Geez guys is the world this dangerous to you all? Unless someone is pulling a gun, and you don’t have one, the world and other men are not that scary 
You boys need to relax. I thought we had a bunch of pitbulls here (at least from the tenor of most of the “Tman” postings in these forums) and lo and behold, we have a bunch of nervous, pacing, staring, hair raised, ears pinned back chihuahuas Maybe that’s why there is such a quest to get “swolled” - to scare the other mean boys at school?
[quote]Edgy wrote:
[quote]Hallowed wrote:
When I am in public alone I walk with purpose.
and keep my sunglasses on.
Its probably uber defensive and its to keep away frakking perverts.[/quote]
Hypocrite~
(JK)[/quote]
Well, you’re right.
I must correct: Its to keep away perverts I’m not attracted to 
[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
Geez guys is the world this dangerous to you all? Unless someone is pulling a gun, and you don’t have one, the world and other men are not that scary You boys need to relax. I thought we had a bunch of pitbulls here (at least from the tenor of most of the “Tman” postings in these forums) and lo and behold, we have a bunch of nervous, pacing, staring, hair raised, ears pinned back chihuahuas Maybe that’s why there is such a quest to get “swolled” - to scare the other mean boys at school?[/quote]
You didn’t get that from my post, BG.
There’s a status struggle going on in this thread.
[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
I also find that when “making a deal” closing in on personal space, when done correctly, is helpful. You bring their gaurd up, break it down, give control of it back to them but own it psychologically. It’s very key.
[/quote]
If you did this to me, I wouldn’t like it and I’d probably not like you after it. And I would be unlikely to do business with you unless I had to. Real talk. You cannot bring my guard up, and bring it back down and/or otherwise “take control”. If you made my guard go up, you are no longer in control of bringing it back down.
Of course, the sheeple of the world may be different, who knows.[/quote]
Yep.
I don’t like it when people I don’t know get too close to me in general, and I especially don’t like when people walk directly behind me on the street. I’ll take pains to avoid that.
When I watch people doing that “alpha” type shit - ESPECIALLY when it’s pre-organized, i.e. sitting in a certain place, or using body language for whatever purpose, I tend to think they’re douchebags with small penises, and I immediately lose respect for them.
[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:
I see females in my neighborhood jogging in the evening. They’re wearing headphones. Stupid.[/quote]
I do that all the time but I live in Pleasantville.
[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
I also find that when “making a deal” closing in on personal space, when done correctly, is helpful. You bring their gaurd up, break it down, give control of it back to them but own it psychologically. It’s very key.
[/quote]
If you did this to me, I wouldn’t like it and I’d probably not like you after it. And I would be unlikely to do business with you unless I had to. Real talk. You cannot bring my guard up, and bring it back down and/or otherwise “take control”. If you made my guard go up, you are no longer in control of bringing it back down.
Of course, the sheeple of the world may be different, who knows.[/quote]
You can’t win them all.
Any salesman/broker/business developer what have you worth his salt knows that if he isn’t in control he isn’t going to close.
The art of it is breaking down barriers subtly. A shoulder slap with a joke, leaning in to emphasize points and out to relax the tension that always surrounds a purchase agreement et cetera, you don’t start an arm wrestling match or punch him in the face. Unless maybe you are “muscleing” them but I don’t know much about that.
You don’t even realize it’s happening if done right. A bad salesmen can really butcher it though, think used car or door to door insurance. Mis-applied sales psychology 101.
But, if someone is resisting at every turn, you cut your losses and move on, which is the numbers game aspect of it.
[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
I also find that when “making a deal” closing in on personal space, when done correctly, is helpful. You bring their gaurd up, break it down, give control of it back to them but own it psychologically. It’s very key.
[/quote]
If you did this to me, I wouldn’t like it and I’d probably not like you after it. And I would be unlikely to do business with you unless I had to. Real talk. You cannot bring my guard up, and bring it back down and/or otherwise “take control”. If you made my guard go up, you are no longer in control of bringing it back down.
Of course, the sheeple of the world may be different, who knows.[/quote]
Yep.
