What is your primary goal? Strength? Physique/aesthetics? Competing in a specific sport or event? If people don’t know what you’re trying to achieve it will be hard for them to help you do it.
Some specifics of your current diet and training would also help (i.e. specific lifts, loads, type/intensity of cardio, what you ate yesterday etc). Any injuries?
At 6’1" and 170lbs you are unlikely to find many people will suggest that you cut. Everybody wants to see their abs, but without some more muscle mass a cut won’t really show anything. Like you said, you would just look skinny.
You need to get yourself onto a proven program and stick to it and you need to eat to support that program and your goals. Which program and how much you need to eat depend somewhat on the answers to the above questions.
How much do you lift? (squat, deadlift, bench, over head press, any type of clean, any type of snatch ect) My just general guess is, it is over, or around 20%. Also, what do you mean by training on and off? What are you goals anyway?
[quote]Ace2012 wrote:
I have been lifting on and off for a while now. [/quote]
Based on what you have said, this is the culprit. Lift consistently and you will see results. Any time that I hadn’t achieved what I set out to, it wasn’t because I didn’t have a good strategy but that I lacked consistency.
You decide what your goals are but I wouldn’t suggest that you cut if you asked me. I’d focus on putting on as much muscle as I could.
Do not cut there is going to be nothing to show for it other than a month or two of wasted time that you could have actually been making progress. Eat, LIFT, eat,sleep repeat.
Reed is spot on. You need to focus on getting stronger by lifting consistently, eating plenty of good food, and getting good sleep. The results will come if you put the time and effort in.
[quote]Reed wrote:
Do not cut there is going to be nothing to show for it other than a month or two of wasted time that you could have actually been making progress. Eat, LIFT, eat,sleep repeat.[/quote]
For the love of god listen to this.
OP, you need to start being consistant. Make time to train. You can’t just go when things are convienient and then skip when it gets tough and expect to get results. You need to teach yourself how to be disciplined and how to work hard. You will never get anywhere in this or any endevor with your current attitude.
[quote]Ace2012 wrote:
I want to build a better physique, get aesthetic, atm it doesnt look like I lift even though I do.
By on and off I mean my working patterns change a lot so I try to go gym whenever I can.It can vary a lot week to week.
I would agree my bodyfat is 20% ish. I am leaning towards leaning down towards the lower teens at least and then clean bulk for a while.[/quote]
To repeat the key points that’ve already been brought up, consistent lifting and proper eating can make a visible difference in a month or two. You can’t lift off and on with a spotty schedule while never following a “strict diet” and then complain about being frustrated with the results. C’mon man.
Also, cutting is definitely a bad idea for now. You’d go from a tall guy who doesn’t look like he lifts to a tall guy who doesn’t look like he lifts or eats. Use this article to figure out your nutrition:
For your training, if you can’t guarantee three or four lifting days every week (doesn’t matter which days), I don’t know what to tell you. But if your schedule is prone to emergencies or sporadic hours, you need a reliable, pre-designed training plan that won’t be majorly effected if you have to train two days in a row. Your push/pull/legs should fit this bill if it’s designed correctly. What does your routine look like (days, exercises, sets, and reps)? An upper/lower or full body plan should also work.
Thankyou for the replies, my only concern is that at my high bodyfat I do not want to gain any more. I know this comes hand in hand with gaining weight.
I wasnt clear in my initial post I used to lift regularly and was about 10 kg heavier, stronger, after work life took over the past couple of years diet has been shoddy and workouts hit and miss.
That article is really good. Although shouldnt I be counting calories? or should I just focus on gaining strength and keeping the waistline the same.
[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:<<< For your training, if you can’t guarantee three or four lifting days every week (doesn’t matter which days), I don’t know what to tell you. >>>[/quote]Yep, three is even enough if attacked like your life depended on it. AFTER learning to do your movements effectively.[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:<<< But if your schedule is prone to emergencies or sporadic hours, you need a reliable, pre-designed training plan that won’t be majorly effected if you have to train two days in a row. Your push/pull/legs should fit this bill if it’s designed correctly. >>>[/quote] Very VERY good indeed. Push pull legs is perfect. Simple, effective and easy to design. A couple big exercises followed by a couple smaller ones. A couple variations of curls after maybe some machine rows and pulldowns. For pull day for example. Abs can be stuck in wherever. I do em on pull day, but might throw a set here and there in on push day. I work legs Mon., Back, bi’s and abs wed. and chest tri’s and shoulders Sat. If I were younger I’d bring up the frequency to every other day.
I cannot emphasize enough that once you learn what you’re doing you have to WORK. I train with face bursting intensity and recover the other 4 days. 20 rep squats, rest pause, drop sets, etc. 3 hours a week. But I’m a lot older than you are. I need more recovery time.
