gee dude learn how to write mr. warrior.
[quote]rundymc wrote:
Yes, KOing Nog makes you a journeyman now. Get with the times people!
[/quote]
i’m kind of lost who talked about Nog?
[quote]Schwarzfahrer wrote:
Like with Cain V. - Brock L.
You have been quite tedious in your thorough exploration of why Lesnar’s wrestling would be impossible to defend against and your meticulous citations of Brock’s college credential data was overflowing this forum.
Now you dismiss DosSantos.
Carwin has heavy hands. Dos Santos, too. Only that he is two levels above Carwin in terms of technique. He’s also relentless and won’t be discouraged if his hands can’t seem to snuff out the lights while striking true (as seen with Roy Nelson, who btw will make mincemeat out of Mir).
The only question is, can he overpower him early on?
Let’s see about that.
Tis a small chance and Carwin is aware of that which is a double edged sword as with every one-dimensional fighter. The longer the fight goes, the less heart he’ll have.
After two minutes, it’ll be largely decided.[/quote]
I agree.
ZEB, you chronically underestimate strikers and overestimate wrestlers (that’s not so bad, even most journalists are guilty here). You do this very vocally.
And because your Brock-Hymnos was the combat forum equivalent of tedious PWI gay bashing my post was perhaps sharper in tone then I intended. Sorry for that!
p.s.: I can sleep soundly if the internet is wrong. If you officially want to make this a virtual bet, however, it’s fine with me. Watching fights is more fun that way.
Never understood the fascination with JDS. He’s been a handful of middle of the pack guys and a way past his prim CroCop. And, his power is WWAAAYYYY overrated. If Carwin has fully recovered from his surgery [speaking of, does anyone have any news on that?] he’ll do what he’s genetically engineered to do: Put dudes to sleep.
[quote]westdale warrior wrote:
i wanna say carwin takes it. jds couldnt put down roy nelson who as we all know got murdered by arlovski. also if you watch the fight i think that the crocop jds fight really could have gone the other way if crocops heart was in it. jds didnt stop that fight an aging broken hero did. i think brock would have beat jds as well and im gonna say right now that cain does not defend his title. the brock win was a fluke and im convinced it was rigged. he never appeared to be anything more than a journymen until that point and then they market him as the first potential mexican champion and do there first all spanish ppv broadcast.then the titan who in his previous fight weathered a shitstorm of bombs from a proverbial brick shithouse man mountian and came out on top gets rattled and looks like hes never fought a day in his life. as for tuf brock is what the sport needs he preaches cardio conditioning and explosiveness. stop treating it like a sport and start treating it like a fight JDS fighters golding people against the cage and laying on top doing no damage could make santa clause himself vomit with rage. [/quote]
I don’t agree. I think Cain always showed great promise, and he was hyped by guys he trained with as being a beast well before the spotlight hit him. Having said that, he is only 9 fights into his career so my estimation of his skills could be well off and you may be right about him defending his title post injury.
Lesnar does not react to being hit like a pro fighter. He reacts like someone who is not used to being hit. His continued failure to rectify this is maybe the only area of his development where the charge of “lazy” applies.
Regards,
Robert A
[quote]Schwarzfahrer wrote:
ZEB, you chronically underestimate strikers and overestimate wrestlers (that’s not so bad, even most journalists are guilty here). You do this very vocally.[/quote]
History has proven repeatedly that pure strikers lose to pure grapplers most of the time. Ask James Toney. Granted when you have someone who can do both, naturally they are better poised to win. And I feel that while Dos Santos is a very good striker Carwin can do both. I’ll leave it at that for now.
The rest of your post is fine, but I take great exception to what you’ve written here.
First, it seems that you are accusing me of promoting Lesnar in an over the top fashion, do I have that right? Yet you don’t seem to attack other people who have attacked him aggressively. It takes two to debate on this board. Yet, there’s no castigation for my opposition. Could that be because YOU don’t like Lesnar? I get it.
As a side note Velasquez beat Lesnar because he was able to nullify Lesnar’s ground game. That didn’t escape you did it? Once again we see someone who can do both, Velasquez, beating someone who had only grappling at the time.
Secondly, since you brought it up, I’ve never bashed homosexuals, not even once. When I get into a debate regarding gay marriage I feel very strongly about the topic and speak up about it. Once again, it takes two to make such a debate. Are you bothered by the various homosexuals that I’ve debated in the past carrying on page after page? No. And why? Because you are pro gay marriage. Once again, not unlike our Lesnar example above, if someone disagrees with you then by all means they should tone it down.
Side note, liberals like you call anything that is anti-pc, or anti-gay marriage “gay bashing” so I’m used to hearing it on the PWI threads. But I’m not used to hearing it on the combat forum. So it seems that you’re going over the top yourself and carrying old PWI debates into the combat forum. This is not the place for it and I think most on this forum would agree. Let’s keep our PWI debates over there and our mma debates right here -Deal?
