Fedor : Spoiler

Bigger Stronger Leaner
21

[quote]silkyhorse wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:
Didn’t watch the fight live, just caught the replay, but people need to stop discrediting Fedor and start applauding Werdum. He capaitalized on a mistake made by a guy who’s made a career out of being damn near infallible. Who knows why Fedor was so “careless” when he’s normally so precise, and really, who cares? It takes absolutely nothing away from what he’s done, or what he still could potentially do. It’s also funny listening to these guys who say “I knew it was gonna happen” or “He looked different at the press conference”… Bullshit. Any fighter can lose on any given night. Of course it was bound to happen. And he looked the exact same as he always does: sleepy, disinterested and looking like he wants a peanutbutter and jelly sandwich. He made a mistake, Werdum caught it, Fedor lost, life moves on. I am interested to see what he does next though.[/quote]
I don’t see Werdum win bigger than Fedors loss.[/quote]

Of course a loss by a guy who’s been dominant for damn near a decade is bigger news than a win by a guy who’s been somewhat inconsistent to this point. I’m just saying people are completely ignoring Werdum’s win and are focusing on Fedor’s loss, and that sucks for Werdum. People need to give him credit.

22

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]silkyhorse wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:
Didn’t watch the fight live, just caught the replay, but people need to stop discrediting Fedor and start applauding Werdum. He capaitalized on a mistake made by a guy who’s made a career out of being damn near infallible. Who knows why Fedor was so “careless” when he’s normally so precise, and really, who cares? It takes absolutely nothing away from what he’s done, or what he still could potentially do. It’s also funny listening to these guys who say “I knew it was gonna happen” or “He looked different at the press conference”… Bullshit. Any fighter can lose on any given night. Of course it was bound to happen. And he looked the exact same as he always does: sleepy, disinterested and looking like he wants a peanutbutter and jelly sandwich. He made a mistake, Werdum caught it, Fedor lost, life moves on. I am interested to see what he does next though.[/quote]
I don’t see Werdum win bigger than Fedors loss.[/quote]

Of course a loss by a guy who’s been dominant for damn near a decade is bigger news than a win by a guy who’s been somewhat inconsistent to this point. I’m just saying people are completely ignoring Werdum’s win and are focusing on Fedor’s loss, and that sucks for Werdum. People need to give him credit.[/quote]

this is true, werdum capitalized with a textbook triangle armbar…if we’re going for a deeper analysis, if you watch the fight again, there is a point where fedor is trying to stack/spin around the right side of werdums guard but runs out of room as the cage is there. i think this is where the mistake was made, and why fedor looked like he got sloppy - in a practice room you dont usually practice running out of space for your escape unless you’re specifically training for that instance.

23

[quote]silkyhorse wrote:

[quote]slimjim wrote:

[quote]silkyhorse wrote:

[quote]slimjim wrote:
one loss andthe vultures circle…how can anyone deride a guy who after his first loss simply says, ‘man who does not fall cannot stand up’ fuck the haters, the ufc aint shit[/quote]
Nobody is saying that he can’t get up again. It’s just that he lost his perfect record in such a “stupid” way. And people always believed him to be unbeatable… And now they’re stunned by the manner in which he did get beat.[/quote]

who are these people? everyone can lose. i dont see why the consensus here is that fedor shouldnt have followed werdum to the ground. it is what has made fedor the man of the sport. he goes wherever the fight goes. he fought crocop standing. nog on the ground. arlovski standing. he never backed away or shied from engagement. in a year of lackluster decisions, i cannot fault fedor for doing what i tune in to watch - fight. the ufc is full of fighters just concerned with eeking out the win at the expense of the sport in my opinion…the last few strikeforces and bellators (and the last wec) had fighters leaving it all on the mat. that is what the sport is about…lately many of the fighters in the ufc have abandoned the lay and pray routine for the even shittier lay on the cage routine (thank you jackson’s camp for adding that bit if shittness to mma, youve made your mark) [/quote]
I know what you’re saying, but Fedor really shouldn’t have followed him down. The game is about winning, and when you’re going to the mat with a BJJ blackbelt(not sure of what rank of BB he has, but he showed his skills damn well),you sure as hell don’t have a chance of winning, even if you’re Fedor Emilianenko. I mean, he’s the unbeatable Fedor, and he went down in less than a minute! By a basic submission that he should have faced 1000s of times before in practice and competition.

