[quote]abcd1234 wrote:
So, while a chronic dipper may lose part of his jaw, technically he has a lower statistical risk of dying than the heavy cigarette smoker. [/quote]
False. I’m 100% sure said dipper will die at some point.
[quote]abcd1234 wrote:
FightingScott wrote:
But don’t kid yourself about what you’re doing by splitting hairs and saying to yourself “Well at least what I’m doing isn’t as bad as this or that.” It’s just as ridiculous as people who smoke or snort heroin claiming that at least they don’t inject the heroin.
Truth be told things such as dirty needles(and STDs), abscesses(and infections), and embolisms that one can encounter doing heroin intravenously are avoided by snorting it.
Same applies to tobacco products. Dip and chew will not contribute significantly to lung cancer, but your risk of oral cancers(relative to smoking even) is increased exponentially. Oral cancer tends to respond better to treatment as it’s usually detected earlier(visible lesions inside mouth). Lung cancer has a much lower survival rate. So, while a chronic dipper may lose part of his jaw, technically he has a lower statistical risk of dying than the heavy cigarette smoker. [/quote]
OH. MY. GOD. Who the fuck cares?
If someone’s health is such a big deal to them, then why the fuck are they chewing tobacco in the first place?
You can rationalize nearly anything you want to suit your needs. Maybe people who chew dip have a higher chance of dying in a fatal car crash because unscrewing, spitting into, and screwing on the top of a used coke bottle takes two hands.
I accept that some forms of tobacco use are worse than others. Fine. Woo Hoo. But why does it matter?
I’ll accept the rational of someone who drinks beer to feel good but doesn’t smoke crack to feel good because of the massive differences between regular crack use and ending the day with a beer.
But there comes a point where it’s just silly to distinguish between different types of drug use. If you’re dipping, you’ve already resigned a bit of your health in exchange for happiness. Not to the same degree that a crackhead does, nor to the same degree that someone who eats a snickers mini does either.
But someone who chooses dip over cigarettes for ‘health reasons’ doesn’t have a real understanding of what they’re doing, no matter how many facts about mouth cancer they can throw out.
[quote]rrjc5488 wrote:
abcd1234 wrote:
So, while a chronic dipper may lose part of his jaw, technically he has a lower statistical risk of dying than the heavy cigarette smoker.
False. I’m 100% sure said dipper will die at some point.[/quote]
I’m 100% sure every human will die at some point…
[quote]rrjc5488 wrote:
abcd1234 wrote:
So, while a chronic dipper may lose part of his jaw, technically he has a lower statistical risk of dying than the heavy cigarette smoker.
False. I’m 100% sure said dipper will die at some point.[/quote]
Besides, you skewed my argument. As it pertains to cancers, I’m willing to bet that statistically, risk of death is lower with smokeless tobacco, given that oral cancer is often detected earlier, responds better to treatment than lung cancer, and has a much higher 5 year survival rate than lung cancer.
[quote]FightingScott wrote:
abcd1234 wrote:
FightingScott wrote:
But don’t kid yourself about what you’re doing by splitting hairs and saying to yourself “Well at least what I’m doing isn’t as bad as this or that.” It’s just as ridiculous as people who smoke or snort heroin claiming that at least they don’t inject the heroin.
Truth be told things such as dirty needles(and STDs), abscesses(and infections), and embolisms that one can encounter doing heroin intravenously are avoided by snorting it.
Same applies to tobacco products. Dip and chew will not contribute significantly to lung cancer, but your risk of oral cancers(relative to smoking even) is increased exponentially. Oral cancer tends to respond better to treatment as it’s usually detected earlier(visible lesions inside mouth). Lung cancer has a much lower survival rate. So, while a chronic dipper may lose part of his jaw, technically he has a lower statistical risk of dying than the heavy cigarette smoker.
OH. MY. GOD. Who the fuck cares?
If someone’s health is such a big deal to them, then why the fuck are they chewing tobacco in the first place?