If you can guarantee that you can lift three times a week then something like starting strength can be ran a few times, and afterwards texas method, madcow, full body 5/3/1, and various other proven programs would serve you well if you can show up consistently. Just focus on eating quite a bit of good food, (protein like eggs, meat, fish, good carbs, and some fats such as eggs, nuts, and fish) and lifting hard. If you have more of an unstable schedule a good push, pull, legs or upper, lower would likely be a better choice.
[quote]Ace2012 wrote:
Thankyou for the replies, my only concern is that at my high bodyfat I do not want to gain any more. I know this comes hand in hand with gaining weight.[/quote]
That isn’t exactly true.
There is a difference between bulking and gaining strength.
One is an intentional attempt to build muscle, and conversely strength. The other is an intentional attempt to build strength, and conversely muscle.
While the two definitely comes hand in hand, you do not need to bulk/gain size in order to gain strength.
Just keep your protein and fat consumption at a high level but keep your overall calorie assumption at/ slightly below/slightly(depends entirely on whether you want to lose fat, don’t care too much about that, etc) above your BMR, and you won’t be bulking. You’ll merely gain strength, provided that you lift frequently enough and eat enough protein.
All of my lifts have improved dramatically in the last three months (squat went from 145-205, deadlift went from 235ish to 305, etc), and I haven’t gained weight. My weight is exactly the same (156ish), but I have definitely lost fat and gained a very visible amount of muscle.
All I did was eat at roughly what should be my BMR and go above it periodically(like once a week).
OP, Take a look at Heavythrower’s log from the last two days (an O-35’er) and see if you can gleen a few things about training intensity, results and whether you need to “cut” right now.
[quote]Ace2012 wrote:
Thankyou for the replies, my only concern is that at my high bodyfat I do not want to gain any more. I know this comes hand in hand with gaining weight.
I wasnt clear in my initial post I used to lift regularly and was about 10 kg heavier, stronger, after work life took over the past couple of years diet has been shoddy and workouts hit and miss.
That article is really good. Although shouldnt I be counting calories? or should I just focus on gaining strength and keeping the waistline the same.[/quote]
Dude, especially given your height, if you do not gain a significant amount of muscle mass (i.e. at least 30-40lbs) you will not look even close to the way you want to look, no matter how lean you get. Period.
If you do not lift and take in a significant caloric surplus on a consistent basis this will never happen. Ever.
If you get that caloric surplus dominantly from relatively “clean” foods, like the ones listed in the article that Chris linked, it is unlikely that you would ever feel like eating enough of those foods to cause any noticeable fat gain. No, you do not need to count calories, unless it’s to make sure you’re eating enough. Even then, I find it easier to count macros and even easier to eat until I get tired of eating and then eat some more. Serious.
Even if you just added 40 lbs of muscle and didn’t lose any fat you would still look much better than you do now. Not to mention the fact that you will also find it far easier to get lean once you add some muscle mass, as muscle burns calories 24 hours a day.
[quote]Ace2012 wrote:
my only concern is that at my high bodyfat I do not want to gain any more. I know this comes hand in hand with gaining weight.[/quote]
Know the other way to make your bodyfat percentage lower? Increase your lean muscle mass. #Mindblown.
counting calories can work for some people, but it can also be time and energy-intensive, both of which you seem to be lacking. Instead, focus on lifting as consistently as you can and eating well enough to provide your body the nutrition it needs to build muscle - the foods in the article I posted above.
As long as your strength in the gym is increasing each week and you’re “liking” the changes you see in the mirror/how your clothes are fitting, you’ll be pretty much on the right track.
[quote]Ace2012 wrote:
Thankyou for the replies, my only concern is that at my high bodyfat I do not want to gain any more. I know this comes hand in hand with gaining weight.
[/quote]
You have a high body fat percentage because YOU HAVE NO MUSCLE.
Train your arse off, get stronger, get bigger, decimate the local chicken and cow population.
[quote]w83emuscle wrote:
Honestly man i would go and get blood work done to check everything out. I would def get testosterone levels checked. Estrogen may be jacked also.[/quote]
Really? You don’t think this guy should maybe try eating/lifting with a purpose for a bit before he jumps on the whole hormonal thing and goes running to the doctor? C’mon.
[quote]w83emuscle wrote:
Honestly man i would go and get blood work done to check everything out. I would def get testosterone levels checked. Estrogen may be jacked also.[/quote]
Really? You don’t think this guy should maybe try eating/lifting with a purpose for a bit before he jumps on the whole hormonal thing and goes running to the doctor? C’mon.
[/quote]
Knowledge is power… if i were having problems with strength, muscularity, etc i would like the piece of mind knowing that all of my hormones were in check. obviously he is having issues or he wouldn’t have posted… just my thoughts. its not like i was telling him to get on TRT.
