Quoted for importance…nothing too intellectual, just effort
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Sorry I’m tardy to the party! Been traveling for work and just got back.
I LOVE THIS PROGRAM. I’ve done it twice for a few months at a time. While it’s not a traditional split routine, it is a fantastic program. You get an off day after every training day to eat, recover, and feel fresh for the next one. Unlike some other full body programs, I find the volume for this one just right.
Lots of great comments on here already. Follow the plan for a few months to know how you really respond. What’s your goal with this program?
Hey, no worries! Glad to see you back.
I’m hoping to put on muscle mass while doing this program. I’m currently cutting and in 4 weeks I’ll begin a bulk, using this program.
I believe what’s held me back so far in terms of gains has partly been not eating enough, so this time I want to go all-out and eat everything in sight like Dan John suggests (so PB&J sandwiches in between meals, frequent cheat meals, and just overall enjoying myself food-wise, while maintaining a common sense template of rice+tuna/chicken, eggs and veggies, and all the muscle building meals I’m already used to eating day in and day out).
Mind if I ask you a couple of questions about the workout, since you did it already?
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Since the bench is present in all three workouts, did you do the standard flat barbell press every time? I’d like to develop my upper chest, so do you think it could be a good idea to alternate between the Bb press and, say, an Incline db press? I’m not very proficient at the standard Bb press either, as I rarely do it (I often sub it for the smith machine press)
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Since I suck at Pullups, and 25 reps might take forever initially, should I suck it up and do them anyway (instead of, say, a lat pulldown)?
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Same for the machine row. Did you always use the same? I love the Seated Cable Row and I also like the smith machine Bent over row. My gym also has a Seated “low row” machine which I rarely use but looks interesting at the same time. What’s more effective in this scenario? Variety or consistency of the movements? Do you think I should stick to one machine of rotate through them?
Thank you 
don’t do this. the smith machine is hell on joints, because it doesn’t allow for your natural movement pattern. or if you’re going to use it, use it VERY sparingly, with pretty high reps.
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Thank you for the advice.
I usually use the smith machine for neck presses, in which the bar tends to follow a more “straight” path, hopefully making it less of a big deal on my shoulders.
Cool, happy to offer some input!
Be careful here - this is a recipe for getting fat. Keep your common sense template, have one weekly cheat meal and stick to a caloric surplus of clean foods. Just like a smart cut to lose fat, it takes a slight surplus to gain muscle. If you cut to lose fat and get fat while bulking, what was the point? Have a 15-20% surplus, calculated, and don’t get sloppy. It’s WAY easier to get fat bulking than it is to do a smart cut. If you eat chicken and veggies and such, along with sandwiches, cheat meals and whatever you want, you’ll reverse any progress you made on your cut very quickly.
If you have a super fast metabolism and are a naturally skinny guy, maybe try a more aggressive bulking strategy, otherwise be careful and don’t go overboard.
Just my .02 on the subject, I haven’t benched with a barbell in years, because I feel dumbbells and machines are superior for chest development. So, yeah, subbing for incline DB press would be just fine, or flat DB press, or alternate.
Do you have an assisted pull up machine at your gym? That might be a good alternative. If not, try wide lat pull downs since you can’t do the volume necessary for pull ups.
THAT BEING SAID - if you suck at pull ups, try to get better at them. Purchase a quality pull up bar, hang it on a door you walk under a lot (like your bedroom) and pay your dues every time you walk under it. Try to do one pull up property from a dead hang, try your best. Eventually, you’ll be able to do one. Then try for 2, etc. This is the method I used years ago when I got into P90X and everything was pull-ups, I couldn’t do 1, couldn’t even lift my feet up off the ground. After a few months I could do 5-6, and after that it wasn’t hard to get to the 20-25, and then 30 range.
I love the seated low row, plate loaded. These are all good. I’d use the same movements for a little while to develop more strength and improvement on each one, then rotate. Don’t be afraid to change it up a little, but also stick to the exercises long enough to see improvements in your numbers.
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I know really, as I have gotten fat in the past.
HOWEVER, I remember that my last weeks of bulk were really frustrating: I was eating 3,500 kcal a day (I’ve been counting calories and weighing everything for just over a year) and the scale was barely moving.
