Barbell press to top of head: 3x3 95, 105, 105
Axle power cleans from mats: 4x3 70, 90, 100, 100
Barbell press: 3x3 95, 100, 100
Notes:
Tomorrow: Press/Deadlift. Low volume, 3x3 for both. Full press. Deadlift to knees.
Barbell press: 3x3 100#
Deadlift to knees: 3x3 275#
Notes:
woke up with more shoulder pain than usual. Volume was higher yesterday, between pressing and racking the cleans. I haven’t done any hanging for a couple days. That would have been 10 minutes out in the heat I didn’t want. But today is cooler.
tailbone tightness again this morning… but not yesterday after the workout. Pretty convinced it’s the cleans that “fixes” it temporarily.
warmed up with some 135 lb deadlifts, working on keeping the bar touching the legs the whole time. Played with feet angled straight or out. Not settled on anything at this point.
oops. first set was full deadlifts because I wasn’t thinking. Also first rep of last set.
hook grip is going to take awhile to get used to again.
Calvert stuff later
Monday: Medium volume. 4x3. Press/Deadlift. Full Deadlift. Full Press.
I think all triples all the time will probably become a problem. It’s convenient because it can easily autoregulate to 65-75%, and you know what those triples should feel like… but you also get good at doing triples and only triples. Probably not great if you ever need to do more/less than that.
This was bad analysis work of #37, but looking at it one way, you can say 20% of the time use doubles, and 80% use triples. Or 50% of the time use doubles and 50% of the time use triples. One of those was based on the “heavy set” and one of those was based on “all sets over 50%”. I can’t remember which is which.
Anyway, roughly averaging those, I’ve got a coin-flip solution that keeps in the same autoregulated intensity range. 3x3, 3x3, 3x3 is basically the same tonnage as 5 sets x 2, 5x2, 2x5.
3/4ths of the time, do the triples as prescribed. The other 1/4 of the time, rotate through a sequence of doubles, doubles, fives. If it’s a 3x3 session, work through the sequence of 5x2, 5x2, 2x5. (30 reps over the 3 sessions, versus the 27 with triples.) If it’s 4x3 session, work through the sequence of 6x2, 6x2, 2x5 (34 reps, versus the 36 with triples.)
Between the two, it’s 64 reps vs 63 reps, and average intensity is really really similar. The math doesn’t quite work this way because it’s not actually working at RMs, but if it were RMs, 3s are 94% and the average of 2s + 2s + 5s is 94.3%. If you’re “autoregulating” to similar efforts, they should be essentially equivalent.
Chart to maybe make it clearer.
Also, I’m starting to think “Russian Roulette” is a great name for this program.
US lifting experts → Soviet Scientists → Pavel → Dan John
merged with
US lifting experts → Soviet Scientists → Sheiko
With some randomness on top.
My understanding evolves more. Some of this is Pavel (especially Power to the People). Some is Sheiko. Some is Dan John.
Main ideas:
That’s a lot of ideas I guess. All of these have references. Most were transmitted or interpreted from Sheiko’s work.
The flowcharts, a few posts above, capture those ideas with the randomization. Easy to implement with coin flips, and hard to do with Excel.
Some averages for the current plan. Average is 12 reps per lift per workout with an INOL of 0.4 per lift. The whole workout is 24 lifts and INOL of 0.8.
I used to train using INOL. I would basically squat and bench Monday heavy and Friday light, week 1 I’d do 5s on Monday and sets of 10 on Friday, then week 2 I’d do sets of 3 on Monday and a 16-20-rep set on Friday. I did deadlift and overhead press on Wednesday on the 531 progression. I felt fresh and ready to go if I stuck to the INOL guidelines. I remember how pumped I was when I went from doing 185 on the 5s day to doing 185 on the 20 rep day.
I did some reading about velocity based training and running some of my videos through a tool. I’m very very impressed.
It seems that “mean concentric velocity”, which is easily measured by my phone, is a highly accurate predictor of %RM.
I ran some numbers for my OHP max attempt a month or so ago, and it looks like these velocities (in m/s) correspond with my %RM.
If I understand this correctly, I can just measure mean concentric velocity and bump the weight as needed. No subjective RPE or RIR or how I “feel” to autoregulate.
Also my observation about “I seem to be stronger in the lower half of the lift” shows up on the graph.