This time he made a big mistake.[/quote]

by that line of reasoning, gsp shouldnt have gone to the ground with bj cause bj’s a world champion blackbelt (as is werdum)

24

[quote]silkyhorse wrote:

[quote]slimjim wrote:

[quote]silkyhorse wrote:

[quote]slimjim wrote:
one loss andthe vultures circle…how can anyone deride a guy who after his first loss simply says, ‘man who does not fall cannot stand up’ fuck the haters, the ufc aint shit[/quote]
Nobody is saying that he can’t get up again. It’s just that he lost his perfect record in such a “stupid” way. And people always believed him to be unbeatable… And now they’re stunned by the manner in which he did get beat.[/quote]

who are these people? everyone can lose. i dont see why the consensus here is that fedor shouldnt have followed werdum to the ground. it is what has made fedor the man of the sport. he goes wherever the fight goes. he fought crocop standing. nog on the ground. arlovski standing. he never backed away or shied from engagement. in a year of lackluster decisions, i cannot fault fedor for doing what i tune in to watch - fight. the ufc is full of fighters just concerned with eeking out the win at the expense of the sport in my opinion…the last few strikeforces and bellators (and the last wec) had fighters leaving it all on the mat. that is what the sport is about…lately many of the fighters in the ufc have abandoned the lay and pray routine for the even shittier lay on the cage routine (thank you jackson’s camp for adding that bit if shittness to mma, youve made your mark) [/quote]
I know what you’re saying, but Fedor really shouldn’t have followed him down. The game is about winning, and when you’re going to the mat with a BJJ blackbelt(not sure of what rank of BB he has, but he showed his skills damn well),you sure as hell don’t have a chance of winning, even if you’re Fedor Emilianenko. I mean, he’s the unbeatable Fedor, and he went down in less than a minute! By a basic submission that he should have faced 1000s of times before in practice and competition.

This time he made a big mistake.[/quote]

i agree…Fedor looked good, but Werdum caught him. i was really impressed with his transition, and poise, really…

in a weird way, i think it’s prolly a releif for Fedor to lose. he doesn’t have the continuing pressure to keep winning in something he doesn’t seem to put 100% effort into anymore. and to be honest, i didn’t know much about werdum, but he does have a good record and solid credentials, and is actually a legitimate HVWT.

i think Fedor should finish his contract, and go back to judo/sambo competetion… he’s had a hell of a career, and done so on his own terms.

25

[quote]slimjim wrote:

[quote]silkyhorse wrote:

[quote]slimjim wrote:

[quote]silkyhorse wrote:

[quote]slimjim wrote:
one loss andthe vultures circle…how can anyone deride a guy who after his first loss simply says, ‘man who does not fall cannot stand up’ fuck the haters, the ufc aint shit[/quote]
Nobody is saying that he can’t get up again. It’s just that he lost his perfect record in such a “stupid” way. And people always believed him to be unbeatable… And now they’re stunned by the manner in which he did get beat.[/quote]

who are these people? everyone can lose. i dont see why the consensus here is that fedor shouldnt have followed werdum to the ground. it is what has made fedor the man of the sport. he goes wherever the fight goes. he fought crocop standing. nog on the ground. arlovski standing. he never backed away or shied from engagement. in a year of lackluster decisions, i cannot fault fedor for doing what i tune in to watch - fight. the ufc is full of fighters just concerned with eeking out the win at the expense of the sport in my opinion…the last few strikeforces and bellators (and the last wec) had fighters leaving it all on the mat. that is what the sport is about…lately many of the fighters in the ufc have abandoned the lay and pray routine for the even shittier lay on the cage routine (thank you jackson’s camp for adding that bit if shittness to mma, youve made your mark) [/quote]
I know what you’re saying, but Fedor really shouldn’t have followed him down. The game is about winning, and when you’re going to the mat with a BJJ blackbelt(not sure of what rank of BB he has, but he showed his skills damn well),you sure as hell don’t have a chance of winning, even if you’re Fedor Emilianenko. I mean, he’s the unbeatable Fedor, and he went down in less than a minute! By a basic submission that he should have faced 1000s of times before in practice and competition.

