yeh i thought that because i was watching recent videos of him on youtube training and it wasnt westside.
/hijack
[quote]Modi wrote:
Wow, whoever started this thread was a total newb at the time.
I would say that I had poor results with a strict Westside approach. I had better results when I either kept Back Squat as my ME movement and went for a 5rm on week 1, 3rm on week 2, and 1rm on week 3, then repeated. Or when I Back Squatted for two weeks going for a 3rm on week 1 and a 1rm on week 2, then switched to Box Squats for two weeks and repeated.
I had the best technique improvements while doing the 13 week Sheiko cycle, and moderate strength gains as well.
Without a doubt, my best strength gains have come from doing Smolov. Hands down.
All I can say is that I feel like I have absorbed a ton of knowledge in the past couple of years, and have tried to apply as much as possible. I don’t think you’ll ever know what really works until you try it yourself. And I can also say that I am still as blissfully ignorant about the politics of PL’ing as I was a few years ago, and plan to stay that way as long as possible.[/quote]
but most people start with a basic westside template, dont they?
[quote]Kerley wrote:
but most people start with a basic westside template, dont they?
[/quote]
I don’t know. Maybe. But I’m not sure it’s the best template to start with, especially if you don’t know what you are doing. Maybe if you are lifting with others who know their shit, but if you are doing it on your own, and are a reasonable newb, maybe not. I think a newb would be better off getting better at the basic movements. I don’t really think they need to switch lifts on a weekly basis.
I also think it depends on gear or not. Not that Westside can’t be modified for raw lifting, but I think the basic templates that people more or less copy are designed for geared lifters. Someone benching 225 raw probably doesn’t need to spend a ton of time on board pressing/floor pressing/pin pressing, and yet those are the exercises he will probably pick because that’s what all the big guys are doing (same for Squat and DL variations).
I also don’t think that straight weight DE stuff is all that great for the beginner. I do like DE work with bands and chains, but again many beginners don’t have access to that unless they are at a PL gym. I think they would be better off with an ME day and an RE day, and just trying to put some mass on.
Keep in mind, I trained at a commercial gym for years, and then switched to lifting in my basement. I’ve never really trained at a PL gym, save for a few times, so I don’t know what routine most people are starting with. I’m not anti-Westside by any means. I may even go back to one of my modified versions at some point. But I can tell you that I got better at Squats, Bench and DL by doing Squats, Bench and DL as primary movements, and by doing the other stuff as secondary (supplemental/accessory/whatever).
[quote]Kerley wrote:
/hijack[/quote]
You really don’t have to do that. I’m all for hijacking and going off topic. It’s actually one of my strengths.
Along with a massive squat.
[quote]Modi wrote:
Kerley wrote:
/hijack
You really don’t have to do that. I’m all for hijacking and going off topic. It’s actually one of my strengths.[/quote]
You’re greatest strength is your strength.
[quote]Bloobird wrote:
Modi wrote:
Kerley wrote:
/hijack
You really don’t have to do that. I’m all for hijacking and going off topic. It’s actually one of my strengths.
You’re greatest strength is your strength.[/quote]
And yours is homophones. 
One thing to keep in mind, today at westside they are not training like the articles Dave Tate has written on here.
Ive been reading greg panoras training log for a little while and its very interesting how he trains, alot different then you would expect.
I personally think that westside is excellent for a lifter who is in tune with their body. If you honestly know where your weaknesses are, there is no reason it won’t work. If your weakness is off the chest in the bench and you are doing max effort close grip 3 boards. You have missed the point completely.
When new guys start training with me, first thing I do is put them on a basic westside template. I will replace DE bench with old style RE bench (3 sets failure) and won’t use bands. Once the lifter hits a 315lbs bench which for most new average sized lifters is 5-6 months, we start them on DE work. If its a girl that number is cut in half to 160lbs. Maybe its because the ME stuff they do is basic (incline, floor press, 1-2 board, illegal wides, etc) but the template works fine for many.
[quote]Frank.S wrote:
One thing to keep in mind, today at westside they are not training like the articles Dave Tate has written on here.
Ive been reading greg panoras training log for a little while and its very interesting how he trains, alot different then you would expect.
I personally think that westside is excellent for a lifter who is in tune with their body. If you honestly know where your weaknesses are, there is no reason it won’t work. If your weakness is off the chest in the bench and you are doing max effort close grip 3 boards. You have missed the point completely.
When new guys start training with me, first thing I do is put them on a basic westside template. I will replace DE bench with old style RE bench (3 sets failure) and won’t use bands. Once the lifter hits a 315lbs bench which for most new average sized lifters is 5-6 months, we start them on DE work. If its a girl that number is cut in half to 160lbs. Maybe its because the ME stuff they do is basic (incline, floor press, 1-2 board, illegal wides, etc) but the template works fine for many. [/quote]
A 315 bench in only 6 months of training in their life? Wow i want to train with you.
