[quote]Zhelezen wrote:
I believe I am. Toes are out about 45 degrees and I try to have the knees follow out the same way. Even with just the bar I get the same pain. It makes it hard to hit depth (although I do get there) and I think it’s sapping a whole lot of strength out my squat, because even with just the bar it’s so hard to get out of the hole.
Front squats are no problem.[/quote]
post a video so i can look for form issues or imbalances.
thanks meat, here is a vid for a form check
[quote]Zhelezen wrote:
thanks meat, here is a vid for a form check
form looks pretty good. i can’t really see anything, form wise, that would cause an issue. i would suggest doing some stretching after you squat workouts. stuff like hurdler stretches with one leg or even both legs bent. if that doesn’t releave the tightness, it may be a case of another muscle group causing the tightness. the best bet then would be to find a good ART practioner in your area.
good luck.
Meat - thanks for the tip on the front squat from pins. I took my stance in as you suggested and pushed 10 more pounds from below parallel than last time. I be stoked.
[quote]DaCharmingAlbino wrote:
Meat - thanks for the tip on the front squat from pins. I took my stance in as you suggested and pushed 10 more pounds from below parallel than last time. I be stoked.[/quote]
no problem bro…
i’ve been watching your training closely. you are much like me. you think about every angle of it all. it’s no suprise that you’ve been hitting so many PR’s.
[quote]Zhelezen wrote:
I believe I am. Toes are out about 45 degrees and I try to have the knees follow out the same way. Even with just the bar I get the same pain. It makes it hard to hit depth (although I do get there) and I think it’s sapping a whole lot of strength out my squat, because even with just the bar it’s so hard to get out of the hole.
Front squats are no problem.[/quote]
I had the exact same problem mine was from a lack of hip drive I’m not sure what yours is from it might be the same.
I took some time off from back squats and did a cycle of front squats. Do some deep massages with a tennis ball lots of pre-squat dynamic stretches. Like meat said hurtle stretches I did them every morning and every evening. It was better in about a month.
watch this to make sure youre hip drive is right on
that
[quote]ballsout wrote:
Zhelezen wrote:
I believe I am. Toes are out about 45 degrees and I try to have the knees follow out the same way. Even with just the bar I get the same pain. It makes it hard to hit depth (although I do get there) and I think it’s sapping a whole lot of strength out my squat, because even with just the bar it’s so hard to get out of the hole.
Front squats are no problem.
I had the exact same problem mine was from a lack of hip drive I’m not sure what yours is from it might be the same.
I took some time off from back squats and did a cycle of front squats. Do some deep massages with a tennis ball lots of pre-squat dynamic stretches. Like meat said hurtle stretches I did them every morning and every evening. It was better in about a month.
watch this to make sure youre hip drive is right on
that
[/quote]
you know, I’m pretty sure that video’s where I got the idea that I should be leading with my ass out of the hole. Meat? Rippetoe seems to almost contradict what you told me. He even tells the kid not to keep his chest out in the hole, and to “get his elbows up” at which the kid actually brings his elbows back.
[quote]mcl wrote:
ballsout wrote:
Zhelezen wrote:
I believe I am. Toes are out about 45 degrees and I try to have the knees follow out the same way. Even with just the bar I get the same pain. It makes it hard to hit depth (although I do get there) and I think it’s sapping a whole lot of strength out my squat, because even with just the bar it’s so hard to get out of the hole.
Front squats are no problem.
I had the exact same problem mine was from a lack of hip drive I’m not sure what yours is from it might be the same.
I took some time off from back squats and did a cycle of front squats. Do some deep massages with a tennis ball lots of pre-squat dynamic stretches. Like meat said hurtle stretches I did them every morning and every evening. It was better in about a month.
watch this to make sure youre hip drive is right on
that
you know, I’m pretty sure that video’s where I got the idea that I should be leading with my ass out of the hole. Meat? Rippetoe seems to almost contradict what you told me. He even tells the kid not to keep his chest out in the hole, and to “get his elbows up” at which the kid actually brings his elbows back.[/quote]
as i’ve said before, Rippetoe’s view on things, specifically the squat, and mine aren’t the same. i tell people all the time- listen to everyone, give it a try, use what works and get rid of the rest.
what can i say??
just curious… does anyone know how much Ripptoe squats raw??
i just watched that vid and there are a few things i don’t agree with- driving the hips up instead of forward. the way i squat and teach others is as you come out of the hole, you lead with the head, then the chest and finally the hips come forward… not up. the way he teaches has that bar out in front of the hips, not over them. i believe the squat revolves around arm placement. if you can get your elbows under the bar and locked into place, the rest of the body will follow, especially out of the hole.
i just posted a vid of my squat tonight. not to brag, but my squat is pretty much up and down with the elbow directly under the bar and the bar is centered square over my hips. it’s just like a piston… up and down. all power. it’s taken a long time to master the technique but once mastered it’s bullet proof.
i do argee with one thing… pointing the toes out and having the knees track out over them… that’s about it though.
