Firefighters have to do 1/5th the job of what cops do. They do medical, and they fight fires. For everything else, they are hands off. Totally different job… and from what i have heard, much easier.
The FD where my BIL works, does pay close to what docters make if you take into account the obscene pension. But where he works he has to deal with homeless drug addicts trying to stab him with HIV infected needles for taking their buddy to the hospital when she ODs. Where he worked previously, the level of firefighter was much lower and so was the pay.
One of the good ideas (IMO) in the article i linked above is that PDs should give big incentives for cops to live in the neighborhoods they patrol. this would help with community policing, and also help limit instances of police brutality and overstepping as no one wants to shit where they sleep.
It’s dangerous and requires certain physical attributes. Not everyone could be a firefighter and I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s harder to become a firefighter than a cop because they can’t be as lax with the physical standards.
This might work if there was a real effort to make those neighborhoods not look like it’s controlled by ISIS. Fixing the police issue has two sides: the police and the neighborhood. Maybe changing our drug laws would help.
The UK used to have exactly this. The police service was “reformed” and got much worse. Many local stations closed and, as a result of the increase of cars etc, they decided that, on foot, street patrol was a thing of the past.
The result has been an embarrassing decline in standards. The UK plod were once the best on earth, now they’re a joke making “weapon” raids that result in them confiscating spoons.
I think the fix is much more a tactics issue than a legal issue. The NYPD under Bill Bratten did improve many neighbourhoods. That said, I wouldn’t want to defend all the means used in doing so. Moreover, what works in NYC is almost impossible to replicate for a whole host of reasons.
This is a very unpopular opinion, but the danger aspect doesnt hold water with me. Most firefighters love the danger aspect, and have wet dreams about running into a burning building to save grandma and her cats. Thats part of the appeal of the job. Similarly, my recreation is significantly more dangerous and my risk tolerance is very high compared to most, so i honestly dont view the level of danger they face as much of a thing to be feared as most would.
And were those means sustainable? If there isn’t a plan in place to make it so you don’t need to be heavy handed then you’re creating a permanent mini police state.
They’ve held for a few decades now. I don’t know if you can do it and then eventually cease doing it without losing the results. Crime is an extremely complicated subject, to be honest. There are so many factors at play in the crime rate that I wouldn’t know where to begin.
There’s a lot to unpack there. I’ll try to give it some thought this afternoon. For the record, I no longer work full-time in LE but am technically still employed by the city on a as-needed basis.
But most people don’t. That’s the issue. I don’t think increasing pay will make more people want to be cops. And if it does increase applicants, they might be worse than what we get now since it will be all about money.
I wonder if relaxing the physical standards for policing has made them resort to violence more. Maybe if you employed a pack of weight room hitting bruisers, they’d have less need to reach for the gun, and the perps would be less likely to square up.
I think about this case a lot, not least of which because the whole story is hilarious.
Training as if they are going into battle. Working too many hours. Seeing having empathy as a disqualifying trait. Allowing the environment where you work to influence you in the same way it influences the people who live there. I think a lot of these cops have PTSD. Departments need to do more to think about the cops’ physical and mental health but that costs money.
Eh, i think you would be surprised. But maybe im wrong. I sure as shit would have very seriously considered becoming a cop, and likely would have if it paid as well or better than what my current career does/will.
That assumes you would have been competent as well as actually liked the job. You could just as easily said after your first day on the job, screw this, there are easier ways to make money.
IMO, incentives (usually paying them more) to make police behave is just silly. Just don’t tolerate bullshit. These are adults, not grade schoolers. Start prosecuting them to the fullest extent of the law when they break it would a good start. They don’t deserve doctor pay, as they don’t have doctor qualifications. It comes down to supply and demand.
Incentives to live in the neighborhoods they patrol isnt meant to pay them for good behavior. And i think it would improve a cops judgement out in the field as they would know most of the people they would be dealing with, and vice versa. Youre less likely to be a dick to someone you know or know you will see later that week at the store (this goes both ways).
As for paying cops way more, its so that a higher standard of person will consider becoming a cop and PDs can raise their standards for new hires as more people would want to enter law enforcment. And yes there would be significantly more training associated with it… mostly of the social sciences and psychology type. Its so a higher standard of cop can be recruited… right now its is a rare exception when one of the best and brightest considers becoming a cop when they could make 2-3x times the money doing something else (even doing stuff that helps the community).
I think that incentives to live in the area also require a strategy that makes doing so effective. Cops in cars are separated from the community in a way that foot patrols are not.
The knowledge a foot patrolman gets from the community, and even just the visible presence of the officer has a tendency to make for lower crime and disorder, which in turn leads to less overall necessity for the use of force.
Is that going to be easy in some of the rougher metropoli of the United States? No. It is however worth it in the long run.
Foot patrols > car patrols, and I’ve never seen a shred of evidence that the widespread use of cars has been a net boon for policing. Obviously in the rural regions they’re needed, but NYC, Baltimore etc?
Many cops are already paid generously. NYC Port Authority cops make six figures, with some raking in 250-400k with their OT. Suffolk County Long Island cops make 100+k and have generous pensions. All have excellent health insurance.