Critique This Nutrition Log Please!

Diet and Nutrition
1

Hey,

I just joined another site and decided to copy this post to get some feedback from another online community.

I’m taking javelin very seriously in high school, and I’ve decided to follow a relatively strict diet, where I essentially consume over 200 grams of protein and completely avoid anything too processed. Right now in the gym, I’m following a 5-3-1 routine: squats/legs on Mondays, bench/chest Wednesdays, powerlifts on Fridays, circuits on Sundays, and arm work/rest on the other days. Beyond circuits, I’m not doing a very good job maintaining a cardio regime. Last week, I squatted 225x6, benched 175x6, and snatched 135x4 (I know the numbers don’t correspond with the workout exactly).

Since I’m 6’ 4" 208 now, I figured I might want to drop some fat and gain muscle with the emphasis on the former. Below, I’ve appended my nutrition log from the past 2 weeks. I usually consume at least 200g of protein, 2500-3000 kcals, and eat 5-6 times a day.

I was hoping that the T-Nation community could give me suggestions about javelin-specific exercises/training or nutritional tips of things I should eat/avoid etc. As you can probably tell, I’m a neophyte to a lot of this, so sorry for being so vague.

FYI: I threw over 180 pre-qualifiers at a meet yesterday (over 160 for the actual thing for a PR), so I was pretty psyched about that.

Wednesday (205lbs):
2 Slices of 7-Grain Bread with Jam
1 Glass of Skim Milk
2 Chobani Blueberry Yogurt

2 Slices of 7-Grain Bread with Jam and Peanut Butter
3 Glasses of Skim Milk
1 Chobani Blueberry Yogurt
1/2 a Rotisserie Chicken

2 Slices of 7-Grain Bread with Jam and Peanut Butter
2 Glasses of Skim Milk
1 Pure Protein Bar
1 Skewer of Chicken Kebab
1 Potato
2 Glasses of Skim Milk
4 Chocolate Non-Fat Meringues (Homemade!

Thursday (203):
2 PB and J Sandwiches (7-Grain Bread)
5 Glasses of Skim Milk
1 Blueberry Chobani
1 PB Sandwich
2 Chocolate Non-Fat Meringues
1/4 of a Chicken Kebab
1 Potato

2 Large Pieces of Chicken
2 Glasses of Skim Milk
1 Blueberry Chobani
1 Medium Chocolate Frozen Yogurt (Pinkberry)

Friday (205)
1 Blueberry Chobani
2 Glasses of Skim Milk
1 Glass of Sparkling Apple Cider

1 Pure Protein Bar
1 PB & J on 7 Grain Bread
1 Chobani Blueberry Yogurt

1 Scoop of Optimum Nutrition’s Hydro Whey Protein Powder
1 Chicken Breast
1 Glass of Milk

1 Matzah Panini with Pesto, 2 Slices of Mozzarella Cheese, 3 Pieces of Turkey
2 Glasses of Skim Milk

2 Glasses of Skim Milk
2 Chicken Breasts

2 Scoops of Optimum Nutrition’s Hydro Whey Protein Powder
1 Blueberry Chobani

Saturday (206)
1 Glass of Skim Milk
2 Scoops of Optimum Nutrition’s Hydro Whey Protein Powder
2 93% Lean Sirloin Burgers
3 Pieces of 7-Grain Bread: 2 with PB, one with Jelly

2 Chobani with Blueberry
1.5 Scoops of Optimum Nutrition’s Hydro Whey Protein Powder
2 Glasses of Skim Milk
2 Bananas
1 Bowl of Fiber One Frosted Mini-Wheats with Skim Milk and a Banana

2 Scoops of Optimum Nutrition’s Hydro Whey Protein Powder
1 Burger

Sunday (205)
2 Bananas
2 Glasses of Milk
5 Whole Wheat Popovers with Honey
1 Scoop of Optimum Nutrition’s Hydro Whey Protein Powder

1 Whole Wheat Chicken Sandwich with Lettuce and Tomato
1 Pound of Grilled Chicken
2 Glasses of Skim Milk

2 Scoops of Whey Protein
3 Bananas
2 Chobani Blueberry Yogurts
1 Chocolate Meringue
2 Glasses of Skim Milk

Monday (206)
1 Blueberry Chobani Yogurt
1 Banana
1 Bowl of Fiber One Frosted Mini-Wheats with Skim Milk and a Banana
1 Scoop of Protein Optimum Nutrition’s Hydro Whey Protein Powder
2 93% Lean Sirloin Burgers
2 Glasses of Skim Milk
1 Blueberry Chobani Yogurt

