I’m just wondering why the anti-French feeling has seemed to spread across the whole country. What exactly have they done wrong recently to warrant such extreme criticism?
They had the temerity to call Bushleague and Co. liars on Iraq and WMD.
But what really stung was when it turned out that they were right all along.
I’m not from the US so I don’t know - Do you REALLY call them freedom fries? How many people? Everybody? Just a few right-wingers? Have restaurants changed their menus? What do you call French toast?
Good question. I admit that Jacques Chiraq did not use the most polite and diplomatic ways in the runup to the Iraq war, but in essence I must agree with his stance on WMD and Iraq. Sure, he is not the cleanest of politicians (OFF scandal)- but who is?
What I don’t get is the extreme reaction on some of the US’s side - renaming dishes for example (btw, “pommes frittes” or French fries are originally Belgian, but never mind…) is simply childish.
I live in the UK, and there is a lot of anti-French feeling here, but none of the hatred I have read in the forums here lately. Perhaps it’s easier to bash a whole people than to address a political topic in a civilised manner. Sad, that is.
Makkun
I totally agree with you Makkun. As an American I must say that calling them “freedom fries” because you feel the French slighted us in some way is the most ignorant, close minded shit I’ve ever heard. As you said, it’s not like they are french anyways. It makes me wonder if some right wing conservative is ordering freedom dressing for his salad. The French have every right to disagree with our foreign policy. While many in the world do loathe the french for their attitudes, hate to say it but americans don’t have a much better world opinion.
It’s not really a phenomenon - no one really takes it seriously. I’m sure a few do, but it’s about as serious as reality television - it’s just a fad. In fact, I haven’t heard a joke about freedom fries in a while - I didn’t realize it was still around.
As is, the French are more than welcome to disagree with the US on foreign policy or anything else for that matter. They often do. And the US, in turn, is free to disagree with their disagreement, and so forth. It’s a two-way street, although some seem to suggest that the rest of the world should have carte blanche on bashing the US but not the other way around.
The US doesn’t owe France some apology. Our affection for the French is about as fickle as their affection for us - listen at any given time to their rants on American pop culture or junk food habits. Underneath all of this lies a dormant Western alliance, but in the meantime, there’ll be a little smacktalk. Always has been, and why would it change?
One of my favorites:
“I’d rather have the German army in front of me than the French army behind me.” -General George S. Patton
We should acknowledge that France is no longer a true ally.
They may not be an enemy, per se. But, friends do not torpedo any chance at negotiation by stating in the U.N., “under no circumstances will we authorize the use of force.”
Any chance for a diplomatic solution died with that sentence.
Saddam knew there would be no U.N. resolution for the use of force after that. Saddam felt that there wouldn’t be the will to enforce the U.N.'s mandates.
He underestimated Bush.
I’m watching the trail of money from the Oil for food scandal very closely.
There is talk of massive bribes up to and including the top of the French Government.
This is going to be very interesting/infuriating before it’s all over.
If people are serious about a responsible world body, there needs to be reform. At the bare minimum, the U.N. Security counsel needs to be reshuffled.
JeffR
[quote]T-chick wrote:
I’m not from the US so I don’t know - Do you REALLY call them freedom fries? How many people? Everybody? Just a few right-wingers? Have restaurants changed their menus? What do you call French toast?[/quote]
I guess you could call me a right-winger, but nobody has at any point seriously called them french fries. It was basically just a funny joke, funny because nobody likes the french regardless of political views and loves to make fun of them.
Thunderbolt,
[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:
…
“I’d rather have the German army in front of me than the French army behind me.” -General George S. Patton[/quote]
Funny, that one. 
JeffR,
you’re right - a UN reform is very necessary, and it is being undertaken, as Kofi Annan requested a list of recommendations last year already, which he presented last week. They talk about the Security Council especially.
RepubCarrier,
I would not be so sure - read the “The French” thread; there is a lot of strong emotion here, and it is definitely not only in good spirit.
Makkun
For me, I simply hate anyone who hates me first. Especially when the hatred is unsubstantiated. That and the fact that there is going to be a lot of press in the coming weeks on the topic of the French government and the Oil-for-Food scandal. I believe the French are eyeball deep in this mess.
Now let me go so I can freedom kiss my freedom poodle after I get her sloshed on freedom wine. Freedom dressing, freedom toast etc., etc.
[quote]tme wrote:
They had the temerity to call Bushleague and Co. liars on Iraq and WMD.
But what really stung was when it turned out that they were right all along.[/quote]
You keep believing that, tme.
[quote]derek wrote:
tme wrote:
They had the temerity to call Bushleague and Co. liars on Iraq and WMD.
But what really stung was when it turned out that they were right all along.
You keep believing that, tme.[/quote]
Yeah tme, you keep believing the truth and see where it gets ya! lol
[quote]T-chick wrote:
Do you REALLY call them freedom fries?[/quote]
The “freedom fries” moniker was a proposal introduced in Congress to change the menu in the Congressional cafeteria. Even Congress didn’t take it seriously. At any given point in time, there are several just plain STUPID matters before Congress, and this was one of them.
Unfortunately, while these matters do serve a useful purpose in the political process, it is virtually impossible to explain what that purpose is to anyone’s satisfaction. If you don’t get it, you don’t get it. The way things work in D.C. commonly defies logic, in very much the same way the land of Oz defies logic – it does make sense, after its own twisted fashion, but it’s not the kind of sense you think it is.
Somewhere along the line, Americans have forgotten that government is by nature an absurd process, and they get stuck expecting the process to be sensible in the usual way. Which it isn’t, so it confuses them.
I just watched a History Channel program on Dunkirk. Great story.
Something interesting I took away. The British fought a tough battle. When they told the French they were evacuating ,rather then help the British they said they were going to close the ports so they couldn’t leave.
In fact the French actually fought with the British about the evacuation. The British expected the French would fight a rear guard. They didn’t want too. They argued that French troops should be allowed to leave with the British rather then follow them. Geez go figure.
I don’t know alot about this battle other then what I saw on this program so I am no expert. Just seems that the stereotype on the French military was based in fact.