Do You Believe In A God? Why or Why Not?

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
141

Well, agnosticism does not really have anything to believe in, so if we separate that from the group we are left with religions and a scientific theory. The reason I believe our origins involve the big bang (not saying this was the beginning to everything, I don’t know what was before that or if there was a before that) , is scientific evidence supports that theory.

We can observe things like galaxies moving further away (universe expanding). Is it perfect? no. It is currently the best model to explain the universe.

142

I do believe in God.

I was raised Catholic and candidly unimpressed. The Catholic Church in my area (New Mexico) is basically pagan, replacing Aztec gods with Saints and Ixchel (female deity, Mayan) with Mary. Slight bows to local nativist religion (Apache) in my particular Diocese. And South American politics of communism and racial grievances trump any theology. Lots of antisemitism.

Anyway, it made me sick, despite growing up as an alter boy whose mother frequently said things along the lines of “the white man was allowed to conquer us because we were pagan and needed Christianity. They were its imperfect apostles.”

Anyway, I was a vaguely Catholic guy until I met my wife, who is firmly Jewish, and whom I love. As I have related before, I underwent a full-fledged, year long, conversion process and got married. It hasn’t particularly stuck (the conversion part), and I’ve ended up a believer in God (er, G-d), but not particularly Jewish, although I did spend a full day with my in-laws in El Paso yesterday at their synagogue.

More like a generic believer in a God (I’ve always had that), but more specifically a believer that the God of the Bible.

I’ve seen God in action in big things and small. Some really big things in war.

I’ve had some really specific answered prayers that were highly unlikely, but they were the right thing to be praying about and not selfish prayers to a sky genie.

As for why I believe the God of the Bible is The God, it’s because everybody hates the Jews, which I know is a stupid reason. It’s also not the only reason, but it’s a big reason.

The hatred is completely irrational. I didn’t really know Jewish people until I met some guys in the Army that were fantastic people. And, of course, my wife and in-laws. So I’ve tended to like the Jewish people I’ve met. Certainly never saw a reason for the hate.

And I am candidly amazed by them. We have this tribe of completely insignificant people from a complete shithole of an area influence the world more than any other group of people – just like God promised them – “a light unto the nations”. Science, literature, modern thought – they are WAY over represented, for no rational explanation.

There’s literally a whole host of promises made and kept about their punishment and survival in the Bible.

And the effect this insignficant group has had is amazing. Just for example, I was in PA looking at foundries (buying pipe) and my group took a day trip to Philly. We saw the not-dangerous sites, including the Liberty Bell. Inscribed on the bell is “Proclaim LIBERTY Throughout all the Land unto all the Inhabitants Thereof”. That’s Leviticus, BTW.

That’s a Big Idea for 1500 BC bronze age people. Had a Big Effect 200 years ago.

Anyway, you have this ragtag group of sheep herders that most everyone hates, but no one can seem to wipe out (despite best efforts of Egyptians, Babylonians, Greeks, Romans, Europeans (several times), and now Arabs and various nuts), who go on to have outside influence on the entire world, and it’s (in general) a quite good influence.

I just don’t see that kind of irrational hatred and kind of impossible good effect as being possible without the help of God having picked them out as a demonstration of power. They’re just people.

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143

True, but what caused the big bang? No one has come up with a demonstrable theory for it which puts it in the same realm as faith in God. They are both currently non-falsifiable.We have no test for either God or the Big Bang.

144

Wow, that’s really interesting. The timing is a total coincidence, since I was just really bored during lectures.

145

This would be true for a statement related to what started the big bang, but not the big bang itself.

this is absolutely not true. There is evidence for the big bang that is testable. There is no such evidence for God.

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146

Is that not what I said?

We have mathematical models that support the big bang and the expanding universe. That’s different than physical evidence. Mathematical predictions do not equal scientific evidence.

147

The event itself is more defendable than God, because we have evidence for it. The big bang is falsifiable if we find evidence contrary to it. We do not know what caused the big bang, so the most truthful answer is “I don’t know”. God could have caused it, but it could have been caused by magic, fairies, nothing, we just don’t know. We don’t have have evidence, so why pick?

148

We are on the same book, you are just a page ahead of me today. I see a post, respond, then see your post after and realize I just said the same as you.