Next time round I want to make sure that I gain weight at an appreciable rate, and I found that doing that by only eating “traditionally clean” foods is HARD. My diet has only consisted of rice with tuna or chicken for the main meals, eggs or a protein shake for breakfast and Pre bed nutrition, some snacks like sandwiches for mid morning snack, cottage cheese here and there, and not much else apart from my workout nutrition, whether I was bulking or dieting down.
What I plan on doing is keeping most of my meals the same as now, and add some more variety for snacks, including some calorie dense, less “traditionally bodybuilding” choices. All of this while still tracking calories and keeping an eye on fat gain, so I really don’t intend on getting sloppy with my diet.
Great to hear, I’ve had the same feeling! I always notice I can feel my pecs much more than with a Bb.
I do.
I mean, it’s not that I can’t do a single Pullup—I can probably bang out a couple of sets of 5-7 reps, but then I’d end up basically doing singles or doubles until I get to 25 reps. I can definitely do it, just wondering if it’s optimal.
Paul Carter gave me great advice in his forum about pulldowns and how they are just as good for lat development. But then again, for once I want to follow the program to the letter, so Pullups are due.
Great, so I might do Seated rows and low row machine, alternating each workout, so I do each movement 2-3 times every 2 weeks, and then after 4 weeks change it up. Or maybe just do one variation only straight for 3 weeks and then work on another (that’d have me do the same variations 9 times over 3 weeks before switching).
Thank you for the input, much appreciated
Get some lean beef in your diet, big quality steak at least once or twice a week etc
Also Italy has great fresh fish so make the most of it and get in some seafood other than tuna
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I forgot to mention it in my last post but I’m also eating salmon very often. Other than that, you’re right, I should add some variety as far as main animal protein sources… It’s just that smoked salmon and canned tuna are so convenient, not having to cook them, that it makes me forget about all the other options haha.
there is no natural human lifting movement that follows a truly straight path.
Sounds like a smart plan and you’ve got previous experience to pull from. As long as you’re collecting data, you’ll be able to make informed decisions. Good stuff!
Maybe have one day where do you actual pull ups, take longer periods and do as many as you can. I still think it’d be a good idea to have a pull up bar available and to do one or two every time you walk under to get more proficient and increase volume.
Sounds like a great plan, and you are very welcome!
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That are some great brands of tasty canned tuna and salmon out there, but most tunas are pretty high in heavy metals including mercury.
I eat a lot of fish and tested out to have very high levels of mercury and arsenic. While asymptomatic, it’s just not good and went through a chelation treatment to reduce those levels.
Wild caught salmon is a better choice, and among vendors Vital Choice has exceptional quality.
As a total aside here…
Pullups are great if you can’t do pullups (yet!) OR if you can do so many pullups that it gets silly… BUT they are not the same. They will allow you to target your lats and really focus on them in a hypertrophy/aesthetic manner. They won’t allow all of the other posterior torso muscles to work together synergistically, which is one of the real cornerstones of why pullups are such a great exercise, especially when you are just starting out, and need to pick which “bang for your buck” movements are musts in any training program.
Personally, I used to do pulldowns to really isolate my lats for several heavy, controlled sets, but then would come back later in my back session and finish with a few sets of actual pullups. Pretty brutal, but the payoff was definitely worth it.
S
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Sorry for my late response. Thank you for tagging me in the post. Obviously, I have been limited on time for posting for the past year.
Like others have said, so long as a program is not silly, it will get you results! Of course you can get bigger with this sort of program, as you can with any good full-body program. But, like we’ve gone over many (I mean many) times on this board and as authors have discussed in their articles, the issue of what sort of results a full-body versus bodypart-split produce.
If you simply want to get bigger, this sort of program, actually any decent program will do the job. But, if you want to look like a competitive bodybuilder, then I don’t think upper-lower splits or full-body routines will get the job done for most.
I suggest you use the search engine and find an old roundtable-style article by CT, Alwyn Cosgrove, and Chad Waterbury, which if I recall correctly was titled Bodypart-split Roundtable and Training Strategy Roadman by CT and look for the lengthy threads on this board discussing the matter.
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