Do Not Get Vaccinated!

Off Topic
81

[quote]nik133 wrote:
I’m sorry guys who am I to tell you that vaccines are bad for you, don’t take my word for it, take Dr. Andrew Moulden’s word who has the following credentials:
Dr. Moulden is an Ontario Graduate scholar, Natural Sciences, Engineering and Research Counsel of Canada scholar, Ontario Mental Health Foundation scholar, I.O.D.E. International Order of the Daughters of the Empire scholar, and graduated at the very top of the class during his BA, MA, and PhD degrees. He has received over 27 awards for biomedical research, clinical, teaching, and academic excellence.

Don’t take my word for it, take an educated man who really knows what he is talking about’s word for it.[/quote]

Sorry. I didn’t read this nincompoop’s whole thread. But, but a three judge panel of the US Federal Vaccine court has rejected the thimerosal causes autism theory.

Dr Moulden, an alleged educated man, is a quack. People who advocate the thimerosal causation theory are delusional and refuse to accept the facts.

The Vaccine Court which was set up to examine the issue has done an exhaustive review of all reliable and credible and found no causation between thimerosal and autism. Links to the court descisions detailing their review of the evidence is below.

82

Oh yeah, the british researcher that “discovered” the original MMR vaccine link and published his research in The Lancet is a fraud.

83

Wait a minute, how stupid of me. I’ve just spent minutes of my life in a pointless attempt to make people think for themselves. What the fuck was I thinking?

And yes, anyone who does not agree with me is obviously retarded.

I mean special

84

I don’t need vaccines. I have diplomatic immunity.

85

[quote]Lordcliff wrote:
Wait a minute, how stupid of me. I’ve just spent minutes of my life in a pointless attempt to make people think for themselves. What the fuck was I thinking?

And yes, anyone who does not agree with me is obviously retarded.

I mean special[/quote]

I hope you’re not referring to me.

86

[quote]SpookMayest wrote:
Hi, being a biology major, I am aware of the complexities of the immune system. That does not make me anymore likely to get vaccinated. Never said I don’t think we should stop giving them. It’s a personal choice on my part as it is for everyone else. I’m simply representing one side of the matter as a non-vaccinated person. [/quote]

That’s because your schooling is generally irrelevant to your ability to make competent decisions about epidemiological concepts.

87

When my wife was pregnant with our first child we researched the issue in depth to make our decision. This was eight years ago, so my memory is faded on details, however, I do remember thinking that the pro-vaccine materials we read were quite pathetic. I could go through most of them point by point and tear them apart. I do remember one point, almost verbatim, and it was, something to the effect “when a problem is discovered with a vaccine it gets pulled from the market”.

Well, thats nice but they can’t pull it from a little babies body. Once it goes in there’s no going back. With further research I learned that statement is not entirely true. When they learned of the egg allergy problem with some vaccines, they changed the processing methods for future productions. They didn’t pull the old ones from the market - the ones that still contained the egg proteins. It turned out my son is allergic to eggs and they were (at the time) still using the old vaccine in our area.

In the end, my wife and I chose not to get any vaccines for our children. The one we were tempted to get is the one for Meningitis. That is one nasty bug and it’s prevalent enough to be a concern. An intelligent poster, earlier in this thread, said they would seriously consider the MMR vaccine. I don’t agree. I don’t see any of the those three as being much of a risk. Rubella is just a bad rash as far as I remember.

Some other points I remember not sitting well with me; By age 2 something like 32 vaccines are recommended by the AMA. That strikes me as such overkill (no pun intended, but I like it) as to indicate an industry that can’t be trusted. The Chicken Pox Vaccine is ludicrous. It’s not very strong so it needs to be repeated every 7 years, verses if you just get it, you have nearly a lifetime immunity. Those who get the vaccine are much, much more at risk of contracting shingles later in life. Shingles is a much bigger threat than chicken pox.

88

[quote]stokedporcupine8 wrote:
Lordcliff wrote:
Wait a minute, how stupid of me. I’ve just spent minutes of my life in a pointless attempt to make people think for themselves. What the fuck was I thinking?

And yes, anyone who does not agree with me is obviously retarded.

I mean special

I hope you’re not referring to me. [/quote]

No I was not referring to you.

To your earlier point, antibiotic resistance. If everyone were immunized, and pertussis was eradicated, as smallpox has been (yes, they are not the same, as smallpox is virus and therefore is not affected by antibiotics, whereas pertussis is a bacteria), then pertussis would not even be around and be able to mutate.