Oh I agree with you on both counts. And that is one reason why I spend time making fight predictions. Most don’t want to go out on a limb and predict a fight, but it’s more fun for me if I do. Really, I don’t care if I’m wrong with a fight prediction, as I have been many times. The world won’t stop turning it’s mma and this is one way I enjoy it.
With that said what sort of “Internet bet” would you like to make?
[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:
If Carwin has fully recovered from his surgery [speaking of, does anyone have any news on that?] he’ll do what he’s genetically engineered to do: Put dudes to sleep.[/quote]
That is my only concern regarding Carwin’s ability to put Dos Santos to sleep. Is he the Carwi of old? Will the surgery and the time off cause a problem with his game?
Dos Santos, mid-late second round.
Has JDS fought any high caliber wrestlers? Can he defend the takedown from a powerhouse like Carwin?
Meh, I’m going with Carwin wisely deciding he doesn’t want to risk a boxing match, taking JDS down and brutally GnPing him for a 1st round TKO.
How about Muñoz / Maia? I’m really excited about the match up in styles right there.
If Munoz take the fight to later rounds he can gas out Demian, i’ve been training with Demian and since he has Alejarra as his gpp coach he gas out almost everytime, the same goes for JDS, Cris Cyborg.
If Demian can put him to the ground i see Demian winning by sub, if he decides to standup he is going for a rough ride.
[quote]Robert A wrote:
I don’t agree. I think Cain always showed great promise, and he was hyped by guys he trained with as being a beast well before the spotlight hit him. Having said that, he is only 9 fights into his career so my estimation of his skills could be well off and you may be right about him defending his title post injury.
Lesnar does not react to being hit like a pro fighter. He reacts like someone who is not used to being hit. His continued failure to rectify this is maybe the only area of his development where the charge of “lazy” applies.
Regards,
Robert A[/quote]
il admit some fan boyism on my part for brock and a natural dislike for cain. yeah rotator cough can be bad news for striking game, i know that with my tear every once in a while il throw a hook wrong and then my arm is on fire for atleast a round. i hope that the injury doesnt limit his arsenal of punches. i dont know after writing my last post ive been re watching his videos. for some reason i have a perverse desire to see him fight roy nelson
yeah i agree with you on brock getting hit. and when i search for video of his training that ufc uses to hype him its usually feats of strength and cardio or him grappling/ laying on someone beating them. maybe he needs to get some high caliber strikers pressing him more consistently and working in scenarios where ground game isnt an option in his camp. mind you my knowledge of wht he does is incedably limited i only know what im shown
Good call.
If I was laying money on this fight, betting on Carwin would make me nervous. Thirty-six years old coming off fairly serious surgery back/neck surgery as well as nearly a year without a fight. Plus, he looks old and unhealthy in the recent pics that have been floating around, as well as significantly smaller. Also, has only been out of the first round once, and that didn’t end well.
To the people saying Carwin takes JDS down and pounds him out, I don’t see that happening. I could see his strategy being to bully JDS against the cage and land short shots ala the Mir fight. Standing at range with the quicker, more technical JDS could get him knocked out.
Also, with Carwin’s cardio problems, I don’t see him wanting to get into a grappling match with a younger and healthier opponent. JDS was training for a wrestler as well. Carwin has that scary power, and I think his best chance is to catch JDS on the feet.
I am no Carwin hater either. I think he’s a good guy and very humble. I rooted for him hard in the Brock fight.
[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:
Dos Santos, mid-late second round. [/quote]
Not being funny, but who is Alejarra? I thought JDS with the Nogueiras/Black House?
[quote]kaisermetal wrote:
[quote]Fistiecuffs wrote:
[quote]cycobushmaster wrote:
i question JDS’s KO power at HW, since he hit Nelson about a thousand times, so i don’t think he has it to KO Carwin. on the flip side, i don’t think Carwin has the speed and timing to catch JDS, so this might be more of a ground war, IMO…[/quote]
The reason I believe JDS is going to KO Carwin is because I believe he must be really pissed at not being able to finish Nelson and therefore he is going to push it extra hard if he just has the opening. Also, I don’t see Carwin going full 3 rounds no matter what, the mans a tough son of a bitch but guy that huge won’t be able to hang in there as long as a guy who probably walks around 30 lbs lighter. I think he should be able to push the pace at least so hard in the 3rd that Carwin won’t be able to defend himself well enough and the fight will be stopped (don’t have my word on this but I recall seeing a couple of situations in the JDS - Nelson fight where some ref might’ve stopped it).
Also interesting Maia - Munoz match up on the card, what you guys think will happen in that one?[/quote]
Also i really hope it’s doesn’t go the distance, since everyone who trains with Alejarra end up gassing on their fights, that guy is a cancer.
Although Carwin has the Gas tank of a smoker.
[/quote]
One more thing, if Seagal is in JDS’ corner the night of the fight, I call JDS by fireball followed up with Hurricane Kick lol
[quote]Dre Cappa wrote:
Not being funny, but who is Alejarra? I thought JDS with the Nogueiras/Black House?
