Hey all, been lurking for a while and thought I’d post about something I was wondering about. I’ve recently just been doing a 5 day split in the gym which I enjoy, but I want to get stronger. I don’t want to be a poser thats big but not strong, I wanna be as strong as I look (which probably isn’t much right now lol)
My stats are:
6’0’’ 160 pounds ( would like to get to 180 )
190 bench
225 squat
315 deadlift
135 OHP
I’m just gonna try some macros out and in a few weeks if my weight has gone up or down I’ll fluctuate the macros.
I recently made the mistake of hiring a macro coach, and he had me on 65 fat 225 carb and 175 protein while doing 3 cardio sessions a week, i started losing weight. So in all honesty these macros are just a guideline where if i gain more than a pound a week I’ll lower the carbs or fats until its around a pound or a half of one.
And thanks for the welcome, great to be here. So much to read and learn I don’t know where to start!
Why are you trying to keep your weight gains down to 1/2lb a week? If you are looking to add 20lbs? At 6’ 160lbs I would imagine you are very skinny, am I wrong?
Yes I am skinny but at 1/2 pound to a pound a week it would keep fat gains down more than gaining a couple pounds a week. If my macros/calories are off, what would you recommend?
[quote]str8_flexed wrote:
Yes I am skinny but at 1/2 pound to a pound a week it would keep fat gains down more than gaining a couple pounds a week. If my macros/calories are off, what would you recommend?[/quote]
I think that is a solid plan. No reason to pack on tons of fat but I think someone who is 6’ 160lbs will probably find it a large adjustment eating enough calories to grow. If you eat quality foods and work hard you wont gain much fat. You have realistic goals and a decent starting point so see how it goes and adjust when needed.
You need to eat far more then that. When I was your weight I was eating 3300-4000 calories a day and I bulked up without gaining much fat. At your weight and height I would not worry about gaining fat at this stage.
[quote]str8_flexed wrote:
… if i gain more than a pound a week I’ll lower the carbs or fats until its around a pound or a half of one.[/quote]
When a 19-year old, 6’ tall, 160-pound guy who’s lifting five days a week tries to intentionally limit his bodyweight gains to 2-4 pounds per month, he’s asking for:
Slow, if any, actual gains. Half a pound a week, really? Your body can change that much from 8:00am to noon on a Tuesday. It’s such a small fraction of measurement, it’s nearly negligible in this situation.
Simply wasted time and energy. Most guys here would love to get their teen years back to do-over again and train better. You’re in a prime position, in terms of natural hormones and recovery abilty, to gain strength and muscle if you really wanted to go for it.
Overfocusing on the short term and missing the bigger picture. It’s fine if you want to shoot for weighing 180, but panicking and cutting calories every time you think you gain an ounce of fat is the reason why plenty of guys stay skinny and unmuscular.
Are you doing a 5/3/1 template? Or a 5-day split? Or 5/3/1 spread out over 5 sessions? Or What?
I’m doing a 5 day split right now but once I get the macros figured out I’m going to do the 5/3/1 boring but big template. If you think I’m limiting muscle gains then what do you think I should do macro/calorie wise?
[quote]str8_flexed wrote:
So in all honesty these macros are just a guideline where if i gain more than a pound a week I’ll lower the carbs or fats until its around a pound or a half of one.
[/quote]
This is your problem. You should be observing your bodycomp to see how much lbm you can gain while minimising fat. You may be able to gain more than a pound or you may only be able to gain less than 1/2 a pound. There are so many variables which include individual genetics, training age, recovery rate etc.
And you need to accept that you will gain some fat. Muscle does not grow at a fixed rate of x amount per day/week. Your hormones fluctuate. Muscle grows in spurts. There must be an ample caloric excess to capitalise on growth when it happens.
I feel like a more linear progression based program works better as you figure out your nutrition. There’s very quick, measurable feedback if your eating or recovery isn’t on par. You can compare session to session, week to week, month to month.
With 5/3/1, it’s a little more difficult since your loading changes from week to week. It’s a bit harder to tell which changes contributed to which results. There’s just more variables changing than with a more linear approach.
How do you plan on telling if your macros are “right” while on 5/3/1?
I feel like the best you can do is make sure you’re eating enough calories and protein to hit your numbers week after week, but that there’s no good way to get more precise than that. There’s just too much noise to tell otherwise.
If you were on a bodybuilding split, doing the same thing week in and week out (obviously increasing intensities as you’re able to), then I see a lot more ability to tweak macros.
EDIT:
As an example,
let’s say you had trouble getting all your planned lifts this week; there were a couple you missed
you gained 2 pounds this week
What would you do? Would you cut back on food or would you increase it?
[quote]LoRez wrote:
I feel like a more linear progression based program works better as you figure out your nutrition. There’s very quick, measurable feedback if your eating or recovery isn’t on par. You can compare session to session, week to week, month to month.