I don’t like it when people I don’t know get too close to me in general, and I especially don’t like when people walk directly behind me on the street. I’ll take pains to avoid that.
When I watch people doing that “alpha” type shit - ESPECIALLY when it’s pre-organized, i.e. sitting in a certain place, or using body language for whatever purpose, I tend to think they’re douchebags with small penises, and I immediately lose respect for them.[/quote]
Except in a sales scenario they never really respect you outside of basic business ethics, only your wallet. And they are doing what they do because it significantly increases their closing ratio and consequently wallet size, which is the end game, not your personal respect or friendship. And, if you stiffen up yourself and become the “threatened” douche bag in the process, so be it. Next prospect!
Plus, just like I wrote to BG, you wouldn’t even realize it if it was done right. Just saying.
(Huff and haw, you see right through it and come to your own conclusions, blah blah blah, I see C-level executives and up on a regular, very alpha by nature, and walk out of their “house” time and again with the outcome being pre-planned and executed. So do countless other brokers and high level biz development folks)
[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
Geez guys is the world this dangerous to you all? Unless someone is pulling a gun, and you don’t have one, the world and other men are not that scary You boys need to relax. I thought we had a bunch of pitbulls here (at least from the tenor of most of the “Tman” postings in these forums) and lo and behold, we have a bunch of nervous, pacing, staring, hair raised, ears pinned back chihuahuas Maybe that’s why there is such a quest to get “swolled” - to scare the other mean boys at school?[/quote]
Totally agree with you. I only ever get the ‘beast mode activated command’ when somebody is coming at me, not when they are just around.
Jesus guys get a grip!
[quote]Marzouk wrote:
Totally agree with you. I only ever get the ‘beast mode activated command’ when somebody is coming at me, not when they are just around.
Jesus guys get a grip![/quote]
You ever been in a situation where you are surrounded by people who want to and would kill you if given half the chance? When you’ve been in those situations A LOT and have been trained to know what to look for/how to avoid it, you dont ever stop doing those things. Its not paranoia its called “situational awareness” and it becomes second nature.
[quote]gregron wrote:
[quote]Marzouk wrote:
Totally agree with you. I only ever get the ‘beast mode activated command’ when somebody is coming at me, not when they are just around.
Jesus guys get a grip![/quote]
You ever been in a situation where you are surrounded by people who want to and would kill you if given half the chance? When you’ve been in those situations A LOT and have been trained to know what to look for/how to avoid it, you dont ever stop doing those things. Its not paranoia its called “situational awareness” and it becomes second nature.[/quote]
I see where your coming from if you’ve been trained to act like that,
when this kind of thing happened to you was it pre or post moustache ;)?
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
I also find that when “making a deal” closing in on personal space, when done correctly, is helpful. You bring their gaurd up, break it down, give control of it back to them but own it psychologically. It’s very key.
[/quote]
If you did this to me, I wouldn’t like it and I’d probably not like you after it. And I would be unlikely to do business with you unless I had to. Real talk. You cannot bring my guard up, and bring it back down and/or otherwise “take control”. If you made my guard go up, you are no longer in control of bringing it back down.
Of course, the sheeple of the world may be different, who knows.[/quote]
You can’t win them all.
Any salesman/broker/business developer what have you worth his salt knows that if he isn’t in control he isn’t going to close.
The art of it is breaking down barriers subtly. A shoulder slap with a joke, leaning in to emphasize points and out to relax the tension that always surrounds a purchase agreement et cetera, you don’t start an arm wrestling match or punch him in the face. Unless maybe you are “muscleing” them but I don’t know much about that.
You don’t even realize it’s happening if done right. A bad salesmen can really butcher it though, think used car or door to door insurance. Mis-applied sales psychology 101.