This time he made a big mistake.[/quote]

by that line of reasoning, gsp shouldnt have gone to the ground with bj cause bj’s a world champion blackbelt (as is werdum)[/quote]

Problem with the anology is GSP outweighs BJ by alot. He is physically bigger and stronger plus greased up.:slight_smile:

It was a mistake to go after him there and if he had stood him up it would have been quick work for Fedor. Werdum is insane on the ground and Fedor made the mistake of chasing him. Hopefully he sees it, learns from it, and comes back better than before.

The guy that loses in this is Overeem. He wanted Fedor so bad and Werdum who is respected and known to MMA hardcores is not so well known to the average fan. So the Overeem v Werdum fight happens and someone gets fed to Fedor. I hope its not Lashley. He is progressing nice and easy and that would be a brutal loss.

26

[quote]slimjim wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]silkyhorse wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:
Didn’t watch the fight live, just caught the replay, but people need to stop discrediting Fedor and start applauding Werdum. He capaitalized on a mistake made by a guy who’s made a career out of being damn near infallible. Who knows why Fedor was so “careless” when he’s normally so precise, and really, who cares? It takes absolutely nothing away from what he’s done, or what he still could potentially do. It’s also funny listening to these guys who say “I knew it was gonna happen” or “He looked different at the press conference”… Bullshit. Any fighter can lose on any given night. Of course it was bound to happen. And he looked the exact same as he always does: sleepy, disinterested and looking like he wants a peanutbutter and jelly sandwich. He made a mistake, Werdum caught it, Fedor lost, life moves on. I am interested to see what he does next though.[/quote]
I don’t see Werdum win bigger than Fedors loss.[/quote]

Of course a loss by a guy who’s been dominant for damn near a decade is bigger news than a win by a guy who’s been somewhat inconsistent to this point. I’m just saying people are completely ignoring Werdum’s win and are focusing on Fedor’s loss, and that sucks for Werdum. People need to give him credit.[/quote]

this is true, werdum capitalized with a textbook triangle armbar…if we’re going for a deeper analysis, if you watch the fight again, there is a point where fedor is trying to stack/spin around the right side of werdums guard but runs out of room as the cage is there. i think this is where the mistake was made, and why fedor looked like he got sloppy - in a practice room you dont usually practice running out of space for your escape unless you’re specifically training for that instance.[/quote]

perfect explanation.

Fedor wasn’t used with cage and lost his momentum while trying to get out of the triangle. Also it was only the first round and none of them were really sweaty. As Werdum said: If it were on the 2nd round i’m not sure i would be able to pull it off.

Today is a sad day for MMA

27

It is sad…should Fedor retire? FUCK NO!

He got caught…and that’s it…I mean it was pretty stupid how he got caught I think just cause of the experience he has…but I don’t give a shit really…he has that dog eat dog mentality…that killer instict in him…so to all of you who say he doesnt have it anymore (cause he lost) your out of your mind. He POUNCED on Werdum instantly without thought…why…cause he’s got the killer instinct man…Fedor is a man in ALL of his fights…he stalks you, and wait’s…and is so explosive that a lot of guys go down when they get hit.

He probably just let his emotions run high (over confident or something) pounced on the guy like usual and didn’t realize maybe he didn’t stun him bad enough, or maybe Werdum recovered just enough where he still has A LOT of skill, and it wasn’t enough time for Fedor to pull off the win like he maybe had expected to at that moment by GNP. That’s just my thoughts.

I’m sad Fedor and Overreem won’t fight…that’s what really sucks in my personal opinion…just cause I’ve been waiting for a longgggg time…even made a thread about it a long time ago.