Irresponsible doctors and uneducated patients have contributed greatly to the rise in antibiotic resistance. Years ago, you had a sniffle, you went to the doctor and asked for and antibiotic to make you better, even though odds are you had a viral infection, and antibiotics (ABX) wouldn’t do you any good for it. The doctor wrote a prescription to shut the patient up basically. The patient then went down to his local pharmacy and filled his prescription for whatever the doctor ordered, lets say 10 days worth.

The patient then takes his ABX for 3 days, feels better, and stops taking them. He keeps them in his medicine cabinet. 6 months later he cuts himself and gets an infected finger.

He has these ABX just sitting there, why not just take them. Who need a C&S (culture and sensitivity) to see if the ABX is right. So he takes his remaining supply. Just enough to kill off a majority of the natural normal bacteria causing the infection, but not enough to kill off the small amount of naturally mutated bacteria that are resistant.

These bacteria create a crazy bad infection that ends him in the hospital on strong IV ABX. But the doctors and nurses don’t use universal precautions like they should, and they start spreading this infection, lets call it MRSA, and voila, you have a major Staphylococcal bacteria floating around that they treat with Vancomycin.

But now they have Staph that even is resistant to that.

There is TB that is multiple ABX resistant
Vancomycin resistant enterococci
MRSA
ABX resistant C. Diff

But this ignores the fact that most vaccines people talk about are to build immunity to Viruses, for which there is no medicinal cure. Yes there have been strides in anti-viral drugs, but nothing that comes close to an ABX treatment used in bacteria.

If we can eradicate a virus or bacteria, then we only have to worry about terrorists getting their hands on what we’ve kept around to study. So while we’re at it, we should stop listening to the ACLU or whoever bitching about the rights of “detainees”, as they are not Americans and do not have the rights I do, because they are dirtbag terrorists, fuck em.

89

[quote]on edge wrote:
Those who get the vaccine are much, much more at risk of contracting shingles later in life. Shingles is a much bigger threat than chicken pox.[/quote]

Considering the vaccine was introduced ~20 years ago, I would like to humbly call bullshit on your claim.

Thank you.

90

I actually forgot to respond to resistance and vaccines

Vaccines expose your body to something that allows your body to fight off an infection using your bodies defenses, which potentially can rid your body of virus and bacteria before they can out of control and cause an acute infection

Antibiotics come in when your body can’t fight off what you’ve got, and kill off bacteria independently of your bodies immune system.

Don’t know actually how the pertussis vaccine specifically works, but vaccines in general provide your immune system with something to attack that is easy to kill off, a lot of times not an actual virus or bacteria. Smallpox for example, was discovered when Jenner noticed immunity in milk maids who had previously had cowpox, which isn’t the same as smallpox, but is related, and the body eradicated it once it had built up an immune response.

On a separate note, the comment saying don’t get vaccines because you need boosters in 10 years better not change the oil in his car, you just need to do it again in 3 month. Hell, don’t eat, you’ll just have to eat more later.

91

[quote]Lordcliff wrote:

On a separate note, the comment saying don’t get vaccines because you need boosters in 10 years better not change the oil in his car, you just need to do it again in 3 month. Hell, don’t eat, you’ll just have to eat more later.[/quote]

If you’re referring to me, I never said you shouldn’t get vaccines that require boosters. I merely said that one probably doesn’t need boosters for something like whooping cough or the flu that isn’t a serious condition for an adult. This argument has nothing to do with boosters themselves though, it just relies on the idea that one should always weigh the benefits vs. risk–ie, the benefits of a healthy adult getting a booster for whooping cough or the flu may not outweigh the risks.

Of course, you may argue like you just did that the benefits DO outweigh the risks for boosters like whooping cough, and you may be correct. I don’t know enough about these things to judge the soundness of your arguments.

92

[quote]Michael570 wrote:
on edge wrote:
Those who get the vaccine are much, much more at risk of contracting shingles later in life. Shingles is a much bigger threat than chicken pox.

Considering the vaccine was introduced ~20 years ago, I would like to humbly call bullshit on your claim.

Thank you.[/quote]

I call BS on this also. Shingles in a recurrence of the same virus that causes chickenpox, which your body learns to fight off and keep in check, but doesn’t actually completely get rid of. The virus sits around dormant oftentimes in nerves along the flank. Years later (like you’re old) you’re immune system isn’t what it should be, and the virus goes active, causing you a shit ton of pain (remember, it’s actually in the nerves).

Getting the vaccine boosts your immune system response, and can lessen or reduce the symptoms of an acute shingles flare up. While shingles is more painful in adults than chickenpox are in children, they are the some Herpes Zoster virus in both cases.

