Hey guys. I was wondering if I could get some quick advice here. I am 36 I have been taking 200 mg a week of test cypionate for 4 weeks now (way too much, I am dose reducing, see below), no hCG (always threw my E2 way out of whack) and taking 3.125 mg of liquid exemestane bid 9 hours apart (given recent data on biologic half life in teen males).
Last week my Labcorp Estradiol came back at 18 and I did feel low (poor libido, social withdrawal, poor mood, apathy). So I reduced the dose to 1.56 mg (3 drops) b.i.d. and today is day 5 on the lower dose and I feel better but still have poor libido. The mood has improved but is still a tad low. Now I have other investigations to do because I still have low body temp and no morning wood (so I am going to look at thyroid labs and cortisol, etc) but I feel like I should tackle one thing at a time.
So, here are my recent labs. These are from 28.5 mg daily shallow IM shot in the calf (total 200 mgs a week, 28g one half inch insulin needle straight in to the muscle):
Quest:
Testosterone Bio, Free & Total:
Testosterone, Total: 946 NG/DL (250-1100)
Testosterone, Free: 352.2 PG/ML (46.0-224.0)
Testosterone Bioavailable: 724.2 NG/DL (110.0-575.0)
Albumin 4.5 G/DL (3.6-5.1)
SHBG 7 NMOL/L (10-50)
LabCorp
Estradiol, Sensitive 18 pg/mL (3-70)
So I am supraphysiologic in my testosterone and the dose has to come down. My question is, how long should I stay on my current dose of exemestane before I retest. I am not sure how the suicide inhibitor MOA come sin to play when determining retesting times after dose titration. I realize that if I dose reduce of test cyp that this will lower my E2 a swell and that will eventually factor in.
I can not take anastrozole because even three quarters of a drop EOD gives my erratic E2 levels and I tank quickly. I am sure I need SOME AI (I only mention this because I know some guys on TRT do not run an AI because their estradiol stays in range) because I typically have had high E2 levels and when I started this TRT I did not start my exemestane until day 10 (order did not arrive) and I had signs of high E2 and when I started the exemestane (I initially took 25 mg for 3 days) I felt myself pass right through the sweet spot. I had spontaneous erections and was almost euphoric. I would like to get to that level again.
Thanks for the help!
You can dilute anastrozole with vodka and have finer dose control.
Have you read the advice for new guys sticky and protocol for injections?
AI dose needs to match T levels, so both will need adjustment.
Half life: Serum half life is not the same as the action half life. And that may not be the same for you as others. Try to get balanced with dosing once per day. Those irreversible molecules are attached to aromatase reaction sites long after serum levels have dropped. Don’t get over analytical, you might think yourself into a bad result.
You can dose Aromasin/exemestane and Arimidex/anastrozole every other day and if you get balanced that way, life is good.
Don’t expect many to understand Method Of Action - MOA
Your T dose is way too high, that along with your very low SHBG will make it difficult for you
to find a consistent balance. FWIW, I have low SHBG as well and have fought this same battle
with T dose, frequency and AI for years.
Because of your low SHBG, you need less test to get free T to the top of the range.
In my case, I use just 8mg per day, and I use a shallow IM injection to the delt.
My total T has a peak of 700, and trough of 500, my free T stays about 170-200.
I cannot use adex either, even tiny amounts. I use extremestane, but the amount I use varies.
I find if I eat clean, and don’t drink alcohol, I rarely need the AI. But if I eat bad and drink, I seem
to need 6.25mg (1/4 of a 25mg pill) it gets me back on track as long as I am being cool with
the above factors.
I do use HCG, but anything more than 1-250iu shot per week throws me out of whack. I do think it’s
great stuff though. Always gives me a kick of libido and seems to enhance my mood.
Hope the .02 from a guy with similar #'s helps you.
First of all, I wanted to thank you so much for opening up my eyes to the wonders of T-Prop. It’s been a complete game-changer for me, with low SHBG and T-Cyp E3D/EOD/ED not working at all. Without your posts, I would’ve never considered this alternative…so, thanks!
I pin 6mg daily. Reading your posts, I noticed you recently dropped from 12.5mg/day to 8mg. Why the drop? I also had to drop from 9mg to 6mg recently. For some reason, I find there’s kind of an accumulative effect after awhile, so I’m trying lowering the dose to see if it’ll work better over the long run. Like yourself, taking more than needed has a pronounced detrimental effect…
PKNY, do you ever notice 1) an accumulative effect over time where you need less Prop to achieve the same subjective effects, or 2) gradually declining efficacy if your dosage is adjusted slightly too high? (I’ve tried taking a break for a few days and then restarting, which works.)
Why did you decrease your T-Prop daily dosage from 12.5mg to 8mg? Do you find that, through time, you need less of it to achieve the same subjective effects?
I’ve had to decrease from a 9mg to 6mg/day dosage too…