But, if someone is resisting at every turn, you cut your losses and move on, which is the numbers game aspect of it.[/quote]
the minute you invade my personal space in a orchestrated move, you lost me. and I do know when you’re doing it. as I said in another thread; “likeability” is king. you can raise all the BS psychology you want, but people are “closed” upon b/c they like and/or trust someone. any other close is just forced, and will often result in the deal falling thru or no repeat business. if I like you, and I trust you, and you have the product I want, I’m a buyer - and NO amount of “salesmanship 101” can change that algebra. and trust me, if you lean in and invade my space in an orchestrated shoulder slap that is inconsistent with our relationship or the meeting, I think “oily salesman”.
I’m not intending to argue with you, just giving you another perspective which is another tool in your tool box if you’re a smart businessman/salesman
[quote]gregron wrote:
[quote]Marzouk wrote:
Totally agree with you. I only ever get the ‘beast mode activated command’ when somebody is coming at me, not when they are just around.
Jesus guys get a grip![/quote]
You ever been in a situation where you are surrounded by people who want to and would kill you if given half the chance? When you’ve been in those situations A LOT and have been trained to know what to look for/how to avoid it, you dont ever stop doing those things. Its not paranoia its called “situational awareness” and it becomes second nature.[/quote]
LOL Greg. Yeah to the above. I’m in Camden NJ a few times a week. And, I’m a “white boy”. And, let’s not forget my personal protection and security past. “Situational awareness” is one thing when it’s warranted and I always have it. Always. I don’t ever slip. And I can see shit coming from a mile away like I got the telegram. But guess what? The way it’s being described here by some sounds a lot to me like the little nervous dog.
But really Greg, do you think the average person has ever been surrounded by people itching to kill them if given half the chance? Because your audience here IS the “average person”. And they sound awfully nervous to me, but I knew that before this thread. I’m a man, aware of the insecurities of other men.
Male insecurity is the biggest cause of the following male diseases, syndromes and disorders; “I wanna get swole disease”, “me and my boys speech disorder”, “static inhale syndrome”, the well known “imaginary lat syndrome”, “the manson stare disease”, “rigid bicep/tricep muscle disorder”, “clenched jaw syndrome”, “I’m not moving out of your way disorder”, “I walk like this b/c I was shot in the leg once gait adjustment disorder”, “I’m trying to make my traps look bigger syndrome”.
All the above are identical to “hair raised”, “curled lip”, “snarling”, “baring teeth”, “barking”, “growling”, “arched back”, etc., all better known as “threat displays”.
Threat displays do not = “situational awareness”.
[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
I also find that when “making a deal” closing in on personal space, when done correctly, is helpful. You bring their gaurd up, break it down, give control of it back to them but own it psychologically. It’s very key.
[/quote]
If you did this to me, I wouldn’t like it and I’d probably not like you after it. And I would be unlikely to do business with you unless I had to. Real talk. You cannot bring my guard up, and bring it back down and/or otherwise “take control”. If you made my guard go up, you are no longer in control of bringing it back down.
Of course, the sheeple of the world may be different, who knows.[/quote]
You can’t win them all.
Any salesman/broker/business developer what have you worth his salt knows that if he isn’t in control he isn’t going to close.
The art of it is breaking down barriers subtly. A shoulder slap with a joke, leaning in to emphasize points and out to relax the tension that always surrounds a purchase agreement et cetera, you don’t start an arm wrestling match or punch him in the face. Unless maybe you are “muscleing” them but I don’t know much about that.
You don’t even realize it’s happening if done right. A bad salesmen can really butcher it though, think used car or door to door insurance. Mis-applied sales psychology 101.
But, if someone is resisting at every turn, you cut your losses and move on, which is the numbers game aspect of it.[/quote]
the minute you invade my personal space in a orchestrated move, you lost me. and I do know when you’re doing it. as I said in another thread; “likeability” is king. you can raise all the BS psychology you want, but people are “closed” upon b/c they like and/or trust someone. any other close is just forced, and will often result in the deal falling thru or no repeat business. if I like you, and I trust you, and you have the product I want, I’m a buyer - and NO amount of “salesmanship 101” can change that algebra. and trust me, if you lean in and invade my space in an orchestrated shoulder slap that is inconsistent with our relationship or the meeting, I think “oily salesman”.
