Circumcision Ban

[quote]maverick88 wrote:
Every “benefit” thethirdruffian stated can be found in only pro-circimcision sites and has been proven wrong by medical science. [/quote]

TTR cited to the Mayo Clinic. I too, found his link at the top of Google. The Mayo Clinic is not a “pro-circumcision” site. It’s probably the leading hospital in the United States.

I appreciate the fascination you have with Jewish boys’ penises. It reminds me of the loving concern Jerry Sandusky had for young boys. Giving and compasionate, just like Jerry, you are.

That said, I echo the sentiments by the supposedly-freedom-hating-Conservatives here who believe parents are, almost always, best suited to decide what is best for their children.

Circumcision has worked rather well for my people since the time of Abraham, and we, as a people, seem to be breeding rather well for a people your fellow socialists periodically try to put in ovens in one of the various other socialist utopian attempts.

Thank you for your concern; now keep your hands off our boys’ penises.

[quote]therajraj wrote:

Then please clarify
[/quote]

You are still in your early to mid twenties right?

You’ll get it in a couple of years.

I still have 2 questions when it comes to circumcision.

  1. Why does god want us to get them chopped? Why give us foreskins in the first place?

  2. Why not wait and let them decide if they want it when they’re older?

[quote]maverick88 wrote:

I have already said that to the Jewish it is something that is part of who they are. Medical benefits are not a real issue. I was directing my comments to people like you who do it because the men have had it done what are the benefits thre?[/quote]

So I have to be Jewish in order for it to be part of who I am?

I didn’t figure you would see where I was going with that.

Not sure about you, but my dick is one pretty motherfucker. It isn’t disfigured at all.

[quote]TigerTime wrote:
I still have 2 questions when it comes to circumcision.

  1. Why does god want us to get them chopped? Why give us foreskins in the first place?

  2. Why not wait and let them decide if they want it when they’re older? [/quote]

Who is “us” Are you Jewish?

Based on all the rantings from the anti-cut side, shouldn’t science have dictated all us cuters should be crazed, childless, lunitics, that just rape bitches because we are so disfigured and can’t enjoy sex anyway so why shoudl she?

[quote]Jewbacca wrote:

[quote]maverick88 wrote:
Every “benefit” thethirdruffian stated can be found in only pro-circimcision sites and has been proven wrong by medical science. [/quote]

TTR cited to the Mayo Clinic. I too, found his link at the top of Google. The Mayo Clinic is not a “pro-circumcision” site. It’s probably the leading hospital in the United States.

I appreciate the fascination you have with Jewish boys’ penises. It reminds me of the loving concern Jerry Sandusky had for young boys. Giving and compasionate, just like Jerry, you are.

That said, I echo the sentiments by the supposedly-freedom-hating-Conservatives here who believe parents are, almost always, best suited to decide what is best for their children.

Circumcision has worked rather well for my people since the time of Abraham, and we, as a people, seem to be breeding rather well for a people your fellow socialists periodically try to put in ovens in one of the various other socialist utopian attempts.

Thank you for your concern; now keep your hands off our boys’ penises.[/quote]

Wow being compared to a monster Very nice.

Easier hygiene:The penis does a good job of this and I am pretty sure one is supposed to clean when showering

Decreased risk of urinary tract infections: Raj has posted findings that prove this wrong.

Prevention of penile problems:If it is an issue have it resolved then. Some kids can develop many things you do not start cutting things off before any signs are present.

Decreased risk of sexually transmitted infections.: You are supposed to wear a condom if it is against your beliefs clean your dick and do not have sex with sluts.

Decreased risk of penile cancer:Cancer society has spoken against this.

It is a well established medical fact that the uncircumcised have an innate proclivity to hide things while the circumcised have tendencies to be soldiers (most likely from sporting a flesh helmet).

True story

[quote]Jewbacca wrote:

[quote]TigerTime wrote:
I still have 2 questions when it comes to circumcision.