And I now now my sticking point is right about eye level.
Cool stuff.
The velocity to relative intensity ratio is bizarrely consistent.
And surprisingly linear. This is an n=1 but I’ve seen several others.
Did you stop using INOL then?
Yes, after a long break I decided to start lifting again using 531 instead of messing around with my own programming. What velocity app is that you used? I would think bar velocity, RPE, percentage, and RIR would all be pretty closely related, although I have had many days where I felt tired and sluggish but moved very quickly.
WL Analysis.
I tried a couple others, but they had trouble consistently finding the barbell/plates. This one lets me easily trim down the video, so I can get rid of start/end where I’m blocking the view. Also, it’s easy to manually show it where the plates are when the image recognition doesn’t work automagically.
It’s not hands off, but it’s serviceable. I played with it before spending the one-time $9 on it. That mainly just gives me more than one video, and the “average” values at the bottom. There’s other features but I probably won’t use them.
Yeah, that was my experience long long ago when I tried a daily-max “Bulgarian”/Squat-every-day style. After a month of “maxing” every day, I felt worn down, but how I felt rarely matched what I could do.
Measuring bar velocity seems like a really promising option, especially since I can tolerate a decent amount of error, like averaging “somewhere between 65% and 75%” over the course of a week.
I was reading some other places where people are looking for error of like 0.02 m/s or less (mostly when trying to do things like “when do I terminate a set”). And maybe that matters. But I can tolerate 10x that much error with what I’m trying to do.
My current take on INOL is it’s probably a useful thing to track, but also probably needs a lot of individualization. Answering questions like “what’s the minimum INOL to make my lifts go up” and “what’s the maximum INOL I can handle before I feel worn down”, and sticking in that range. Just as a means to compare against yourself, not others.
As concepts (with different uses), using velocity for decisions seems a lot more useful than INOL.
Training is a bit askew at the moment due to life. Under a bit of a time crunch because the school year hasn’t started, and preschool/pre-K is over. Half-day summer camp stuff is just half day. And last week’s heat wave. So, during my workday, trying to “babysit” (ahem, “parenting”) and fit in lifting.
Things should stabilize in early September.
2 lifts a day doesn’t take much time. Calvert stuff does. I’m going to just rank those exercise by priority and use them as “accessories” as I have time. It feels lame to be program hopping, but I just can’t do it right now.
For the press, in decreasing priority: situps, hanging, windmills, rows, wrist roller, pullovers, side press and/or alternating press, jefferson squat, squat variations.
For the deadlift, in decreasing priority: swings, forward bend, windmills, jefferson squat, squat variations, rows
Forward bends are nearly maxed out at Calvert’s “work to 100 lbs”. Swings are a long ways away from 100 lbs. Hangs and windmills have important shoulder benefits. I’m just barely keeping shoulder pain at bay as it is.
Medium Volume Press/Deadlift
Barbell Press: 100# x 4 x 3 - (0.78-0.70 m/s, 74-78% 1RM)
Deadlift:
275# x 3 x 3 - (0.48-.60 m/s, maybe 76-87%? see below)
245# x 1 x 3 - (0.40 m/s ???)
Notes:
Tomorrow: High Volume. Full Press 3x3, Clean 4x3, Full Press 3x3.
Later today: At least swings, abs, hanging. Maybe more.
H2H Swings: 50# x 10
Straight-leg Situps: 36# x 9
Hangs: 10 minutes total of hanging alternated with 1 set each of 30x 5# front, side, rear plate raises (kirsch protocol)
New rule.
As soon as any of my press velocities hit the 70% 1RM mark, increase the weight next workout. Or more specifically, if the mean velocity of any press rep is 0.87 m/s or faster, add 5 pounds.
Spelled out (mostly for my own future reference):
This, objectively, will also tell me if my programming is working. No need to max out because the rep speed tells me whether I actually am getting stronger or not.
First set today I already exceeded that 0.87 m/s threshold, so increasing to 105 pounds working weight!
Psychologically that’s an interesting phenomena. It’s basically using CAT as a motivational tool. I set that as my goal, and now, instead of just lifting the weight, I also want to lift the weight faster.
On the other hand… yay, 105, lame.
On the other other hand, the fact that I lifted 100# at 0.94 m/s suggests a potential 1RM of 151#. Less lame.