With 5/3/1, it’s a little more difficult since your loading changes from week to week. It’s a bit harder to tell which changes contributed to which results. There’s just more variables changing than with a more linear approach.
How do you plan on telling if your macros are “right” while on 5/3/1?
I feel like the best you can do is make sure you’re eating enough calories and protein to hit your numbers week after week, but that there’s no good way to get more precise than that. There’s just too much noise to tell otherwise.
If you were on a bodybuilding split, doing the same thing week in and week out (obviously increasing intensities as you’re able to), then I see a lot more ability to tweak macros.
EDIT:
As an example,
let’s say you had trouble getting all your planned lifts this week; there were a couple you missed
you gained 2 pounds this week
What would you do? Would you cut back on food or would you increase it?[/quote]
With 5/3/1 you can tell if you are progressing week to week if you are still hitting rep PRs. No real difference than a LP approach. I don’t see how this affects calories/macros. He needs to eat enough to grow. If growth is not happenning, he needs to eat more. Simple as that.
[quote]pcdude wrote:
With 5/3/1 you can tell if you are progressing week to week if you are still hitting rep PRs. No real difference than a LP approach. I don’t see how this affects calories/macros. He needs to eat enough to grow. If growth is not happening, he needs to eat more. Simple as that.[/quote]
I agree.
But the OP’s question was more in line with:
How do you adjust your calories and macros so you gain on average 1/2 lb a week (but not more or less than that), while also making progress on 5/3/1?
I just don’t think that’s a particularly good question to be asking, especially given that 5/3/1’s weekly training variation is a lot to control for when you’re aiming for a precise gain in weight.
Even if he eats the same foods every day, exact same times and gets the exact same sleep, his body is going to handle that differently on a higher-volume, lower-intensity week, than a lower-volume, higher-intensity week. The periodization just adds another variable.
Whereas with a routine that maintains roughly the same relative intensity and the same volume, week in and week out, he can see more precisely how his food choices affect his weight gain.
But either way, I don’t see any need to overanalyze this. As long as he’s eating enough to improve performance, regardless of his program, I think that’s good enough.
[quote]LoRez wrote:
I feel like a more linear progression based program works better as you figure out your nutrition. There’s very quick, measurable feedback if your eating or recovery isn’t on par. You can compare session to session, week to week, month to month.
With 5/3/1, it’s a little more difficult since your loading changes from week to week. It’s a bit harder to tell which changes contributed to which results. There’s just more variables changing than with a more linear approach.
How do you plan on telling if your macros are “right” while on 5/3/1?
I feel like the best you can do is make sure you’re eating enough calories and protein to hit your numbers week after week, but that there’s no good way to get more precise than that. There’s just too much noise to tell otherwise.
If you were on a bodybuilding split, doing the same thing week in and week out (obviously increasing intensities as you’re able to), then I see a lot more ability to tweak macros.
EDIT:
As an example,
let’s say you had trouble getting all your planned lifts this week; there were a couple you missed
you gained 2 pounds this week
What would you do? Would you cut back on food or would you increase it?[/quote]
With 5/3/1 you can tell if you are progressing week to week if you are still hitting rep PRs. No real difference than a LP approach. I don’t see how this affects calories/macros. He needs to eat enough to grow. If growth is not happenning, he needs to eat more. Simple as that.[/quote]
Yep, exactly this. The scales tell you if you’re adding weight.
If your coach is/was reputable you should not make an assumption based on you losing weight over one week. It takes a little more time to learn what your body responds to best and for them to dial in your nutrition.
My advice is:
Do some type of carb cycling. You don’t need the same carbs on your off days as you do on the days you lift
Ignore anyone telling you not to count calories. That is a cop out for being lazy. It is the most efficient way to control results and learn what your body needs.
It’s always fine to start calories a little lower and build up based on what the scale/mirror says
Don’t weigh yourself daily as this will mess with your head. Once a week on an empty stomach under same conditions is ideal
Sry to jack this thread, but in relation to both bulking and measurements, if measuring your bodyfat percentage gives you inaccurate and inconsistent results with regard to how much fat you have lossed or gained then how can you precisely track how much muscle you’ve gained during bulking (assuming of course you consistently lift weights)?
[quote]Bull_Scientist wrote:
Sry to jack this thread, but in relation to both bulking and measurements, if measuring your bodyfat percentage gives you inaccurate and inconsistent results with regard to how much fat you have lossed or gained then how can you precisely track how much muscle you’ve gained during bulking (assuming of course you consistently lift weights)?[/quote]
BF measurements are effective it done correctly. I personally don’t bother though
Tape measurements of waist, arms, legs etc
Pictures to assess weekly using same lighting, relaxed on empty stomach, no pump
Strength changes throughout your bulk(if you gain 10 pounds, your lifts should reflect this)
Best method is to use a combination of these and assess throughout