  1. Why does god want us to get them chopped? Why give us foreskins in the first place?

  2. Why not wait and let them decide if they want it when they’re older? [/quote]

Who is “us” Are you Jewish?[/quote]

My expanding Jew-fro aside, this question was meant for anyone who feels God wants their boys to be circumcised, but I get what you’re saying.

To re-phrase the question: Why does god want Jews to get them chopped? Why give Jews (or any human for that matter) foreskins in the first place?

First of all, the argument being presented that circumcision is 4000 years old and a well respected tradition is just bogus. It’s been around for JEWISH people and is part of the JEWISH religion. It has NOTHING to do with gentiles. It was almost unheard of in the United States until the late 19th century until it became popular in England among the upper class as a “cure” for masturbation (and for those of us who’ve been cut, you see how well THAT IDEA worked, right? LOL). It then picked up prominence again after each of the major wars that the US has fought. So the idea that it’s an “age old tradition” is just bullshit.

Infant circumcision flies in the face of our country’s FAR older tradition of LIBERTY and INDIVIDUAL RIGHTS. It’s defended by a mindbogglingly inane perversion of those rights, a supposed “right” for parents to cut healthy tissue off of a helpless baby - a “right” that is totally extinguished when that baby is a girl…

Why not cut out the labia of an infant baby girl? I mean, it’s an extra useless fold of skin, right? It won’t affect reproduction, right? She’ll still have sensation and won’t remember the procedure cuz she’s too young, right? We’d be doing her a favor - later in life it’s one less fold of skin where she could get a yeast infections, right? So why don’t we just do it with ALL babies?

I would submit for your consideration that if you asked the doctor at the hospital to remove your infant daughter’s labia that not only would the procedure be refused, but child protective services would most likely become involved and the state would be on your ass like white on rice!

Now let’s make one thing perfectly clear: I am NOT a piece of shit Liberal. I believe in Liberty and all of the rights guaranteed to us under the Constitution. I am for small government, laissez faire capitalism, elimination of social wellfare programs and other “entitlements” that are bankrupting our country and I’ve never taken an unemployment check in my life. I’m also anti-abortion for reasons that have NOTHING to do with religion.

Let’s take a look at that last part for a second: so you think life is precious and it’s unconscionable to disrupt the SACRED embryo and believe that life begins at conception and that it’s MURDER to consciously END it because that growing HUMAN embryo has the RIGHT to LIVE, correct? So by extension, shouldn’t that SAME embryo have the SAME right to have the sanctity of his body kept intact once it’s born? It’s a logical fallacy of the highest degree to believe in a child’s right for life and then turn around and say it’s the PARENT’S right to cut the tip of that same child’s penis off “just because”.

It’s a double standard. It’s bullshit. By ANY logical definition, circumcision is genital mutilation, plain and simple. You can dance around the topic all you want. You can bring up tradition, religion, parental rights or any of the other “reasons”, but it doesn’t change the FACT that an infant circumcision is cutting away perfectly healthy tissue without the consent of the individual being cut. Those are the FACTS.

[quote]angry chicken wrote:
“just because”.

Those are the FACTS.[/quote]

Well, seeing as “just because” isn’t, in fact, the reason, it destroys your entire argument.

[quote]SexMachine wrote:

[/quote]

I think someone else may have already mentioned this but a bris is supposed to be performed on the eighth day not after. Now a parent is often/usually called upon to make life and death decisions for their child/children, certainly up until the age of reason(7-12) and legally up until they reach majority. Even if circumcision did carry a significant level of risk(it doesn’t,) the argument that legislation should be enacted to prevent parents from making the decision is absurd.[/quote]

I’m not sure if this is what you meant, but parents do not always make all of the life and death decisions for their children in the United States. For instance, if we got a 15 year old child of Jehovah’s Witnesses who was involved in a motor vehicle accident and desperately needed a blood transfusion, we would transfuse that mofo against the parent’s wishes. This is actually a relatively common ethical situation in the emergency department and ICU.