[quote]maraudermeat wrote:
DaCharmingAlbino wrote:
Meat - thanks for the tip on the front squat from pins. I took my stance in as you suggested and pushed 10 more pounds from below parallel than last time. I be stoked.
no problem bro…
i’ve been watching your training closely. you are much like me. you think about every angle of it all. it’s no suprise that you’ve been hitting so many PR’s.
[/quote]
Oh - Something I think I should mention: I’ve started taking the weight down slow on the eccentric portion of squats. Last squat session from 335 to 395 I just took my time getting down in the hole and I felt a whole lot more stable for it. I had been dive-bombing the hole and I think the effort of slowing the weight, turning it around and consequent restabilizing was robbing me of some pounds and screwing my form. Didn’t have any problem getting back out, the stretch reflex worked just as well as if I had descended quickly. Got the idea from watching (really watching) your vids and Stan Efferding’s who also descends slowly (and with a lot of growling). I skipped the growling part, myself.
[quote]maraudermeat wrote:
i just watched that vid and there are a few things i don’t agree with- driving the hips up instead of forward. the way i squat and teach others is as you come out of the hole, you lead with the head, then the chest and finally the hips come forward… not up. the way he teaches has that bar out in front of the hips, not over them. i believe the squat revolves around arm placement. if you can get your elbows under the bar and locked into place, the rest of the body will follow, especially out of the hole.
i just posted a vid of my squat tonight. not to brag, but my squat is pretty much up and down with the elbow directly under the bar and the bar is centered square over my hips. it’s just like a piston… up and down. all power. it’s taken a long time to master the technique but once mastered it’s bullet proof.
i do argee with one thing… pointing the toes out and having the knees track out over them… that’s about it though. [/quote]
Meat-
When I watched the Rippetoe video, two things jumped out at me…both of them, I think, because my body wants to do it his way and I fight to get closer to yours.
Meat, thanks for the squat feedback. I have been working on it and my squats are improving. Now, can I get some help with bench? Thanks in advance,
Jack
[quote]jjackkrash wrote:
Meat, thanks for the squat feedback. I have been working on it and my squats are improving. Now, can I get some help with bench? Thanks in advance,
Jack
i prefer a near max attempt when assessing form. your form will always break down on a high rep set. with that said, i do see some issues though.
as the set goes on, your feet move around. this is a sure sign that you aren’t getting nearly tight enough. not that my bench is perfect, but watch any of my bench vids and you will see that my feet are planted. the reason- i get them so far back under me that they can’t move. if they move around, you aren’t using them for leg drive. so… you when you set up, you need to experiment with getting your feet back farther. if you want to go the flat footed way then you should force them back far enough that when you force you heels down, they then touch the floor. if you aren’t actively forcing your heals down, they should come up. basically, your feet shouldn’t be able to just sit flat without you actively keeping the heels down.
along the same lines, you aren’t getting the upper back arched enough. this just clicked with one of my training partner. he was guilty of just lowering the weight, not rowing it down. when you setup you want to push your body up onto your traps and then contract your scapulas together the entire time. my goal is to make them cramp during my set. so while your sitting there reading this pull your scaps together and flex hard. that is the position you need to be in while you bench. this is especially important when lowering the weight. if you are flexing really hard, it really makes it hard to get that bar down to you. it’s funny when i see the looks on people’s faces when i bench. i actually have to PULL 135-225 down to me. it won’t come down to my chest unless i actively pull it down. if you aren’t feeling this with the bar or even 135, then you aren’t flexing the back. this is what is knows as rowing the weight to you. when done right, the weight should feel weightless (well… almost) when it’s at your chest.
the other thing that jumps out at me is that you are flaring right off the chest. some would jump and say that it’s weak triceps… i don’t think so. i think it’s a case of not rowing the weight down to a lower spot on your chest. are you seeing how all this shit works together? if you don’t setup right you can’t retract the scaps and flex the lats. if you can’t retract the scaps and flex the lats you won’t row the weight don’t. if you don’t row the weight down it will come down high on the chest. if the weight comes down high on the chest then the elbows will flare early off the chest. so, row the bar lower on your chest and hopefully that will keep you from flaring so early.
get a vid of a near max attempt and try the things i just mentioned. remember…if your setup isn’t painfull and you don’t feel like you are going to cramp up, you aren’t nearly tight enough.