28

[quote]rasturai wrote:
It is sad…should Fedor retire? FUCK NO!

He got caught…and that’s it…I mean it was pretty stupid how he got caught I think just cause of the experience he has…but I don’t give a shit really…he has that dog eat dog mentality…that killer instict in him…so to all of you who say he doesnt have it anymore (cause he lost) your out of your mind. He POUNCED on Werdum instantly without thought…why…cause he’s got the killer instinct man…Fedor is a man in ALL of his fights…he stalks you, and wait’s…and is so explosive that a lot of guys go down when they get hit.

He probably just let his emotions run high (over confident or something) pounced on the guy like usual and didn’t realize maybe he didn’t stun him bad enough, or maybe Werdum recovered just enough where he still has A LOT of skill, and it wasn’t enough time for Fedor to pull off the win like he maybe had expected to at that moment by GNP. That’s just my thoughts.

I’m sad Fedor and Overreem won’t fight…that’s what really sucks in my personal opinion…just cause I’ve been waiting for a longgggg time…even made a thread about it a long time ago.[/quote]

i beg to differ…i think he pounced because he wasn’t as confident to let it continue…

i don’t think he’s washed up, but i think he’s not really into fighting anymore.

29

Look at his older fights and compare it to his stuff in strikeforce. You can visibly see how much slower he’s gotten. And could someone who’s watched more of his fights weight in? Because it seems like he’s changed his style. I’m only seen a few of his older fights but to me it seems like he used to go for a tap out or ground and pound, but now it seems like he’s trying to fight standing up more.

30

woah…didnt see that coming

31

[quote]Sliver wrote:
Look at his older fights and compare it to his stuff in strikeforce. You can visibly see how much slower he’s gotten. And could someone who’s watched more of his fights weight in? Because it seems like he’s changed his style. I’m only seen a few of his older fights but to me it seems like he used to go for a tap out or ground and pound, but now it seems like he’s trying to fight standing up more.[/quote]
Most of the dudes he was submitting were wrestlers, he has recently fought stand up fighters so I don’t think that’s the case.

32

It was bound to happen, I just didn’t think it would happen to Werdum. haha. I thought it would be Overeem to do it.

33

Yeah, one thing you have to say about Fedor – and this makes him more exciting to watch than any other fighter in the world, IMO – that fucker is always, ALWAYS trying to finish the fight. Like, RIGHT NOW. He clearly made a stupid mistake (first one ever, really) in this fight, but I don’t think it shows him being “washed up” one bit.

[quote]rasturai wrote:
It is sad…should Fedor retire? FUCK NO!

He got caught…and that’s it…I mean it was pretty stupid how he got caught I think just cause of the experience he has…but I don’t give a shit really…he has that dog eat dog mentality…that killer instict in him…so to all of you who say he doesnt have it anymore (cause he lost) your out of your mind. He POUNCED on Werdum instantly without thought…why…cause he’s got the killer instinct man…Fedor is a man in ALL of his fights…he stalks you, and wait’s…and is so explosive that a lot of guys go down when they get hit.

He probably just let his emotions run high (over confident or something) pounced on the guy like usual and didn’t realize maybe he didn’t stun him bad enough, or maybe Werdum recovered just enough where he still has A LOT of skill, and it wasn’t enough time for Fedor to pull off the win like he maybe had expected to at that moment by GNP. That’s just my thoughts.

I’m sad Fedor and Overreem won’t fight…that’s what really sucks in my personal opinion…just cause I’ve been waiting for a longgggg time…even made a thread about it a long time ago.[/quote]

34

[quote]Damici wrote:
Yeah, one thing you have to say about Fedor – and this makes him more exciting to watch than any other fighter in the world, IMO – that fucker is always, ALWAYS trying to finish the fight. Like, RIGHT NOW. He clearly made a stupid mistake (first one ever, really) in this fight, but I don’t think it shows him being “washed up” one bit.

[quote]rasturai wrote:
It is sad…should Fedor retire? FUCK NO!