[quote]Modi wrote:
Kerley wrote:
but most people start with a basic westside template, dont they?
I don’t know. Maybe. But I’m not sure it’s the best template to start with, especially if you don’t know what you are doing. Maybe if you are lifting with others who know their shit, but if you are doing it on your own, and are a reasonable newb, maybe not. I think a newb would be better off getting better at the basic movements. I don’t really think they need to switch lifts on a weekly basis.
I also think it depends on gear or not. Not that Westside can’t be modified for raw lifting, but I think the basic templates that people more or less copy are designed for geared lifters. Someone benching 225 raw probably doesn’t need to spend a ton of time on board pressing/floor pressing/pin pressing, and yet those are the exercises he will probably pick because that’s what all the big guys are doing (same for Squat and DL variations).
I also don’t think that straight weight DE stuff is all that great for the beginner. I do like DE work with bands and chains, but again many beginners don’t have access to that unless they are at a PL gym. I think they would be better off with an ME day and an RE day, and just trying to put some mass on.
Keep in mind, I trained at a commercial gym for years, and then switched to lifting in my basement. I’ve never really trained at a PL gym, save for a few times, so I don’t know what routine most people are starting with. I’m not anti-Westside by any means. I may even go back to one of my modified versions at some point. But I can tell you that I got better at Squats, Bench and DL by doing Squats, Bench and DL as primary movements, and by doing the other stuff as secondary (supplemental/accessory/whatever).[/quote]
i like westside, i no i started with the basic westside template because from what i read on the internet most people said that westside was the best, so i read all the articles on the westside website, elitefts, anyting to do with westside i bought the book westside book of methods after all that after about a month i stoped doing any DE and started doing RE i agree with you totally on the DE RE stuff i think a noob like myself doesnt need DE work but a advanced lifter would benifit from it. today my training doesnt even look like its westside even though i still maintain i train with they’re methods. i like training westside i tried other training methods 5/3/1 ect but i just dont enjoy doing them so i guess i am a tad biased when i praise westside so much.
when i started i had a point to that post…
this is modi’s thread right??
Westside all the way.
anyone that doesn’t use it is a big VAG!!!
[quote]maraudermeat wrote:
this is modi’s thread right??
Westside all the way.
anyone that doesn’t use it is a big VAG!!![/quote]
Oh yeah. That’s what I meant to say.
I actually still use the Westside template, I just modified it a little for my needs. The first 3 weeks of this cycle were:
Sun: Squat RE + no assistance
Tues: Squat RE + no assistance
Thurs: Squat RE + no assistance
Fri: Squat RE + no assistance
Then the last 4 weeks were:
Sun: Squat RE + no assistance
Tues: Squat RE + no assistance
Fri: Squat RE + no assistance
I threw a couple of Bench maintenance workouts in there, and dropped all DL. Pretty straight forward Westside, just changed a couple things. 
[quote]Modi wrote:
maraudermeat wrote:
this is modi’s thread right??
Westside all the way.
anyone that doesn’t use it is a big VAG!!!
Oh yeah. That’s what I meant to say.
I actually still use the Westside template, I just modified it a little for my needs. The first 3 weeks of this cycle were:
Sun: Squat RE + no assistance
Tues: Squat RE + no assistance
Thurs: Squat RE + no assistance
Fri: Squat RE + no assistance
Then the last 4 weeks were:
Sun: Squat RE + no assistance
Tues: Squat RE + no assistance
Fri: Squat RE + no assistance
I threw a couple of Bench maintenance workouts in there, and dropped all DL. Pretty straight forward Westside, just changed a couple things. ;)[/quote]
you… bastard!!!
[quote]Modi wrote:
maraudermeat wrote:
this is modi’s thread right??
Westside all the way.
anyone that doesn’t use it is a big VAG!!!
Oh yeah. That’s what I meant to say.
I actually still use the Westside template, I just modified it a little for my needs. The first 3 weeks of this cycle were:
Sun: Squat RE + no assistance
Tues: Squat RE + no assistance
Thurs: Squat RE + no assistance
Fri: Squat RE + no assistance
Then the last 4 weeks were:
Sun: Squat RE + no assistance
Tues: Squat RE + no assistance
Fri: Squat RE + no assistance
I threw a couple of Bench maintenance workouts in there, and dropped all DL. Pretty straight forward Westside, just changed a couple things. ;)[/quote]
It’s only really westside when you change it to suit your needs.
I’m doing a heavily modified westside too…
Week 1’s Deadlift RE with 75%
Week 2’s Deadlift RE with 78%
Week 3’s Deadlift RE with 82%
Week 4’s Deload
Then you repeat that with +5% and do the same for all the other lifts too.