Can You Explain This Violent Arrest?

[quote]orion wrote:
mavrcksurfer69 wrote:
no i was seconding that i doubt you could put someone in a box lol

…and maybe you could who knows?.. but we’re doubting that you’ve ever had rounds come down range at you before… people that have usually dont talk so easily about killing someone, unless they’ve lost it too much.

We can usually tell when someones actually been through it bc they’re humble and they dont run their mouths like life is a video game.

The idea was more that you either resist or you dont.

Why halfheartedly resist if you are not willing to do what it takes anyway?

Therefore you a) shot the cop or b) go along peacefully.

Kind-of resistance means just acting like a drama queen.

[/quote]

A less warped person may consider trying to escape as an option to “resist”. Of course, most normal, law abiding, people cooperate with police.

[quote]OBoile wrote:
orion wrote:
mavrcksurfer69 wrote:
no i was seconding that i doubt you could put someone in a box lol

…and maybe you could who knows?.. but we’re doubting that you’ve ever had rounds come down range at you before… people that have usually dont talk so easily about killing someone, unless they’ve lost it too much.

We can usually tell when someones actually been through it bc they’re humble and they dont run their mouths like life is a video game.

The idea was more that you either resist or you dont.

Why halfheartedly resist if you are not willing to do what it takes anyway?

Therefore you a) shot the cop or b) go along peacefully.

Kind-of resistance means just acting like a drama queen.

A less warped person may consider trying to escape as an option to “resist”. Of course, most normal, law abiding, people cooperate with police.[/quote]

And sometimes they get jailed or killed for exactly that.

Not that “most law abiding people do it” is much of a recommendation in the first place.

I brought this whole thing up in the sauna today, out of 8 guys I’m the only one who knew anything about it. Even so, the conversation got pretty heated. We all sort of divided into cop haters and believers in the cause. I think that majority ruled that since the guy did continue to resist he got what was coming.

Its Pavlovian Conditioning.You look up at the sun and it hurts your eyes. You look again and it still hurts. You look away from the sun and it does not hurt anymore. TA-DA!! Same thing with this Zeljkovic guy at the UWO. He resisted: he got hit. He resisted again: got hit again. What would compell this man to practically beg the police for such a beating?

[quote]mavrcksurfer69 wrote:
I think it needs to go back to 1800’s style law enforcement where common sense prevails. For instance, that mother who went to jail for shooting the man who molested her daughter. If this was 1870’s the sheriff would have said good job and she would have never been arrested. Bring back open carry, and common sense and there wont be a need for so many police officers. [/quote]

x2

[quote]andrew_live wrote:
I brought this whole thing up in the sauna today, out of 8 guys I’m the only one who knew anything about it. Even so, the conversation got pretty heated. We all sort of divided into cop haters and believers in the cause. I think that majority ruled that since the guy did continue to resist he got what was coming.

Its Pavlovian Conditioning.You look up at the sun and it hurts your eyes. You look again and it still hurts. You look away from the sun and it does not hurt anymore. TA-DA!! Same thing with this Zeljkovic guy at the UWO. He resisted: he got hit. He resisted again: got hit again. What would compell this man to practically beg the police for such a beating?[/quote]

LMAO, you brought this up while you were in the sauna with 7 other dudes?

That’s hilarious.

Yeah why not? It was on my mind. There was a couple old guys, some fat dude, and a bunch more my age. One of the old guys actually said ‘they shoulda done a lot more to that ass’.

Missed this thread by a day and already 4 pages. Since the original question has been beaten to death, the only thing ill add is this. The suspects hands seem to be tucked under his body while hes laying on his stomach. If you’ve ever tried to pry someones arms out of this position, it is ALOT HARDER than it looks. Physical force doesnt work, pain compliance does. Additionally, pain compliance also doesnt work if the guy is tweaking or on pcp. From the behavorial characteristics (per the article) the suspect was exhibiting, his blood results will prob come back positive for some drug.

I used to watch videos like this before I was a cop and thought the same thing a lot of guys here thought, why does it take so many cops. Well I’m a 265lb cop now, and I have yet to be able to pull someones arms out from under them by myself!

I would not say most cops are assholes. I think most cops can be assholes. I dont neccesarily thing thats a horrible thing. Good cops should be able to console a grieving mother one minute and be able to talk the talk and walk the walk with a piece of shit parolee the next. As long as the grieving mother doesnt think im an asshole, I could care less what the parolee things.