I’m not intending to argue with you, just giving you another perspective which is another tool in your tool box if you’re a smart businessman/salesman
[/quote]
except its not sales 101. Your space would be invaded while your likeability factor grew. It’s easy to pick sales apart from the back end. You wouldn’t know a good pitch if it slapped you in the face bc it wouldn’t feel like one. Believe all the psychology would be there though, discreetly. A bad pitch with an over eager salesmen leaves you oily.
I didnt read everything but i did see “situational awareness” thrown around. Im all about that. Sure I know whats going on around me, am i always scheming something not necessarily, do i know exit routes, ya bet your ass i do. do i like people all up in my personal space, obviously not. Break this down people, a lot of it should be common sense. If someone is acting odd coming at you, etc, yeah get defensive, otherwise just be aware.
One thing my old man taught me, probably the only thing lol which some people dont agree with is try to sit facing the door with a wall at your back. i for one did not grow up in an atmosphere where that is necessary, his father taught it to him, where he was most definitely in situations where that was necessary. I started it as a young in to be like dad when i asked why he did it once, and its just stuck with me.
[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
Geez guys is the world this dangerous to you all? Unless someone is pulling a gun, and you don’t have one, the world and other men are not that scary You boys need to relax. I thought we had a bunch of pitbulls here (at least from the tenor of most of the “Tman” postings in these forums) and lo and behold, we have a bunch of nervous, pacing, staring, hair raised, ears pinned back chihuahuas Maybe that’s why there is such a quest to get “swolled” - to scare the other mean boys at school?[/quote]
Until I read this, I thought the zombie apocalyse was on or some related undead invasion. Do you people who posture and stare down everyone live on a street with rival drug cartels at each end?
[quote]Hallowed wrote:
When I am in public alone I walk with purpose.
and keep my sunglasses on.
Its probably uber defensive and its to keep away frakking perverts.[/quote]
Fucking sunglasses, they cock block the eye sex.
For the record if I ever saw gregron in public I’d size up his stache then feel ashamed.
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
I also find that when “making a deal” closing in on personal space, when done correctly, is helpful. You bring their gaurd up, break it down, give control of it back to them but own it psychologically. It’s very key.
[/quote]
If you did this to me, I wouldn’t like it and I’d probably not like you after it. And I would be unlikely to do business with you unless I had to. Real talk. You cannot bring my guard up, and bring it back down and/or otherwise “take control”. If you made my guard go up, you are no longer in control of bringing it back down.
Of course, the sheeple of the world may be different, who knows.[/quote]
You can’t win them all.
Any salesman/broker/business developer what have you worth his salt knows that if he isn’t in control he isn’t going to close.
The art of it is breaking down barriers subtly. A shoulder slap with a joke, leaning in to emphasize points and out to relax the tension that always surrounds a purchase agreement et cetera, you don’t start an arm wrestling match or punch him in the face. Unless maybe you are “muscleing” them but I don’t know much about that.
You don’t even realize it’s happening if done right. A bad salesmen can really butcher it though, think used car or door to door insurance. Mis-applied sales psychology 101.
But, if someone is resisting at every turn, you cut your losses and move on, which is the numbers game aspect of it.[/quote]
the minute you invade my personal space in a orchestrated move, you lost me. and I do know when you’re doing it. as I said in another thread; “likeability” is king. you can raise all the BS psychology you want, but people are “closed” upon b/c they like and/or trust someone. any other close is just forced, and will often result in the deal falling thru or no repeat business. if I like you, and I trust you, and you have the product I want, I’m a buyer - and NO amount of “salesmanship 101” can change that algebra. and trust me, if you lean in and invade my space in an orchestrated shoulder slap that is inconsistent with our relationship or the meeting, I think “oily salesman”.
I’m not intending to argue with you, just giving you another perspective which is another tool in your tool box if you’re a smart businessman/salesman
[/quote]
except its not sales 101. Your space would be invaded while your likeability factor grew. It’s easy to pick sales apart from the back end. You wouldn’t know a good pitch if it slapped you in the face bc it wouldn’t feel like one. Believe all the psychology would be there though, discreetly. A bad pitch with an over eager salesmen leaves you oily. [/quote]
you greatly underestimate me, and perhaps overestimate yourself; I see all the pitches. I think you underestimate other people too.
