Ok so im training conventional and sumo heavy in the same week. After my sumo pulls i do defecit conventional pulls. After my conventional pulls i do sumo deficit. This is actually my first time doing sumo deficit pulls. How do they look?
Not a bad deadlift but I speculate you have technical issues even with your competition sumo lift.
First off, I think that your starting position isn’t ideal. If you pause at 22sec you will see a few things:
- look at your shoulders and arms - you are overtop and past the bar. You need to be more behind the bar.
- Look at your back angle - more horizontal than 45 degrees which is never ideal for a sumo deadlift. Tied with this is number 3
- Can’t definitely tell but it looks like your knees are forward and the hips are not open enough.
Basically I think that you need to work on these technical issues before doing any supplemental lifts. Learn to deadlift properly first. Again, not a bad lift but these are the most important adjustments. Along with theses setup issues, you also need to learn the proper motor pattern. An ideal sumo deadlift has almost 2 distinct phases. Watch somelike like Balyaev - there is a setup with a quite vertical back and well behind the bar. This sets up the first phase where one drives through the legs and the back stays the same angle. Then once the knees lock the HIPS come through and finish. Note that in this video you pull back before locking the knees and you finish with the back and don’t drive well with the hips. These cues will definitely help things move forward. This is a work in progress for everyone.
Aarramzy look at my 475x3 pull in the deadlift question thread pick it apart if you will
Also it might be good to point out that im doing more of a hybrid stance and am just a few inches outside of shoulder width so i assume the closer the stance the more torso lean. I was opening my hips but they were tight today. I usually do about 5 minutes of hip mobility drills before even attempting sumo. Check out that deadlift question thread keep in mind of the hybrid stance also let me know what you think. Actually here is the video.
Bump? Anyone.
What are you trying to get out of sumo deficit deadlifts? Most guys that pull sumo are really strong off the floor and have more trouble at lockout. Most guys that use deficit deadlifts are using them to build strength off the floor. At first glance it doesn’t seem to add up, so I’m interested as to why you are using deficit sumo deadlifts.
[quote]Silyak wrote:
What are you trying to get out of sumo deficit deadlifts? Most guys that pull sumo are really strong off the floor and have more trouble at lockout. Most guys that use deficit deadlifts are using them to build strength off the floor. At first glance it doesn’t seem to add up, so I’m interested as to why you are using deficit sumo deadlifts. [/quote]
I’m not speaking for the op because I’m not sure of his reason, but I use them almost every pulling session because they really help me loosen up to get in good position. I usually only use a 1" mat though but, if you have ever tried pulling sumo then you know trying to pull your self down even a extra half inch can be a challenge so it really helps loosen everything up making you much more comfortable with standard hiegh. I get up to 405ish I ditch the mats though.
I just figured id incorporate them for strength off the floor for regular sumo. Do sumo deficits work for strength of the floor for regular sumos?
First off the statement that most sumo deadlifters are strong off the floor is just ridiculous. When you lift in gear this may be true because you can actually use your suit when you deadlift sumo but for a raw lifter the floor is almost always the worst part of the lift.
Lifters might get it off the floor to the knee, but the success of a sumo deadlift is almost always determined at the floor, even if it breaks the floor it is important to know what position you are in which can decide if you will finish the lift at least 80% of the time.
Regarding the quality of the deadlift from the floor. I think it basically looks like a better version of the deficit lift. You are still a bit forward and your hips are certainly too high. Along with the high hips the bar is a bit forward, the back pulls back too soon, and you finish too much with the back and not enough with the hips (though a lot better than the deficit).
Mostly I think you need to learn to open the hips and set them a bit lower and pack behind the bar by activating the lats. I definitely think you need to learn to set the shoulders and engage the lats.
[quote]arramzy wrote:
First off the statement that most sumo deadlifters are strong off the floor is just ridiculous. When you lift in gear this may be true because you can actually use your suit when you deadlift sumo but for a raw lifter the floor is almost always the worst part of the lift.
Lifters might get it off the floor to the knee, but the success of a sumo deadlift is almost always determined at the floor, even if it breaks the floor it is important to know what position you are in which can decide if you will finish the lift at least 80% of the time.
Regarding the quality of the deadlift from the floor. I think it basically looks like a better version of the deficit lift. You are still a bit forward and your hips are certainly too high. Along with the high hips the bar is a bit forward, the back pulls back too soon, and you finish too much with the back and not enough with the hips (though a lot better than the deficit).
Mostly I think you need to learn to open the hips and set them a bit lower and pack behind the bar by activating the lats. I definitely think you need to learn to set the shoulders and engage the lats.[/quote]
Good to know. My question was really a genuine question. I was reading it and see how it might have come off as a criticism phrased as a question, but it wasn’t meant that way.
[quote]arramzy wrote:
For a raw lifter the floor is almost always the worst part of the lift.
Lifters might get it off the floor to the knee, but the success of a sumo deadlift is almost always determined at the floor, even if it breaks the floor it is important to know what position you are in which can decide if you will finish the lift at least 80% of the time.
[/quote]
This is very true. When I was pulling sumo, if it broke the floor it was getting locked out.
The only times it didn’t is when I would let my hips rise at the start. Then I could generally pretty much stiff leg it to knee height, but once there I’d have shoulders way over the bar, glutes and hamstrings in a completely unadvantageous position to get my hips through and finish the lift.