody, and have had acne breaking out a little on my upper chest, and cystic acne on my neck. Now FYI, I’m extremely prone to acne. In high school, I took accutane and other meds. So acne was my biggest concern going into TRT. I’m just not sure if the acne is estrogen related, or simply from the test. No acne until the 6th week, which was the same time I started feeling worse more often.

For the last @2 weeks, I’ve been taking a zinc copper supplement which I hope will help with the acne, and possibly help as an AI. If I have to be on TRT lifelong, I really don’t want to have to take an AI drug long term. We just don’t know the long term effects of these drugs.

So, when I get my results, I can see how to proceed. Maybe my T will be really high, and I can just go to a lower dose, because I suspect that aromatase is causing my symptoms. I guess we’ll see.

5

Got my test results today:

T3 FREE 3.8 Range 2.3-4.2

ESTRADIOL 45 <Or=39

Total Testosterone 901(Trough) 250-1100

She said my T level (901) was right where she wanted it to be, and the next step was to add arimidex to block estrogen, and help lose some of the fat I’ve had a hard time getting rid of. I asked her if I lose the fat, will that mean I can come off the Arimidex because I wont have as much fat to aromatase into estrogen. She said “no”, and I’d need to keep on the Arimidex. I then told her I was weary about staying on Arimidex for long term. And I asked her what were the long term effects of Arimidex, and she said “none that I know of”. Well that’s great. Of course there’s none you know of, because we don’t know the long term effects of this drug in this application.

Since she saw I was hesitant about Arimidex, and I told her about my acne problem, she suggested maybe lessening my T dose to help with acne, and also to possibly bring down Estradiol.

So, she lowered me from 200 mg/wk to 150mg/wk.

She also prescribed Doxycycline for acne, and Nature Throid for thyroid low reading.

So, on for another 6 weeks at 150mg test/week, and thyroid stuff. We’ll see how it goes from here.

6

I have a question I hope someone can help me with. My last test results showed a trough estradiol reading of 45, and test was 901 I believe. Now I believe test peaks for me around 24 hours after my injection. And from what I’ve learned, E follows T. So, I’m assuming my estradiol peaks around 48 hours post injection. Sometimes, like yesterday for example, I was a little moody.

I guess I have two questions. First, is it possible that my estradiol peaks quite a bit over the trough reading of 45?

And second, if my estradiol level doesn’t go down from my lowered t dose, I may go on arimidex. Would it be best to take .25 mg twice a week to start? And, sorry, third question, should I take the arimidex a day after my injection(twice a week)?

Thanks

7

[quote]Gossamer wrote:
I have a question I hope someone can help me with. My last test results showed a trough estradiol reading of 45, and test was 901 I believe. Now I believe test peaks for me around 24 hours after my injection. And from what I’ve learned, E follows T. So, I’m assuming my estradiol peaks around 48 hours post injection. Sometimes, like yesterday for example, I was a little moody.

I guess I have two questions. First, is it possible that my estradiol peaks quite a bit over the trough reading of 45?

And second, if my estradiol level doesn’t go down from my lowered t dose, I may go on arimidex. Would it be best to take .25 mg twice a week to start? And, sorry, third question, should I take the arimidex a day after my injection(twice a week)?

Thanks[/quote]
Anyone?

8

Ok, it’s getting worse. Yesterday(24-36) hours after injection, I felt like the worst pms I’ve seen in my wife. If my trough estradiol is 45, am I looking to lower my estradiol from that number? Or am I looking to lower estradiol from a significantly higher number? I put in a call to my dr.'s office today, and hopefully they can get me going on the arimidex that she suggested at my last appt. 2 weeks ago.

I just need to know from the experts here, if I’m gonna need a larger dose than I was hoping to take.

Can anyone here give me an educated guess on this?

9

It is quite uncommon to find a guy who cannot take anastrozole 1mg/week problem free. Suggest that you take 1/2mg when you inject and see how you feel and then decide. Expect to feel some major improvements in 7-10 days and 6 weeks to reach end state.

I hope that you are reading the stickies and understand the implications of “anastrozole over-responder”. If that is you, you can take comfort in taking 1/4mg per week.

10

[quote]KSman wrote:
It is quite uncommon to find a guy who cannot take anastrozole 1mg/week problem free. Suggest that you take 1/2mg when you inject and see how you feel and then decide. Expect to feel some major improvements in 7-10 days and 6 weeks to reach end state.

I hope that you are reading the stickies and understand the implications of “anastrozole over-responder”. If that is you, you can take comfort in taking 1/4mg per week.[/quote]
Ok. Thanks for the info. If my dr.'s office calls me back, I’ll see what they say, and I’ll recommend 1mg/wk to start.

I’m trying to read as much as I can on this, and I have read all the stickies more than once. As bad as high estradiol symptoms feel, I really don’t want to go to low.

I’ll keep you all updated.

11

If you need to refine your dose after E2 labs are done; you probably cannot do that by splitting tiny pills. With a liquid product, you can change dose increment buy the drop.

If you go to EOD injections, EOD anastrozole is the way to go and the dose is then smaller and again a liquid product is best.

12

[quote]KSman wrote:
If you need to refine your dose after E2 labs are done; you probably cannot do that by splitting tiny pills. With a liquid product, you can change dose increment buy the drop.

If you go to EOD injections, EOD anastrozole is the way to go and the dose is then smaller and again a liquid product is best.[/quote]
Aha, liquid arimidex! It may be better for me. Is it sublingual, or just put in mouth with dropper?

If I even thought about EOD injections, I think I’d quit TRT right now. I think it’s a mental think for me. 4 injections every two weeks has been ok. 7 injections every 2 weeks is almost double the injections. Although, on my new 150mg a week dose, it would be 350 mg every 2 weeks. Something to think about.

Injecting as I am now(.75 mg twice a week) would liquid arimidex make sense?

13

Ok, here’s my latest.

Dr. finally gave me a prescription for anastrozole. She put me on .5 mg/2w, along with my 150mg of cypionate, which is split into 2 injections per week. I’m concerned that I have 6 weeks until my next blood work, and I’m just not sure if 1mg anastrozole/wk won’t be too much.

I have some real concerns that my nurse doesn’t really know what she’s doing, because first, she told me to take the .5g anastrozole every Monday and Thursday. I asked if I could just take it on the days I inject(sat. And tues), and she said “no, take on Monday and Thursday”. What’s the difference?

And second, I asked her what I should look for if the 1mg is too much, and it drives my E too low. She said just stay on the 1g/wk until next blood work.

Is it possible that in that 6 weeks, given my dose of T and anastrozole, that my E could get too low? I really don’t want to crash my E!!!

My first .5 gram of anastrozole was on Tuesday, and my second was this morning. I didn’t notice any e signs after my injection. So, I assume the anastrozole is working. And I also noticed a much better pump in my workout too. The same kind of workout I had on my first 6 weeks of trt, when I’m guessing my E wasn’t yet an issue.

What do I look for if the anastrozole is working? And what do I look for if the anastrozole is taking me through my “sweet spot” and crashing my E? I know one sign of a proper e level is morning wood. I don’t have that.

Thanks all