1 Bowl of Fiber One Frosted Mini-Wheats with Skim Milk and a Banana
1 and a 1/2 scoops of Optimum Nutrition’s Hydro Whey Protein Powder
1 Chicken Breast
1/2 Salmon Filet
3 Glasses of Skim Milk

Tuesday (206)
1 Glass of Skim Milk
2 Pieces of 7 Grain Toast with PB and J
1 Scoop of Optimum Nutrition’s Hydro Whey Protein Powder

1 Banana
1 Glass of Skim Milk
1 Blueberry Chobani
2 Pieces of 7 Grain Toast with PB and J
2 Scoops of Optimum Nutrition’s Hydro Whey Protein Powder

1 Yogurt with Cucumber and Mint
1 Salad with Diced Tomatoes and Cucumber
1 Chicken Kebab

1 Bowl of Fiber One Frosted Mini-Wheats with Skim Milk and a Banana
1 Blueberry Chobani Yogurt

Wednesday (206)
1 Glass of Skim Milk
1 Scoop of Optimum Nutrition’s Hydro Whey Protein Powder
2 Pieces of 7-Grain bread with Peanut Butter and Jelly

1 Chicken Sandwich with Whole Wheat Pita

2 Scoops of Protein Optimum Nutrition’s Hydro Whey Protein Powder
1 Smoothie with Mangosteens, acai, blueberries, pomegranate juice, banana, and almond milk
1 Banana
1 Glass of Skim Milk
2 Pieces of 7-Grain Bread with Jelly

2 Pieces of Chicken
1 Glass of Skim MIlk
1 Bowl of Fiber One Frosted mini Wheats with Skim Milk and a Banana

Thursday (207)
2 Pieces of 7-Grain bread with Peanut Butter and Jelly
1 Scoop of Protein Optimum Nutrition’s Hydro Whey Protein Powder

2 Pieces of Whole Wheat Bread, Chicken, Lettuce, and Tomato Sandwich

2 Scoops of Protein Optimum Nutrition’s Hydro Whey Protein Powder
2 Pieces of 7-Grain Bread with Peanut Butter and Ginger
1 Smoothie with Mangosteens, acai, blueberries, pomegranate juice, banana
1 Apple
1 Honey Tso’s Chicken with Broccoli (Sauteed)

Friday (207)
1 Bowl of Fiber One with Banana and Skim Milk
2 Pieces of 7-Grain Toast with PB and Ginger
1 Glass of Skim Milk
2 Pieces of Whole Wheat Bread, Chicken and Lettuce Sandwich
1 Siggi’s Yogurt Drink
1 Banana
2 appetizer with quinoa, beet, and deep fried bean thing
2 servings of beets
2 servings of quinoa
1 small piece of salmon
1 piece of grilled chicken stuffed with rice and meat
3 lamb chops
1 cup of berries and fruit

Saturday (5/14, at 208)
1 Scoop of Protein Optimum Nutrition’s Hydro Whey Protein Powder
2 Pieces of 7-Grain Bread with Peanut Butter and Ginger
1 Glass of Skim Milk

1 Banana
1 Siggis Vanilla Yogurt
1 siggis Blueberry Yogurt
1/2 Myoplex Chocolate Brownie Protein bar
2 Bananas
1 Apple
2 Glasses of Skim Milk
2 Bowls of Fiber One Frosted Mini Wheats with a Banana and Milk

3 Glasses of Skim Milk
3 Pieces of Grilled Chicken

2

holly shit balls dude, give us 1-2 days, i doubt anyone’s gonna read your entire post.

3

Could you post macro totals? I’m not putting all that into fitday.

4

  1. Eat real yogurt 3-4% fat, no shit added unless it is fruit you added yourself or protein powder.

  2. You eat a lot more sugar than you think, and likely not enough fat, in fact it appears you are fat phobic.

  3. Bread, bread, bread. Replace with quinoa, sweet potatoes, yams, even rice.

  4. More fruit and veggies. Replacing cereal carbs with bananas is a good start.

5

Again, I apologize for being so new to this. Are macro totals the amount of fat/carbs/protein/kcals I have for any given day? Thanks a ton for your advice, Peter, I’m certainly fat phobic for some weird reason.

