[quote]Loose Tool wrote:
ephrem wrote:
Loose Tool wrote: Not the Constitution, but still an important document in the US: the Declaration of Independence -
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.
Historical and important as it was in 1215 when it was sealed, while it limited the absolute powers of the king, it preserved feudal rights, so it isn’t really analogous. I was hoping the brits would have something that stated all men are created equal. But I suppose in a country ruled by a monarch, and governed in part by Lords, that’s wishful thinking.[/quote]
…there ís an English Bill of Rights: Bill of Rights 1689 - Wikipedia One could also argue that, at first, the ‘all men created equal’ in america meant ‘all rich white men are created equal’ but that’s neither here nor there…
…it would also be easy to overlook the importance of the period of Enlightenment, which was the last real upheaval of the seats of power in 17th and 18th century Europe, from which inspirition was drawn for establishing the new form of government invisioned by all those famous american men who’s names i can’t remember…
[quote]ephrem wrote:
Loose Tool wrote:
ephrem wrote:
Loose Tool wrote: Not the Constitution, but still an important document in the US: the Declaration of Independence -
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.
Historical and important as it was in 1215 when it was sealed, while it limited the absolute powers of the king, it preserved feudal rights, so it isn’t really analogous. I was hoping the brits would have something that stated all men are created equal. But I suppose in a country ruled by a monarch, and governed in part by Lords, that’s wishful thinking.
…there ís an English Bill of Rights: Bill of Rights 1689 - Wikipedia One could also argue that, at first, the ‘all men created equal’ in america meant ‘all rich white men are created equal’ but that’s neither here nor there…
…it would also be easy to overlook the importance of the period of Enlightenment, which was the last real upheaval of the seats of power in 17th and 18th century Europe, from which inspirition was drawn for establishing the new form of government invisioned by all those famous american men who’s names i can’t remember…
[/quote]
[i]Freedom from royal interference with the law. Though the sovereign remains the fount of justice, he or she cannot unilaterally establish new courts or act as a judge.
Freedom from taxation by Royal Prerogative. The agreement of parliament became necessary for the implementation of any new taxes.
Freedom to petition the monarch.
Freedom from the standing army during a time of peace. The agreement of parliament became necessary before the army could be moved against the populace when not at war.
Freedom for Protestants to bear arms for their own defence, as suitable to their class and as allowed by law.
Freedom to elect members of parliament without interference from the sovereign.
Freedom of speech in parliament. This means that the proceedings of parliament can not be questioned in a court of law or any other body outside of parliament itself; this forms the basis of modern parliamentary privilege.
Freedom from cruel and unusual punishment, as well as excessive bail.
Freedom from fine and forfeiture without a trial.[/i]
Well, that was a start, “Freedom for Protestants to bear arms for their own defence, as suitable to their class and as allowed by law”.
But things haven’t progressed much since then. Have they?
[quote]Loose Tool wrote:
Cockney Blue wrote:
If you want to know why her life is of less value, then you could look at the fact that your wife being killed would not affect the global stock exchange, or be liable to cause race riots or a war or cost the US tax payer a significant ammount of money.
Not the Constitution, but still an important document in the US: the Declaration of Independence -
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.
Does the UK have an analogous document?
[/quote]
The Declaration of Independence is part of the US constitution.
[quote]Loose Tool wrote:
ephrem wrote:
Loose Tool wrote:
ephrem wrote:
Loose Tool wrote: Not the Constitution, but still an important document in the US: the Declaration of Independence -
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.
Historical and important as it was in 1215 when it was sealed, while it limited the absolute powers of the king, it preserved feudal rights, so it isn’t really analogous. I was hoping the brits would have something that stated all men are created equal. But I suppose in a country ruled by a monarch, and governed in part by Lords, that’s wishful thinking.
…there ís an English Bill of Rights: Bill of Rights 1689 - Wikipedia One could also argue that, at first, the ‘all men created equal’ in america meant ‘all rich white men are created equal’ but that’s neither here nor there…
…it would also be easy to overlook the importance of the period of Enlightenment, which was the last real upheaval of the seats of power in 17th and 18th century Europe, from which inspirition was drawn for establishing the new form of government invisioned by all those famous american men who’s names i can’t remember…
[i]Freedom from royal interference with the law. Though the sovereign remains the fount of justice, he or she cannot unilaterally establish new courts or act as a judge.
Freedom from taxation by Royal Prerogative. The agreement of parliament became necessary for the implementation of any new taxes.
Freedom to petition the monarch.
Freedom from the standing army during a time of peace. The agreement of parliament became necessary before the army could be moved against the populace when not at war.
Freedom for Protestants to bear arms for their own defence, as suitable to their class and as allowed by law.
Freedom to elect members of parliament without interference from the sovereign.
Freedom of speech in parliament. This means that the proceedings of parliament can not be questioned in a court of law or any other body outside of parliament itself; this forms the basis of modern parliamentary privilege.