[quote]kaisermetal wrote:
[quote]Fistiecuffs wrote:
[quote]cycobushmaster wrote:
i question JDS’s KO power at HW, since he hit Nelson about a thousand times, so i don’t think he has it to KO Carwin. on the flip side, i don’t think Carwin has the speed and timing to catch JDS, so this might be more of a ground war, IMO…[/quote]
The reason I believe JDS is going to KO Carwin is because I believe he must be really pissed at not being able to finish Nelson and therefore he is going to push it extra hard if he just has the opening. Also, I don’t see Carwin going full 3 rounds no matter what, the mans a tough son of a bitch but guy that huge won’t be able to hang in there as long as a guy who probably walks around 30 lbs lighter. I think he should be able to push the pace at least so hard in the 3rd that Carwin won’t be able to defend himself well enough and the fight will be stopped (don’t have my word on this but I recall seeing a couple of situations in the JDS - Nelson fight where some ref might’ve stopped it).
Also interesting Maia - Munoz match up on the card, what you guys think will happen in that one?[/quote]
Also i really hope it’s doesn’t go the distance, since everyone who trains with Alejarra end up gassing on their fights, that guy is a cancer.
Although Carwin has the Gas tank of a smoker.
[/quote]
[/quote]
Rafael Alejarra is a brazilian conditioning coach who made his name training Wanderlei later in his career, he would use Wand as a guinea pig to test new stuff like training with snorkel, hyperbaric chamber. Wand who was a guy who always had gas all the fight started gassing and losing, Wand fired him and he took Wand to courts over money.
The thing is Wand brought him to America, let him live on his house, helped the guy build his gym and make his name on the market(that’s why he started training Chute Boxe guys, JDS, Demian and others)
[quote]ZEB wrote:
History has proven repeatedly that pure strikers lose to pure grapplers most of the time. Ask James Toney. Granted when you have someone who can do both, naturally they are better poised to win. And I feel that while Dos Santos is a very good striker Carwin can do both. I’ll leave it at that for now.
[/quote]
James Toney is an out-of-shape, business savvy boxer, not a MMArtist who’s just focused on striking more then the ground aspect.
Carwin wins with sheer power. Which is sometimes too little against a more technical guy who can withstand the initial bullying.
Just like Roy Nelson will brutalize Mir, who has just too little of both (standup and power, I mean), Santos will throw crisp combinations that will blow the steam out of Carwin.
[quote]ZEB wrote:
The rest of your post is fine, but I take great exception to what you’ve written here.
First, it seems that you are accusing me of promoting Lesnar in an over the top fashion, do I have that right?
[/quote]
Yes
[quote]ZEB wrote:
Yet you don’t seem to attack other people who have attacked him aggressively. It takes two to debate on this board. Yet, there’s no castigation for my opposition. Could that be because YOU don’t like Lesnar? I get it.
[/quote]
I have no special feelings for Lesnar whatsoever. If I had, I’d have no problems telling here.
I didn’t like his show-attitude (that has changed) and the UFC promoting him like crazy. But aside from that, I think he’s a monster that has proven himself and will have (let’s hope he’ll recover) an influence on MMA. He’s overrated -still a top ten guy- in my opinion.
[quote]ZEB wrote:
As a side note Velasquez beat Lesnar because he was able to nullify Lesnar’s ground game. That didn’t escape you did it? Once again we see someone who can do both, Velasquez, beating someone who had only grappling at the time.
[/quote]
That’s only one part of the equation. He took the battle to him as Lesnar found himself being relentlessly attacked by takedown AND punches. The GnP and control was just the icing.
That’s what a champion can do.
[quote]ZEB wrote:
Side note, liberals like you call anything that is anti-pc, or anti-gay marriage “gay bashing” so I’m used to hearing it on the PWI threads. But I’m not used to hearing it on the combat forum. So it seems that you’re going over the top yourself and carrying old PWI debates into the combat forum. This is not the place for it and I think most on this forum would agree. Let’s keep our PWI debates over there and our mma debates right here -Deal?
[/quote]
I’ve mentioned it because you grinded this forum with Lesnar’s credentials and why he’s the best. Just like you tend dig trenches in the PWI section and have no problem waging argumentative WW1 battles over months where objectivly very little was productive.
And it’s bashing to me since it’s fundmental rights you chose to withold from certain people.
BTW, I have a hard time seeing myself as a “liberal”.
[quote]ZEB wrote:
With that said what sort of “Internet bet” would you like to make?
[/quote]
Hmmm, just a virtual bet, I guess? Winner has +1 T-Honour?
Oh man Schwarzy you made a mess of your post. I don’t feel like straightening it out. This has happened to all of us on occasion. Fix the quotes up and I’ll get back to you okay? I’m sure you have some gems in there.
Zeb
fixed.
One day I’ll might renounce Satan just for you.
[quote]Schwarzfahrer wrote:
fixed.
One day I’ll might renounce Satan just for you.[/quote]
You’re confused again my friend. This is the Combat Forum.