[quote]maraudermeat wrote:
jjackkrash wrote:
Meat, thanks for the squat feedback. I have been working on it and my squats are improving. Now, can I get some help with bench? Thanks in advance,
Jack
i prefer a near max attempt when assessing form. your form will always break down on a high rep set. with that said, i do see some issues though.
as the set goes on, your feet move around. this is a sure sign that you aren’t getting nearly tight enough. not that my bench is perfect, but watch any of my bench vids and you will see that my feet are planted. the reason- i get them so far back under me that they can’t move. if they move around, you aren’t using them for leg drive. so… you when you set up, you need to experiment with getting your feet back farther. if you want to go the flat footed way then you should force them back far enough that when you force you heels down, they then touch the floor. if you aren’t actively forcing your heals down, they should come up. basically, your feet shouldn’t be able to just sit flat without you actively keeping the heels down.
along the same lines, you aren’t getting the upper back arched enough. this just clicked with one of my training partner. he was guilty of just lowering the weight, not rowing it down. when you setup you want to push your body up onto your traps and then contract your scapulas together the entire time. my goal is to make them cramp during my set. so while your sitting there reading this pull your scaps together and flex hard. that is the position you need to be in while you bench. this is especially important when lowering the weight. if you are flexing really hard, it really makes it hard to get that bar down to you. it’s funny when i see the looks on people’s faces when i bench. i actually have to PULL 135-225 down to me. it won’t come down to my chest unless i actively pull it down. if you aren’t feeling this with the bar or even 135, then you aren’t flexing the back. this is what is knows as rowing the weight to you. when done right, the weight should feel weightless (well… almost) when it’s at your chest.
the other thing that jumps out at me is that you are flaring right off the chest. some would jump and say that it’s weak triceps… i don’t think so. i think it’s a case of not rowing the weight down to a lower spot on your chest. are you seeing how all this shit works together? if you don’t setup right you can’t retract the scaps and flex the lats. if you can’t retract the scaps and flex the lats you won’t row the weight don’t. if you don’t row the weight down it will come down high on the chest. if the weight comes down high on the chest then the elbows will flare early off the chest. so, row the bar lower on your chest and hopefully that will keep you from flaring so early.
get a vid of a near max attempt and try the things i just mentioned. remember…if your setup isn’t painfull and you don’t feel like you are going to cramp up, you aren’t nearly tight enough. [/quote]
Wow. Alot to digest. I am set to test a max single at the end of the next cycle. I’ll work on this in the meantime and report back later. Thanks again for all your help.
hey bro,
id love to get my deadlift form bang on, can you help?
hey bro,
id love to get my deadlift form bang on, can you help?
Thanks for your previous comments on my bench form. Per your instructions, here are 4 singles closer to my max. I tried to implement your instructions, but I still don’t feel like I am rowing the bar to my chest, although my arch and foot stability felt better. Thanks in advance for your help, any comments are appreciated.
225 x1,
250 x1,
275 x1 (Lifetime PR +20)
300 fail
[quote]paul496 wrote:
hey bro,
id love to get my deadlift form bang on, can you help?
what jumps out at me the most is your starting position. as a rule of thumb, the shoulders should be directly over the bar. as you can see from the vid, your shoulders start way in front of the bar. this then leads to the hips rising too soon and the lower back rounding.
when pulling conventional, i stand about 4 inches back away from the bar. that way, when i bend down my shins are then touching the bar.
have someone watch you set up and when you are able to bend down and have your shoulders over the bar, i think that will take care of the hips rising fast and the rounded lower back.
try that and get another vid.
[quote]jjackkrash wrote:
Thanks for your previous comments on my bench form. Per your instructions, here are 4 singles closer to my max. I tried to implement your instructions, but I still don’t feel like I am rowing the bar to my chest, although my arch and foot stability felt better. Thanks in advance for your help, any comments are appreciated.
225 x1,
250 x1,
275 x1 (Lifetime PR +20)
300 fail
[/quote]
first off… congratulations on the PR.
yeah… you aren’t getting the back tight and flexing the lats. this leads to the premature flaring and inconsitant bar path.
try this. sitting at your computer, put your hands in front of you like you are laying on the bench and the bar is in your hands. contract the middle of your back and try to pull your scapulas together. the entire time contract your lats. now with your lats contracted, back arched and scaps retracted, try to lower your arms as if you were lowering a bar to your chest. it should be almost impossible to lower your arms more than a couple inches. this is what is known as rowing the bar down.
also, you really need to get a lift off on the heavy sets. there’s no way to get up onto your traps and contract your lats.
keep at it.