Form wise, on the first rep of each set, I seem to be lifting my heels slightly which I think would disqualify me per USSF rules. My max with “correct” form was 0.90 m/s which still puts the potential 1RM at 146#.
Full Barbell Press: 100# x 3 x 3
Axle Clean: 110# x 4 x 3 - big boy plates, from the ground
Full Barbell Press: 100# x 3 x 3
Notes:
Some people care about velocity drop off. There was an interesting study using that for strength gains. Basic takeaway: limiting velocity dropoff in a set to 20% or less led to more strength gains.
Velocity on the first set was about 0.90 m/s and the last set was about 0.78 m/s. So first set was ~68%, and last reps were ~74% 1RM. Velocity dropoff across sets was 13%.
This work was fine. Not too hard, not too easy.
I’ve been getting some tension in my low back, immediately above my hips. Almost like the tendons themselves are getting stressed. Not quite “pain” but worth watching. Felt with both deadlifts and cleans.
Tomorrow: Low Volume. Bottom Half Presses 3x3. Full Deadlifts 3x3.
Upper-back Meadows Rows: 35# x 14 (per side)
Forward Bend: 98# x 10 (strapped)
Hanging: 10 minutes hanging and raises with Kirsch protocol
Notes:
Low Volume.
Bottom Half Presses: 105# x 3 x 3 - to just above the head
Full Deadlifts: 245# x 3 x 3
Last set
Workout Notes:
Velocity training Notes:
deadlift speed came up in the later reps. Fastest reps were approaching 0.70 m/s, suggesting that I’m working around 70% (using other people’s numbers, not mine). I may throw on another 10 next time. I think this (> 0.70 m/s) is probably a good threshold to add weight.
according to sources, “slow” lifts like presses, deadlifts, squats, bench are best measured and compared using “mean concentric velocity”. But for “fast” lifts, like cleans or high pulls or Oly lifts, they’re best compared using “peak concentric velocity”.
per “peak concentric velocity” data (again, someone else’s data), it looks like my axle power cleans are only around 60% 1RM max, so I guess I’ll have to up the weight. Cleans are new to me.
H2H Swings: 50# x 12
Straight-leg Situps: 36# x 10
Shoulder hanging stuff later today. Same thing. 10 minutes a day, every day.
Tomorrow: Medium Volume. Bottom Half Presses 4x3. Axle Cleans 4x3.
Flipping coins to figure out what I’m doing is kind of neat. The anticipation adds something to this process.
This was some of the most complex spreadsheet work I’ve ever done in my life. Definitely the wrong tool for the job, lol.
I implemented a good chunk of the parts above:
I haven’t added in the “modifications” like bands/chains and pauses.
A sample “program”. This is what I’m basically doing with the coin flips. Well, not the rep variations, yet.
Bottom Press = to the sticking point above the head
Top Press = from the sticking point above the head (such as from pins)
Bottom Deadlift = to the knees
Top Deadlift = from the knees (such as block pulls)
Bottom + Full and Full + Top are a single rep that encompasses a rep and a half of motion.
I swapped out the bottom partial presses for top partials. Mostly because I wanted to test out the setup with the “basic power bar” using chains and loading pins.
Bar was at the top edge of my forehead.
In real life it’s a lot clumsier than that drawing suggests…
Top presses: 105# x 4 x 3
Axle cleans: 130# x 3; 120# x 3 x 3
Notes:
Tomorrow: Low volume. Press 3x3. Partial deadlift to knees 3x3.
Later today: rows, forward bends, hanging
EDIT: The least clumsy of the sets, for comparison with the above photo…
This was a good discussion. Pavel talking about many of the same things I learned from the Sheiko book.
I also saw a Strongfirst article by Pavel, discussing “The Soviet System”:
This comment validated that I’m not on the wrong track:
This is interesting… so youve set up a camera system that measures bar velocity? Super cool.
Not for me, but just cool.
A dedicated actual camera system sounds cool. Much cooler than what I have.
It’s an app, WL Analysis. Import a video and it can usually find the plates. If not you can just zoom in on the plates or end of the bar.
Then it draws graphs of position, velocity, acceleration, force, power. You can zoom in on a single rep and read stats at the bottom.
Also shows bar path.
Pretty neat technology. Might actually be useful, even.