6

Don’t apologize. Yes about the macros.

You already eat some excellent food, it is a question of making some small changes. If you are throwing well you must be doing something right.

In general, unless you are cutting, at least 2% milk and yogurt, and don’t worry too much about super lean meat lean is good enough for most, so eat some skinless chicken legs or breasts with skin.

7

These are pretty arbitrary numbers (aka I tried to be as accurate as I could from knowing the nutrition facts of what I eat off the top of my head):

Wed~2600kcal
Thu~2000kcal
Fri~2900kcal
Sat~2450kcal
Sun~1800kcal
Mon~2240kcal
Tues~2140kcal
Wed~2500kcal
Thu~1900kcal
Fri~2550kcal
Sat~2750kcal

On average, around 2350 calories daily. I’m consuming at least 1-1.5g of protein per pound (200-250), very little fat, and I’m not quite sure about carbs honestly

8

anyone else have suggestions??

9

If you are concerned with dropping fat, as you state in your first post, then ditch things like jam, meringues (???), frozen yogurt, sweetened yogurt, sparkling apple cider, frosted mini-wheats, honey, and fruit juices. As Peter Orban observed above, you’re taking in a crap ton of sugar in different forms. I just thought I’d be a little more specific. Substituting in fat-heavy foods in their place is indeed a good idea.

10

I’ll write you a diet for $20 paypal.

seriously.

11

Breakfast Shake:
2cups milk (whole preferred, but for cutting, you can go to 2%)
2 scoops whey - CFM isolate (assuming 25g per scoop)
5-10g leucine - optional, but if you do not take leucine peri-workout, then this dosing will work
1-2 banana - use 1 small if trying to cut carbs, 2 large for bulking
100-200g frozen raspberries - 6.5-13g fiber, minimal sugar, less banana = more raspberries
fish oil, vit D

65g PRO, 50-85g CHO, 15-30g FAT, 8-18g fiber
This is 600 Kcal minumum and can easily be adjusted to 800-900 with the banana, whole milk, and 10-15mL macadamia oil or PB. Strawberry and chocolate proteins mix well. You can drop the milk and go with something like Metabolic Drive Low-Carb in water as the base but add some fat to make up for milk.

Breakfast Pudding:
1.5 cup plain yogurt (2-4%)
2 scoops whey - CFM isolate (assuming 25g per scoop)
5-10g leucine - optional, but if you do not take leucine peri-workout, then this dosing will work
1-2 banana - use 1 small if trying to cut carbs, 2 large for bulking
100-200g frozen raspberries - 6.5-13g fiber, minimal sugar, less banana = more raspberries
fish oil, vit D

Pretty much the same as shake, just switch yogurt for milk. Put protein powder in bottom of bowl, carefully cover all the powder with yogurt, make sure you stir it up well first if watery - else protein clumps, mix with an eggbeater lowering slowly - don’t ram it to bottom right away rather go around bowl lowering with each pass, add fruit, enjoy. BTW using Metabolic Drive Low-Carb, particularly vanilla with the yogurt is insanely tasty.

I’ll post a couple other meals/templates tomorrow.

@ D Public: $20? really? Add a zero maybe you’ll seem serious.

12

peter…

10g of leucine and 50g of whey is absurd…the protein synthethic response maxes out around 2.5-3.5g leucine…

i would normally charge $20 paypal for such a tip…consider yourself blessed…

13

@ D Public:

There is far more involved in the homeostasis of muscle tissue than just the protein synthetic response. I would have agreed with you a few years ago when I limited meals to 40g protein and tried to eat 6 or more times, now I take the same food over 4 feedings and it works much better even when on higher Kcals.

I am blessed, I used the $20 for leucine.

14

Obviously, you are unaware…

enjoy your supplements…

15

Here is the study:

There is a clear relationship between increased concentration and MPS. The high range dose is around 20g IV, not oral. Figure 2 is interesting, but the rest of the paper is good too. In fact the entire supplement for the January issue of the Journal of Nutrition is full of leucine studies.