[quote]JLu wrote:
mmllcc wrote:
JLu wrote:
Article: http://www.cbc.ca/canada/toronto/story/2009/10/16/uwo-beating.html#socialcomments

Video: - YouTube

How are police taught to subdue/restrain people? Because it looks like these retards are just using the “If it still moves hit it” approach. There’s like 6 guys there, why can’t they just have 1 guy per limb to pin him down?

The violence can be explained from the fact that the guy kept resisting arrest…and if you think it is so easy to subdue a man bent on not being subdued you should try it some time. Find six of your girlfriends go up to some random guy about your size and try to kidnap him. See how well it works out for you.

Stop comparing apples to lawnmowers; this isn’t a 1v1 confrontation with a temperamental child (as compared to in another post), nor is it me and 6 of my “girlfriends” trying to subdue a much larger man. This is 6 GROWN MEN, who are supposed to be trained in how to deal with situations like this, using a ridiculous amount of force. Has anyone who is agreeing with the force used ever wrestled/grappled or done any type of sparring? It’s pretty simple to pin down a single limb with your entire body.[/quote]

Have you ever wrestled somebody so high on meth that he is literally unstoppable?

[quote]orion wrote:
BulletproofTiger wrote:
someguyyy wrote:
Fuzzyapple wrote:
Well to me it looks like the guy was trying to get away.At 0.18 sec they don’t have him under restraint so how can you not use force? He was also holding the police officer’s leg etc. But near the end little excessive, IMO. The article said they used batons I saw no such thing.

24-30 seconds in you can see the cop closest and to the right hitting him with a baton, and you can hear it clacking on the ground a few times as the video goes on. Hey may or may not have been resisting a little bit, but IMO it was QUITE excessive. I understand it’s their safety, but it was also HIS safety on the line.

Well the dude broke two critical rules that put him in that situation and he has to deal with the consequences, those two things being, 1) don’t give the cops a reason to arrest you and 2) don’t resist.

Also, WTF do you think a baton is for, if not to hit people with?

Anal rape?

[/quote]

lol

Police officers are the only reason the scum bag next to you in the street, market, video store, etc. is not beating your ass and taking your shit. Don’t break the law and you won’t get your ass beat. We are lucky to have the freedoms we have in the U.S. and even Canada. People protest against the governments intrusion into our lives and yet they will not leave the country to go live some where the fuck else. I guarantee you’d want police officers like that to show up if somebody jacked you for your shit. Beware of bears.

Ok, gotta throw in my two cents worth. Most of the comments made about this incident are very ignorant. Looking at this video and making comments about cops beating this guy are just flat wrong and if you think they were “beating” him then your just looking for a reason to bad mouth cops. They were hitting this guy on his pressure points to try and get him to comply. Nothing wrong with that. Would you prefer that if this guy fought long enough not to be handcuffed that the cops said "well, never mind he doesn’t want to be arrested and we don’t want to force him into cuffs because we might hurt him, so we’ll just let him go and forget the whole thing occurred.

I bet if this guy slapped your little sister you would want him arrested by any means necessary. Even if he did something minor but it was still an arrestable offense then he should have complied with officers. It may not be pretty, but it is necessary to ensure the arrest. That is how we try to maintain law and order. If you don’t agree well, too bad.

Don’t be an arm chair quaterback. If you’ve never been a cop then you have no clue as to what it is like to deal with people who are hell bent on not being arrested. My wrestling coach used to say it takes 6 guys to handle a crazy man, so no, this wasn’t unreasonalbe; and there are no sure fire ways to subdue, restrain, and cuff people like this.

When I was in the police academy, and during my current training, we practice situations like this and when we play the roll of the combative individual it takes a lot of work to get him cuffed. Im a decent sized guy and I wrestled a couple of years in high school, and I can honestly tell you that if I was a bad guy and didn’t want to be cuffed I wouldn’t be. You could use six of the baddest MMA heavy weight fighters in the world and have them try to cuff me and I guarentee you they would have to work their asses off to get it done. And they would have to “beat me up” also. I’m not trying to say that I’m a big bad ass either. I’m just saying that it is hard to cuff people who don’t want to be.