You can rationalize nearly anything you want to suit your needs. Maybe people who chew dip have a higher chance of dying in a fatal car crash because unscrewing, spitting into, and screwing on the top of a used coke bottle takes two hands.
I accept that some forms of tobacco use are worse than others. Fine. Woo Hoo. But why does it matter?
I’ll accept the rational of someone who drinks beer to feel good but doesn’t smoke crack to feel good because of the massive differences between regular crack use and ending the day with a beer.
But there comes a point where it’s just silly to distinguish between different types of drug use. If you’re dipping, you’ve already resigned a bit of your health in exchange for happiness. Not to the same degree that a crackhead does, nor to the same degree that someone who eats a snickers mini does either.
But someone who chooses dip over cigarettes for ‘health reasons’ doesn’t have a real understanding of what they’re doing, no matter how many facts about mouth cancer they can throw out.[/quote]
I was not arguing that one should or should not choose one form of tobacco use over another for health reasons, but that simply, distinctions exist. I was merely pointing out that different forms affect different organs and body systems to varying degrees, meaning that while smoking may harm the lungs and dip may harm the mouth more, the net effect of either on the body is not going to be beneficial(at least in terms of health, psychologically speaking, that’s another story).
[quote]abcd1234 wrote:
I was not arguing that one should or should not choose one form of tobacco use over another for health reasons, but that simply, distinctions exist. I was merely pointing out that different forms affect different organs and body systems to varying degrees, meaning that while smoking may harm the lungs and dip may harm the mouth more, the net effect of either on the body is not going to be beneficial(at least in terms of health, psychologically speaking, that’s another story). [/quote]
Fair enough. There are distinctions. Denying that would be silly. But choosing one over the other for those distinction is undeniably silly.
What (chemically) is in snuff tobacco that is so bad? Nicotine isn’t bad. Addictive as hell, but not bad.
[quote]hoosegow wrote:
What (chemically) is in snuff tobacco that is so bad? Nicotine isn’t bad. Addictive as hell, but not bad.[/quote]
Nitrosamines, primarily.
No moral judgement here, but I personally hate nicotine. It’s just so goddamn addictive.
My biggest regret is picking up smoking. I quit for the first time 9 years ago. It’s been a year now since I gave in and had one. It’s just always there, even if it’s been a couple years since you had one, you’ll be somewhere and someone will light up and you just WANT it.
I knew guys in the army who dipped and they told me it’s just as bad when it comes to the addiction.
Good luck to you, quitting sooner rather than later is probably easier, I hope the stuff you ordered helps.
Have no fear. Barack Hussein Obama smokes KOOL’s and Newports daily and he made it to be president of the U.S.
He claimed he kicked the habit, but his purple lips gave him away. Now staffer’s admit he sneaks a drag whenver he gets the shakes.
You know he’ll support the tobacco lobby every chance he gets.
“suck it in long and hard McLovin.”
<<<< " This stuff will make you a sexual tyrannosaur…just like me!"
Chewing tobacco makes me think of one police chief in some James Bond movies. When Bond was somewhere in the South somewhere somewhere some movie…
Can’t remember much more but I do know he was my fav personality in the movie
[quote]abcd1234 wrote:
hoosegow wrote:
Nitrosamines, primarily.[/quote]
The way I understand it, that is true from smoking, but I don’t think so for snuff. I preface this with saying I don’t know enough about it to speak intelligently.
I asked my uncle, an onocologist, the same question. He was unable to answer it and didn’t know.
[quote]hoosegow wrote:
What (chemically) is in snuff tobacco that is so bad? Nicotine isn’t bad. Addictive as hell, but not bad.[/quote]
I’m pretty sure it’s bad for blood health.
My DDS measures my gums every check up so see if we are at the critical point. Fortunately they have not recessed further since I quit in 2001. He wants me to have oral surgery but I won’t do it until absolutely necessary.
I was just at a party in my hood with the wife and a couple other 40yr old guys were dipping. I remember telling my wife how fucking glad I am that I kicked that habit. Cold turkey. Is bad news bro - hang it up now.