149

That’s a good point, duke, and also slightly equivalent to something Ricky Gervais argued with on the topic of religion. He said something along the lines of: If you were to take any holy book and destroyed it, in a 1000 years time, it wouldn’t come back just the way it was. On the other hand, if you were to destroy any science book, it would come back, because all the same tests would produce the same results leading to similar conclusions.

150

I think we are saying the same thing in regard to the Big Bang. The big bang is a mathematical model that was postulated and than science found evidence to support and refine that model. It’s a bit opposite of how science usually works (we create math to describe the phenomena…i.e. Newton and calculus) but I don’t disagree that expansion of the universe is happening and likely has happened since some singular event.

Why pick is the crux of this thread. I picked because I see evidence in response to prayer and intense study, that is why I chose to believe. Others may not see that evidence and that is okay. The crux of Christianity is that the belief is indeed a choice made out of human free will.

151

But observation and the mathematical models match up with the theory, so I am sold that they are superior to something like the bible which is contrary to observation.

152

Are you speaking to the creation part of the bible? If so, i mentioned before I don’t subscribe to the 7-24 hour day creation model and the young earth theory.

153

Numerous things in the bible don’t have evidence to support them. The flood is a good one. It even states that the mustard seed is the smallest of all seeds, which isn’t true.

There is a possibility that God hid these things from us, to make belief in him harder and therefore more commendable, but when the punishment is hell, I think that would be a dick move.

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154

I felt it was pretty clear what we were disagreeing on since we both look at the concept of evil, survival of the fittest, and mankind’s role in nature differently.

I’m not here to debate on the existence of a god, nor what is evil. I’m here to see what this community thinks on the topic of the existence of god. Nowhere in my post did I ask for a debate, debates just naturally come and go.

But survival of the fittest isn’t a power struggle at all. It is a term to describe how one species can outlive another. If we coined your term of “survival of the fittest” then species like the peacock wouldn’t be alive anymore. The only reason they’re alive is because they can reproduce faster than they can die out. That’s not powerful, that’s survival of the fittest. And not your definition of survival of the fittest. The actual definition is whoever can produce the most babies enough so those babies can grow up to make more babies.

It’s not survival of the fittest, it’s survival of the “good enough”. Those that can produce babies that live to adulthood would be deemed fit. Now that can’t apply to humans, since it’s usually the idiots who have 6-7 kids that they cannot take care of which eventually leads to a shit life for everyone in the family. Those “idiots” are not more “powerful” than you and I.

If you said survival of the fittest in humans would be who has the most money, then I would agree with you, on the basis that rich people do a lot better in life than poor people.

155

So you’re not here to put any skin in the game? Why would anyone take you seriously past this point then?

Surely you must be aware this is a contentious subject with vastly differing opinions and perspectives - you didn’t think it would spur discussion and conversation?

What are you? New?

If you’re not looking for debate, I suggest you stop responding to people who do…probably the best way to avoid it in my book.

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156

The Bible does state he is “a jealous and vengeful God”…just saying.

In the end we are going to disagree on the existence/lack there of and that’s okay.

It is my hope as a believer that more may come to believe as well, but I don’t look down on those who don’t believe (which is a mistake many contemporary Christians make).

157

You sound like a reasonable person, so if faith makes you happy, and you don’t make other peoples lives difficult because of it, more power to you.

Sometimes I wish I could still believe, but alas I don’t think belief is a choice. When I still believed, it was nice thinking of an afterlife, that my life had purpose, etc…

158

So I never read the bible cover to cover … just pieces here and there.

A few months ago I decided to ungo this challenge - just read this (one of the many) part in Deuteronomy … I believe it was also mentioned in Numbers and Leviticus, but yea, it’s in conjunction with wiping out existing tribes wholely and destroying any trace of their beliefs … it’s a pretty interesting read if I’m being honest

159

The unreasonableness (if that’s a word) of some Christians really confuses me. If one professes to follow Christ, than love and respect of others, regardless of who they are/what they do is paramount (and not easy to accomplish).

I too hope you can believe again.

160

Yeah,
A lot of people throw out the old testament because they don’t like to think of God in the way he is in many of those books.
I find a lot of the lessons in the old testament books quite useful and often overlooked by a lot of today’s churches.