Freedom from cruel and unusual punishment, as well as excessive bail.
Freedom from fine and forfeiture without a trial.[/i]
Well, that was a start, “Freedom for Protestants to bear arms for their own defence, as suitable to their class and as allowed by law”.
But things haven’t progressed much since then. Have they?
[/quote]
Ok, on paper I am a protestant (well christened C of E.) My family was middle class so what am I allowed to carry? I want a broadsword, or maybe a longbow.
[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:
Loose Tool wrote:
ephrem wrote:
Loose Tool wrote:
ephrem wrote:
Loose Tool wrote: Not the Constitution, but still an important document in the US: the Declaration of Independence -
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.
Historical and important as it was in 1215 when it was sealed, while it limited the absolute powers of the king, it preserved feudal rights, so it isn’t really analogous. I was hoping the brits would have something that stated all men are created equal. But I suppose in a country ruled by a monarch, and governed in part by Lords, that’s wishful thinking.
…there ís an English Bill of Rights: Bill of Rights 1689 - Wikipedia One could also argue that, at first, the ‘all men created equal’ in america meant ‘all rich white men are created equal’ but that’s neither here nor there…
…it would also be easy to overlook the importance of the period of Enlightenment, which was the last real upheaval of the seats of power in 17th and 18th century Europe, from which inspirition was drawn for establishing the new form of government invisioned by all those famous american men who’s names i can’t remember…
[i]Freedom from royal interference with the law. Though the sovereign remains the fount of justice, he or she cannot unilaterally establish new courts or act as a judge.
Freedom from taxation by Royal Prerogative. The agreement of parliament became necessary for the implementation of any new taxes.
Freedom to petition the monarch.
Freedom from the standing army during a time of peace. The agreement of parliament became necessary before the army could be moved against the populace when not at war.
Freedom for Protestants to bear arms for their own defence, as suitable to their class and as allowed by law.
Freedom to elect members of parliament without interference from the sovereign.
Freedom of speech in parliament. This means that the proceedings of parliament can not be questioned in a court of law or any other body outside of parliament itself; this forms the basis of modern parliamentary privilege.
Freedom from cruel and unusual punishment, as well as excessive bail.
Freedom from fine and forfeiture without a trial.[/i]
Well, that was a start, “Freedom for Protestants to bear arms for their own defence, as suitable to their class and as allowed by law”.
But things haven’t progressed much since then. Have they?
Ok, on paper I am a protestant (well christened C of E.) My family was middle class so what am I allowed to carry? I want a broadsword, or maybe a longbow.[/quote]
Well if I can’t have anything pointy can I have a quaterstaff? Since reading Robin Hood as a kid I have always fancied myself in the role of Little John.
[quote]pushharder wrote:
Loose Tool wrote:
orion wrote:
The Declaration of Independence is part of the US constitution.
Really? Which part?
The part that says “the Vice-President rules America.”
Poor Orion. He stood in the batters box with an 0 - 2 count. He swung on the next pitch. He whiffed. Back to the dugout again. Poor guy only gets on base when he talks guns.[/quote]
The Declaration of Independence is the most fundamental constitutional document you have and your supreme court has ruled that your constitution is to be interpreted in light of the sentiments of that document.
Then, you have repeatedly claimed that I posted that “the Vice-President rules America”.
I am not inclined to react to every feeble attempt to put up a strawman, but in this case I would very much like to see when and where I posted that.
[quote]orion wrote:
The Declaration of Independence is the most fundamental constitutional document you have and your supreme court has ruled that your constitution is to be interpreted in light of the sentiments of that document.[/quote]
[quote]pushharder wrote:
orion wrote:
pushharder wrote:
Loose Tool wrote:
orion wrote:
The Declaration of Independence is part of the US constitution.
Really? Which part?
The part that says “the Vice-President rules America.”
Poor Orion. He stood in the batters box with an 0 - 2 count. He swung on the next pitch. He whiffed. Back to the dugout again. Poor guy only gets on base when he talks guns.
The Declaration of Independence is the most fundamental constitutional document you have and your supreme court has ruled that your constitution is to be interpreted in light of the sentiments of that document.
OK. Sit down. Sit up straight. Leave Greta’s bra strap alone. Fold your hands and put them on your desk. I’m going to take time out of my busy day (not really) and school your Salzburg citadel ass. Again.
…
[/quote]
See, Push, Orion and Cock Blue (now there is a condition to be avoided!) are pretending to use the British definition of constitution, not Constitution (see Loose Tool above).
But not even by the notions of Walter Bagehot is the DoI part of the constitution, let alone the Constitution, of the US.
Push, be grateful: Orion==busy with the History of the Navahos, the German General Staff, and as one-eyed king in the kingdom of the blind–has condescended to instruct you in the nature of American life and law. Consider yourself lucky.