I recently purchased a car. Guy probably thought he “pitched” and “closed” me. He was the kind of has-been old timer you complained about in another post. I can’t help but to think he was talking up how he “closed the deal with me” to his boss. Fact is, I didn’t like him much, thought he was pathetic in a harmless way, but he had what I needed.
Had. What. I. Needed.
Sometimes you sell in spite of yourself.
[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
I also find that when “making a deal” closing in on personal space, when done correctly, is helpful. You bring their gaurd up, break it down, give control of it back to them but own it psychologically. It’s very key.
[/quote]
If you did this to me, I wouldn’t like it and I’d probably not like you after it. And I would be unlikely to do business with you unless I had to. Real talk. You cannot bring my guard up, and bring it back down and/or otherwise “take control”. If you made my guard go up, you are no longer in control of bringing it back down.
Of course, the sheeple of the world may be different, who knows.[/quote]
You can’t win them all.
Any salesman/broker/business developer what have you worth his salt knows that if he isn’t in control he isn’t going to close.
The art of it is breaking down barriers subtly. A shoulder slap with a joke, leaning in to emphasize points and out to relax the tension that always surrounds a purchase agreement et cetera, you don’t start an arm wrestling match or punch him in the face. Unless maybe you are “muscleing” them but I don’t know much about that.
You don’t even realize it’s happening if done right. A bad salesmen can really butcher it though, think used car or door to door insurance. Mis-applied sales psychology 101.
But, if someone is resisting at every turn, you cut your losses and move on, which is the numbers game aspect of it.[/quote]
the minute you invade my personal space in a orchestrated move, you lost me. and I do know when you’re doing it. as I said in another thread; “likeability” is king. you can raise all the BS psychology you want, but people are “closed” upon b/c they like and/or trust someone. any other close is just forced, and will often result in the deal falling thru or no repeat business. if I like you, and I trust you, and you have the product I want, I’m a buyer - and NO amount of “salesmanship 101” can change that algebra. and trust me, if you lean in and invade my space in an orchestrated shoulder slap that is inconsistent with our relationship or the meeting, I think “oily salesman”.
I’m not intending to argue with you, just giving you another perspective which is another tool in your tool box if you’re a smart businessman/salesman
[/quote]
except its not sales 101. Your space would be invaded while your likeability factor grew. It’s easy to pick sales apart from the back end. You wouldn’t know a good pitch if it slapped you in the face bc it wouldn’t feel like one. Believe all the psychology would be there though, discreetly. A bad pitch with an over eager salesmen leaves you oily. [/quote]
you greatly underestimate me, and perhaps overestimate yourself; I see all the pitches. I think you underestimate other people too.
I recently purchased a car. Guy probably thought he “pitched” and “closed” me. He was the kind of has-been old timer you complained about in another post. I can’t help but to think he was talking up how he “closed the deal with me” to his boss. Fact is, I didn’t like him much, thought he was pathetic in a harmless way, but he had what I needed.
Had. What. I. Needed.
Sometimes you sell in spite of yourself.
[/quote]
I hear what you are saying, I really do. But you are comparing a car salesmen to a money broker who wins contracts from directors and VPs of very large banks, apples and oranges even if both are technically sales.
I do understand the need for likeability, rapport, connection, a solid product fitting a need and the sales psychology that ties in all together for a commitment.
When delivered correctly, the key caveat, your gaurd will be up, down and owned without your knowledge. It’s like voodoo magic shit.
Sometimes people call it, usually sales people themselves. I’m not talking about misplaced and awkard back slaps. Hell a handshake and an offer of a bottle of water starts the process off. Totally subtle.
Just for the sake of interest, because life is a sales game in many ways, you should read books on sales psychology along with your other philosophies. It’s very interesting.
One book I really like, a little around the bush but still relevant, is called The Tipping Point. Was very trendy to read years ago but taps in to the psychology I’m talking about. Very subtle, if done right. If done right. If done…