93

[quote]stokedporcupine8 wrote:
Lordcliff wrote:

On a separate note, the comment saying don’t get vaccines because you need boosters in 10 years better not change the oil in his car, you just need to do it again in 3 month. Hell, don’t eat, you’ll just have to eat more later.

If you’re referring to me, I never said you shouldn’t get vaccines that require boosters. I merely said that one probably doesn’t need boosters for something like whooping cough or the flu that isn’t a serious condition for an adult. This argument has nothing to do with boosters themselves though, it just relies on the idea that one should always weigh the benefits vs. risk–ie, the benefits of a healthy adult getting a booster for whooping cough or the flu may not outweigh the risks.

Of course, you may argue like you just did that the benefits DO outweigh the risks for boosters like whooping cough, and you may be correct. I don’t know enough about these things to judge the soundness of your arguments. [/quote]

I must have read it wrong when I looked at it the first time, you have a good point.

94

Just a thought for everyone to chew on.

After the government controls the health care industry, are we even going to have a choice?

95

I find it shocking that the people who are refusing to get these immunizations don’t understand why they are so important. People have made light of Rubella and chicken pox. The reason for getting immunized is not just to prevent disease in yourself. It’s to prevent the complications that occur if a woman contracts these diseases while pregnant. The fewer people getting these vaccines increases the chances that babies will be born with some awful complications associated with a disease that is completely preventable. This is an important point but seems to have been overlooked.

96

Oh gosh you guys. I don’t get vaccinated. Against anything.

So I’m going to cough on you. End of story.

97

[quote]SpookMayest wrote:
Oh gosh you guys. I don’t get vaccinated. Against anything.
[/quote]

Why?

98

[quote]earp wrote:
I find it shocking that the people who are refusing to get these immunizations don’t understand why they are so important. People have made light of Rubella and chicken pox. The reason for getting immunized is not just to prevent disease in yourself. It’s to prevent the complications that occur if a woman contracts these diseases while pregnant. The fewer people getting these vaccines increases the chances that babies will be born with some awful complications associated with a disease that is completely preventable. This is an important point but seems to have been overlooked.[/quote]

I concur

Side effects like
Mental deficiencies
Heart problems
Eye deformities
Hearing loss

But hey, if someone wants a retarded blind deaf child who is going die at 2 from heart problems, i guess that’s their choice.

Let’s remember also, there are an people who think that everyone else has their kids immunized, so they aren’t people to catch it from.

Yes, vaccines are not 100% effective. They have side effects just like anything else you take, i should just stop taking by benazapril because i get an occasional dry cough. I could stop taking my zolpidem because sometimes words start dancing on the book i take on my before bed shit. Why not dump my ritalin (which is IMO overprescribed to children, i didn’t start until 2 years ago.) because it can cause tachycardia, which with my WPW could kill me. Who needs an antidepressant, i might get dry mouth. Even driving to work had the potential to kill me. There are risks in everything we do, even though most people deny it or pass responsibility on to others.

House was right, people are (insert idiots, morons, stupid, etc…)

99

I fear that some of the thinking in this thread may lead to a US polio outbreak in our lifetimes. I have read some evidence that this is already starting. I for one, believe in evidence based medicine. What does this mean? It means we have wiped certain deadly diseases off the earth through vaccination, and we have pushed others out of the industrialized world through vaccination.

There has been no evidence supporting thymerizol <spelling is wrong, I’m sure> causing autism. Yes, this is a mercury compound. Table salt contains sodium, which is flammable on contact with moisture on its own, and chlorine, which is more lethal than any heavy metal. The binding of an element into a chemical compound completely alters the properties of all of the elements involved.

Now, all this being said, if the pharm. companies could remove this controversial compound, I wish they would, so as to prevent setting public health back a hundred years.

100

[quote]SpookMayest wrote:
Oh gosh you guys. I don’t get vaccinated. Against anything.

So I’m going to cough on you. End of story.[/quote]

I’m not saying vaccines are the answer to all our health problems. People genetically have different immune system strengths. I work in health care, and I treat everyone like they have something I don’t know about that I could catch. There are things there aren’t vaccines for. You are fortunate you don’t get sick, and I can’t say vaccines work all the time. But your argument that you haven’t been immunized and haven’t gotten significantly ill says nothing about the actual efficacy of said vaccines. You either a)have not been exposed to a significant amount of a pathogen, b)have a kick ass immune system so far, or both. It does not refute that vaccines are not effective. It’s like me saying that since I’m Finnish, I don’t have to worry about AIDS.