FYI, The use of a tazer has never killed anyone (proven fact if you do the research in an unbiased manner). People who haved died after being tazed are going to die anyway because they are going through what is known as “Excited Delerium” which is a condition that these people create in themselves due to the abuse of several different types of drugs. (YES, this issue is highly debated, but the majority, if not all of the unbiased research shows this to be true.) Some times the restraining of these people exasperates this condition but unfortunately it is necessary because they are a threat to themselves and/or innocent persons, and they can’t be left alone to walk the streets, or “your neighborhood.” Im not trying to start a debate about the use of a tazer, but another “fact” is since the introduction of the tazer and the use of it has become more accepted and implemented less people, (cops and arrestees), are hurt, injured or killed, because of its use. People become real compliant after being tazed. AND YES, I HAVE BEEN TAZED. 3 TIMES VOLUNTARILY FOR TRAINING PURPOSES.

LISTEN, you don’t have to agree with me. Every one is entitled to their opinion. Just make sure your opinion is based on facts or real life experiences. Commenting on what cops are doing on the street by watching a shitty cell phone video isn’t appropriate.

Finally, Everyone knows that only “1%” of the population are the ones who actually commit crimes, don’t let the less than 1% of cops who are pricks make you think were all that way. Cops are people too, and just like every day people some are nice, some are mean, some are pricks, and some are cool. I bet anything that if those of you that think all cops, or most cops, are pricks that if you actually became a cop you would understand what this job is like and what it is like dealing with people who don’t want to deal with you. Its actually funny when someone has been arrested and they omplain that they were harrassed, beaten, or verbally abused and when the video footage is played the defendants are the ones being jerks and abusive, and the cops were being professional. This happens a lot.

OK, I’m done, sorry, had to rant. Thanks for reading.

[quote]mavrcksurfer69 wrote:
First… if someone “jacks your shit” lets be honest… the police are gonna take a report, then tell you they didnt see it happen so theres not much they can do, then they’re gonna leave, then they’re gonna go pull in a parking lot and finish their report… then at the end of the night its gonna go on their sgt’s desk… then the sgt will give it to the detectives who will put it at the bottom of the pile of 100 other cases that are more important. So all in all law enforcement today has pretty much become the equivalent to mall security. Take a report… nothing happens.

Second even if I wasnt a cop I wouldnt get jacked bc I’m always armed and I have situational awareness that allows me to avoid getting jacked in any form.

Dont rely on law enforcement for anything… thats a good way to always get fucked in the ass or dead.

Handle your own shit. If you have half a brain, then you can almost always solve your own problem or deal out your own justice that will be swifter and more just than anything the fucked up system will do for you.[/quote]

Although, i do believe that some things are made for you to handle yourself. I was just re-iterating that when really bad things happen, the first thing you always end up doing is calling 911. And anyways, i’ve seen more off duty police officers get their asses handed to them at my clubs then not. Can’t bring a gun into a club here in Hollywood.

At least now i know i can jack people for their shit in Florida. What county do you work in again? lol

[quote]johnson575 wrote:
Police officers are the only reason the scum bag next to you in the street, market, video store, etc. is not beating your ass and taking your shit. Don’t break the law and you won’t get your ass beat. We are lucky to have the freedoms we have in the U.S. and even Canada. People protest against the governments intrusion into our lives and yet they will not leave the country to go live some where the fuck else. I guarantee you’d want police officers like that to show up if somebody jacked you for your shit. Beware of bears.[/quote]

LOL!!

I have been “jacked for my shit” and the cops took a statement and that was all. I never saw my “jacked shit” again and trust me, few other people are either unless it is a car that has been lo-jacked (and then it is doubtful you will see it in tact again).

I have been to third world countries and I agree, most people (including those in this thread who are writing like you just did) take much of what we have for granted.

That doesn’t mean I can’t voice my disapproval when I get followed and pulled over by cops for no reason simply because I “look suspicious” (this happened last week, followed for over a mile to have them flash their lights when I turn off the road to let them pass…no ticket, no laws broken).

No, I appreciate police officers but if you really can’t see that there are REAL problems in many cases simply due to abuse of power, then you must not get out much.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
johnson575 wrote:
Police officers are the only reason the scum bag next to you in the street, market, video store, etc. is not beating your ass and taking your shit. Don’t break the law and you won’t get your ass beat. We are lucky to have the freedoms we have in the U.S. and even Canada. People protest against the governments intrusion into our lives and yet they will not leave the country to go live some where the fuck else. I guarantee you’d want police officers like that to show up if somebody jacked you for your shit. Beware of bears.