He got caught…and that’s it…I mean it was pretty stupid how he got caught I think just cause of the experience he has…but I don’t give a shit really…he has that dog eat dog mentality…that killer instict in him…so to all of you who say he doesnt have it anymore (cause he lost) your out of your mind. He POUNCED on Werdum instantly without thought…why…cause he’s got the killer instinct man…Fedor is a man in ALL of his fights…he stalks you, and wait’s…and is so explosive that a lot of guys go down when they get hit.

He probably just let his emotions run high (over confident or something) pounced on the guy like usual and didn’t realize maybe he didn’t stun him bad enough, or maybe Werdum recovered just enough where he still has A LOT of skill, and it wasn’t enough time for Fedor to pull off the win like he maybe had expected to at that moment by GNP. That’s just my thoughts.

I’m sad Fedor and Overreem won’t fight…that’s what really sucks in my personal opinion…just cause I’ve been waiting for a longgggg time…even made a thread about it a long time ago.[/quote]
[/quote]

Thank you, this is exactly what I was getting at…he’s DEFINATELY got the fight in him still…hell he knocked down werdum…I just can’t believe he made such a mistake…I REALLY think he thought he stunned him more than he did and he didn’t expect him to pull that off…you gotta give it to werdum, he has a lot of credentials on for the ground game.

Man…before everyone hops on the washed up fedor wagon because he lost now (he loses ONE fight, and he’s “washd up”…when several other fighters lose 5-6 times and they are still on their game)…that’s why I think it’s silly to say he looks different, he’s washed up blah blah blah…man he lost ONE fight…give it a break…if your favourite b-ball team loses a game…are they washed up? No. If Shane Carwin loses against Brock Lesnar in July…is Shane washed up? Hell no…it’s just everyone is saying this cause Fedor hasn’t fought “decent competition” in years. He man-handled Brett Rogers, he was looking good against Werdum.

Anyways I really just want Fedor to fight again…and prove everyone wrong. Against a top 5 HW of course. If he fights Overreem and wins, that will hush a lot of this talk.

35

As Al Dente said as well…if anyone was gonna beat him I was looking at Overreem doing it just cause of his power, size, reach, experience…everything. But I still think Overreem would’ve had trouble if Fedor got him to the ground IMO.

Really…I just want that fight to happen.

36

ive read some posts on other sites that are blatantly anti-fedor…even if you didnt buy into the “hype” because you started watching mma when it was a reality show on spike, i still dont know how anyone could be down on a guy who was more attuned to his own fallibility than we were.

http://www.sherdog.com/news/articles/Strikeforce-Lessons-Everyone-Cares-More-Than-Fedor-25366

37

The part about Thomson is funny he’s 17-3 for christ’s sake.

38

Fedor still is the best heavyweight in the sport.

GSP made an awesome comeback, Shogun too, do anybody REALLY believe Fedor is washed up?

for christ sake, don’t make me laugh.

39

I’m in the same boat as you kaiser…lol everyone hopped on this washed up theory…I don’t understand, Fedor has still got a lot of fight in him.
It’s to be expected though by someone who has never technically lost.

It’s like if Floyd Mayweather lost…man all hell would break loose and people would probably say “his time is up” lol.

40

[quote]Josann wrote:
Sorry to disagree with the conventional wisdom, but Fedor has been hiding since Pride broke up. If he really wanted to be tested and prove himself as a true champion he’d have been in the UFC.

I don’t think he’d have stood up against Lesnar, Couture, or even guy like Frank Mir. His standup is not the greatest and I believe he really missed an opportunity the past few years after Pride ended. In MMA anybody can lose and fighting weak opponents only increases the odds that one of these guys will beat you.

If he’s really a champ then what he decides to do next with his career will tell us a lot. I’d love to see him take on Lesnar or Carwin in the fall of 2010. Defeating the winner of their fight would convince me.[/quote]

I agree to some extent. You can’t take away from the fights he’s fought and won very impressively. He did look a bit silly in the Werdum fight. I still can’t believe it. He should really go to the UFC otherwise people have a point saying he’s not really fighting the best in the world.