16

Increases in leucine dose result in more protein synthesis up to a certain point, but it is a S curve dose relationship…meaning after a certain point, it doesn’t matter how much leucine you add…you will get the same result…

from your own study:

"We also observed something that in retrospect seems obvious, i.e., that MPS turned off after about 2 h despite the continued availability of AAs, returning to basal postabsorptive values. In fact, it now seems that the behavior of muscle in the presence of exogenous AAs was similar to that predicted by Joe Millward (23) in suggesting that there was an upper limit to the amount of protein that could be contained within the muscle at a given time, determined ultimately by the muscle RNA:protein ratio and the connective tissue extracellular three-dimensional network. "

There is a refractory response to extracelluar leucine after a certain dosing as the muscle becomes “full” and unresponsive to further extracelluar leucine…

“the results suggest that there must be a desensitization of the signaling mechanism that senses and transmits information concerning the availability of AAs; second, it would seem that long-term infusions of parenteral AA-containing solutions are unlikely to maintain an anabolic effect beyond a couple of hours and that any AA not taken into tissue protein will simply be catabolized to urea.”

most papers suggest that .02g x bw of leucine is sufficient to maxmimally stimulate mps…

I’m not going to discuss this further, but i suggest you read all tipton’s studies when you have time…

17

First off, I should have wrote rate of MPS, not MPS. Also I think the studies you are citing are excellent, well done, and I am not disputing those findings. I have seen them and some seem to suggest that leucine is not useful even at 3g in presence of decent protein intake.

My 5-10 g recommendation is based on personal experience, client experience (a majority of my clients don’t use leucine BTW, but quite a few do), and anecdotal evidence from people I know to be good at controlling diet and supplement integration. I gave a range from reasonable to core and also stated that it was OPTIONAL. As for the cost, 3g vs. 5g saves you 25 cents a day at 2 doses a day.

If a 200 lb athlete is shooting for 200-300g protein a day and eats 5 times, that is 40-60g per meal, if he eats 4 times that is 50-75g per meal, so its not like 50g of whey is out of line when the meal only has 15-16g of protein otherwise. I don’t recommend more than 1-2 shakes a day, prefer whole food for at least half the meals or more.

[quote]D Public wrote:
Increases in leucine dose result in more protein synthesis up to a certain point, but it is a S curve dose relationship…meaning after a certain point, it doesn’t matter how much leucine you add…you will get the same result…[/quote]

No disagreement here, other than the fixed amount.

[quote]
from your own study:

"We also observed something that in retrospect seems obvious, i.e., that MPS turned off after about 2 h despite the continued availability of AAs, returning to basal postabsorptive values. In fact, it now seems that the behavior of muscle in the presence of exogenous AAs was similar to that predicted by Joe Millward (23) in suggesting that there was an upper limit to the amount of protein that could be contained within the muscle at a given time, determined ultimately by the muscle RNA:protein ratio and the connective tissue extracellular three-dimensional network. "

There is a refractory response to extracelluar leucine after a certain dosing as the muscle becomes “full” and unresponsive to further extracelluar leucine…[/quote]

I am interested in the increase in MPS rate during the 2 hours, not after. I do realize that my poor wording in the previous post made this unclear.

[quote]
“the results suggest that there must be a desensitization of the signaling mechanism that senses and transmits information concerning the availability of AAs; second, it would seem that long-term infusions of parenteral AA-containing solutions are unlikely to maintain an anabolic effect beyond a couple of hours and that any AA not taken into tissue protein will simply be catabolized to urea.”

most papers suggest that .02g x bw of leucine is sufficient to maxmimally stimulate mps…[/quote]

In conjunction with exercise…

[quote]
I’m not going to discuss this further, but i suggest you read all tipton’s studies when you have time…[/quote]

Of course you’re not, its a moot point.

I have read them, they are mostly concerning exercise.

18

@JavtheIV:

If you want a free Nutrition Assessment, PM me. I won’t upsell, or force a specific diet/supplement, rather work on making changes that will benefit you the most.

Includes 3-day assessment of macro and micro nutrients, hour phone consult, meal template/examples.

I usually charge $200 Canadian for this including taxes. I don’t normally do freebies. I do accept major credit cards.

19

Peter, you said earlier that I ate too much bread. The bread that I eat is Ezekiel’s 7-Grain FLOURLESS bread. Does that make a difference?

20

Also, could you give me some more examples of fat-dense foods? Do you mean cheeses/peanut butter? What else??

Thanks a ton