LOL!!

I have been “jacked for my shit” and the cops took a statement and that was all. I never saw my “jacked shit” again and trust me, few other people are either unless it is a car that has been lo-jacked (and then it is doubtful you will see it in tact again).

I have been to third world countries and I agree, most people (including those in this thread who are writing like you just did) take much of what we have for granted.

That doesn’t mean I can’t voice my disapproval when I get followed and pulled over by cops for no reason simply because I “look suspicious” (this happened last week, followed for over a mile to have them flash their lights when I turn off the road to let them pass…no ticket, no laws broken).

No, I appreciate police officers but if you really can’t see that there are REAL problems in many cases simply due to abuse of power, then you must not get out much.[/quote]

Yeah, we all know that many/most cops abuse their power to some degree, and many also seldom offer help in situations that call for it (like when you get your shit jacked), but let’s not use these facts (which are undoubtedly true) to detract from the point of the thread which is that if you resist, you will get your ass kicked, and that seems justifiable as long as the force is appropriate.

To be honest though, there are two cops at least that appear to deserve being reprimanded or at least investigated (to scare them). But the video didn’t seem like they hurt the guy that bad, so if he’s alright, then investigation over. If he is not, then this would obviously weigh into the investigation and call for some punishment if it was determined that their tactics were against policy (which some of the tactics certainly appeared to be).

Anyone have an update on any injuries the guy sustained, or have a link to a press statement by the police department involved?

Fuck the police.

I’ve gotten my ass beat three times in the last ten years for NOTHING. Not even speeding. Just driving late at night. But I’ve danced to this song before on a different thread last month, so I really don’t feel like responding to all the people who say, “well you MUST have been doing SOMETHING”. All the occurrences were in PG county MD. Google it if you like. Those fucking asshole cops in the video should have their shins broken.

OP - If you really think this is police brutality then go to a country like China where this scum bag would have been been beaten much worse or shot on scene and or bambooed after the fact. Maybe some of those cops weren’t experts in submission techniques, but what of it? If you’re not happy with their training, then make a statement about that, but don’t pretend like this is that bad of treatment for this criminal (and yes he is clearly a criminal regardless of any other alleged crimes, as he is actively resisting in the video)

[quote]BulletproofTiger wrote:
OP - If you really think this is police brutality then go to a country like China where this scum bag would have been been beaten much worse or shot on scene and or bambooed after the fact. Maybe some of those cops weren’t experts in submission techniques, but what of it? If you’re not happy with their training, then make a statement about that, but don’t pretend like this is that bad of treatment for this criminal (and yes he is clearly a criminal regardless of any other alleged crimes, as he is actively resisting in the video)[/quote]

Really? So if someone takes offense to an act committed by police HERE, the reaction is to point out a more fucked up country where they do worse?

Let me see, how about you get to wait in an emergency room waiting area for 9 hours while you bleed out without treatment…but after you die, let’s point out that some countries don’t even HAVE emergency rooms!!!

The day I see someone fall down to the ground with there hands behind there back…then get piled and kneed and kicked is when Ill think it was police brutality…the cops have to be worried about being shot and stabbed etc…if you dont do what they say…in a loud voice multiple times…then its your own damn fault.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
BulletproofTiger wrote:
OP - If you really think this is police brutality then go to a country like China where this scum bag would have been been beaten much worse or shot on scene and or bambooed after the fact. Maybe some of those cops weren’t experts in submission techniques, but what of it? If you’re not happy with their training, then make a statement about that, but don’t pretend like this is that bad of treatment for this criminal (and yes he is clearly a criminal regardless of any other alleged crimes, as he is actively resisting in the video)

Really? So if someone takes offense to an act committed by police HERE, the reaction is to point out a more fucked up country where they do worse?

Let me see, how about you get to wait in an emergency room waiting area for 9 hours while you bleed out without treatment…but after you die, let’s point out that some countries don’t even HAVE emergency rooms!!![/quote]

Re-read the post, and the one above it. You can’t think that I am in favor of unfavorable conditions, China, or dickhead cops in this country for that matter. The point was not to “point out a more fucked up country where they do worse.” The point was that the degree of brutality wasn’t really all that great in comparison to what it could have been.

theyre cops, not professionals lmao - give em a break.