Fuck me, there are some intolerant people out there

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]angry chicken wrote:
“just because”.

Those are the FACTS.[/quote]

Well, seeing as “just because” isn’t, in fact, the reason, it destroys your entire argument.

[/quote]

Nice cut and paste. The FACTS I was referring to was that circumcising an infant is done so without the infant’s consent. Which is a blatant violation of the infant’s rights which (IMHO) should be protected under the Constitution. Roe v Wade grant’s rights to an individual after “viability”. A baby is CERTAINLY “viable” (by the LEGAL definition of the word as defined by SCOTUS), therefore should have the Constitutional right to have a voice in the matter about having his body irreparably altered.

Every child has a right to life but DOESN’T have a right to decide whether or not his body is mutilated?

Yes, I said MUTILATED. Here’s the definition:
mu·ti·late
â?? â??[myoot-l-eyt] Show IPA
verb (used with object), mu·ti·lat·ed, mu·ti·lat·ing.
1.
to injure, disfigure, or make imperfect by removing or irreparably damaging parts: Vandals mutilated the painting.
2.
to deprive (a person or animal) of a limb or other essential part.

Pleas tell me how circumcision does not fall under the definition of mutilation.

“It’s OK, cuz in MY family we mutilate ALL the kids - it’s tradition!”

Give me a fucking break.

[quote]angry chicken wrote:

“It’s OK, cuz in MY family we mutilate ALL the kids - it’s tradition!”

Give me a fucking break.[/quote]

You can call it all the bad names you want, and write all the words in the world in caps all you want.

Doesn’t change anything. It isn’t going to change how I feel about myself, my family, my name, my son or my choices.

But that must just be my repressed retardation and brain malfunction, and my guttural reaction to my horrid horrid disfigurement rendered upon me so forcibly against my will…

I am Jack’s subconscious, crying out for help.

Baptism is wrong, and you are damning a child an eternity in hell against his will. You can no longer dip your child’s head in water.

[quote]countingbeans wrote:
Baptism is wrong, and you are damning a child an eternity in hell against his will. You can no longer dip your child’s head in water. [/quote]

How can you possibly compare the two? There’s no evidence to suggest Baptism does anything.

You have doctors and studies outline the downside of circumcision.

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]maverick88 wrote:

I have already said that to the Jewish it is something that is part of who they are. Medical benefits are not a real issue. I was directing my comments to people like you who do it because the men have had it done what are the benefits thre?[/quote]

So I have to be Jewish in order for it to be part of who I am?

I didn’t figure you would see where I was going with that.

Not sure about you, but my dick is one pretty motherfucker. It isn’t disfigured at all.[/quote]

Jewbacca wrote who is “US” are you Jewish so, it is a big part. I see where you are trying to go with it but, I still do not see how praying, or communion is the same. I meant that there have been complications that led to severe problems/disfigurement. What happens when you pray a lot, tender knees? Communion, you choke a little? Would that stop you. You said yourself that if your son suffered a complication you may think about having it done to another, I doubt a Jewish father would because to them it is not just a little procedure.

You know, I’ve never thought about this issue… Mainly b/c it’s just accepted as something that should be done. But, when you think about it, seems these days that’s only issue really.

We have Danes, their ears are not cropped, b/c it’s a pointless tradition that serves no purpose… hmmmm

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]angry chicken wrote:

“It’s OK, cuz in MY family we mutilate ALL the kids - it’s tradition!”

Give me a fucking break.[/quote]

You can call it all the bad names you want, and write all the words in the world in caps all you want.

Doesn’t change anything. It isn’t going to change how I feel about myself, my family, my name, my son or my choices. [/quote]

Why are you ignoring everything else he wrote? You are picking one sentence (an opinion) and responding, who are you Kneedragger? It is mutilation you may not like the word but, that is what it is.