Bodybuilding & Junk Food

Diet and Nutrition
21

[quote]chillain wrote:

[quote]TheresaACP wrote:
As for what’s the point (again), well maybe I’m just venting here, but when family and friends are inflicted by this mania and it hits close to home, it’s hard not to attack it and look at it with just a little contempt.

Or to put in a kinder fashion: For whose who made the mistake from learning through said bro science, wasted years bulking only to get fat, negatively impacted their health, build bad eating habits that they had to break, etc., don’t you think that they would have been better served given the good information in the first place? You know, that crazy eat clean while training hard stuff.

Seems like the logical advice to me.[/quote]

No doubt.

People – and youngsters who are both impressionable and impatient in general – will always be tempted by the appeal of the quickest route. Part of human nature.

And people in the US – where capitalism won – will typically exploit these tendencies in order to make a buck.

Go figure.
[/quote]

22

Excellent post related to this by CS on the front page today.

23

IMO It’s true there are many bodybuilders there who provide less than optimal advise, but have a large following.

It’s true it can be detrimental for the beginners. Before learn better it can cause them some damage.

However, I believe ranting about isn’t doing any good. For me my time is limited. There are many things, which I don’t like about this world. But unless you decide what to do about it you are just wasting your time focusing on it.

24

Haha, you could be right. I guess a picture (and short story) is worth a thousand words. Found this online a while ago:

A member of bodybuilding.com under the name of FunnyWeasel has recently presented his bulking “progress”. He went from 185 lbs (83 kg) to 273 lbs (124 kg). During the bulk the bodybuilder relied on: hamburgers, chicken patty sandwiches, taco beef, chicken nuggets, fish filet, chicken breasts, popcorn chicken, cheese pizza, pancakes, french toast, eggs, and low calorie gatorade grape drinks to get this big.

As you can see FunnyWeasel started his bulk at about 15-18% body fat. That’s already a little high for a bodybuilder to begin with.

After following his high calorie diet for some time FunnyWeasel achieved the following physique below.

Conclusion: Dirty bulking has once again proven to be an ineffective way to gain muscle mass. Most of the gains are body fat. The above individual will need about 10 months to get to 10% body fat and even more to reach bodybuilding levels of leanness (this may not be required).

His mid-section will never look the same even after the cut because of possible loose skin. Not to mention that such shifts in bodyweight are very dangerous to the heart.

His new weight most likely came with strength increase but that’s to be expected. Everybody can bench press more weight after a 100 lbs weight gain.

Unless you are taking a lot of illegal drugs you will most certainly end up looking similar after a dirty bulking phase.

Note: Fat cells never go away. When you lose weight they shrink and as consequence you look slimmer but the fat cells are still there. That’s why many fat people have easier time getting back to the same level of fatness after a period of dieting. Just like there?s muscle memory, there’s also fat memory.

Avoiding dirty bulking will save you time, frustration and a lot of money for food that can be invested in something else.

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This was the after bulking pic.

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This was the before bulking pic.

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More bad news:

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Yet more evidence. Take this as a warning young people!

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This has nothing to do with “dirty bulking” he could have eaten chicken breast and brown rice, it was the extreme surplus that caused the fat gain.

Why is eating "junk food "being equated to eating a shit ton of food?

30

Once you’re maintenance calories are well over 4000 you can fit alot of junk in. Not really that difficult to understand.

Do you people still think there are certain magic foods that keep you leaner??

31

[quote]xXSeraphimXx wrote:
This has nothing to do with “dirty bulking” he could have eaten chicken breast and brown rice, it was the extreme surplus that caused the fat gain.

Why is eating "junk food "being equated to eating a shit ton of food?[/quote]

Agreed, however even though this thread is chiefly discussing junk food and bulking, there is a greater message here than just excess calories from clean eating vs. the aspect of dirty bulking to pack in the same amount of calories.

In short: Excess calories, from either approach and/or food source, cannot force additional growth in natural lifters, only fat gain. (Obviously, using junk food for this purpose will likewise also worsen health markers, due to the nature of the food source, so that’s a double whammy with that course of action).

And I wouldn’t call what these guys ate exactly clean either. Let’s all keep in mind that a homemade cheeseburger or chicken sandwich is a different animal from one obtained at a fast food restaurant.

32

[quote]Mtag666 wrote:
Once you’re maintenance calories are well over 4000 you can fit alot of junk in. Not really that difficult to understand.

Do you people still think there are certain magic foods that keep you leaner??[/quote]

No, there are no magic foods that keep you “leaner” by eating excess amounts, as you will obviously still gain fat. But whether we are talking a maintenance level of 4k calories or less/more, junk food used for this purpose will not only make you fatter but significantly unhealthier in the long run as well. The science is clear on that.

And just because someone needs 4,000 calories for maintenance purposes, and can fill it with a good amount of junk food in the process, doesn’t mean that’s something one should do. It’s a cop out IMO to eat junk food for pleasure instead of clean food (mostly) for gains, as it’s entirely unnecessary and shouldn’t be advocated as a desirable strategy for packing in the cals.

And there are plenty of articles on this site discussing and explaining the reasons to avoid doing so.

33

[quote]MikeManos wrote:

[quote]xXSeraphimXx wrote:
This has nothing to do with “dirty bulking” he could have eaten chicken breast and brown rice, it was the extreme surplus that caused the fat gain.

Why is eating "junk food "being equated to eating a shit ton of food?[/quote]

Agreed, however even though this thread is chiefly discussing junk food and bulking, there is a greater message here than just excess calories from clean eating vs. the aspect of dirty bulking to pack in the same amount of calories.

In short: Excess calories, from either approach and/or food source, cannot force additional growth in natural lifters, only fat gain. (Obviously, using junk food for this purpose will likewise also worsen health markers, due to the nature of the food source, so that’s a double whammy with that course of action).

And I wouldn’t call what these guys ate exactly clean either. Let’s all keep in mind that a homemade cheeseburger or chicken sandwich is a different animal from one obtained at a fast food restaurant.[/quote]

Given set macros it would be difficult to eat mostly “junk food” what do you consider too much?

What health markers?

I would like to see an example of an all/mostly junk diet while hitting appropriate macros.

34

What does matter is the effect food has upon your digestive system. This is why many people, even those who think they eat clean, are in a constant state of inflammation due to questionable food choice, as well as sheer quantity consumed. Can you get away with it nonetheless? Well, of course SOME people can, at least for a short period. Michael Phelps apparently consumed around 12,000 kcals a day, much of which came from sources such as chocolate muffins and sugary sports drinks. But for the rest of us it may not be so easy.

That’s why I think systems that promote dirty binges, e.g. Keifer’s backloading protocol are, at best, marketing ploys that promote, pardon the pun, the ‘you can have your cake and eat it’ diet. The conclusion is, for most people most of the time, you cannot out train bad diet.

35

Further, there’s more to your diet than calories and macros. Fast food typically lacks fibre and isn’t particularly dense in nutrients. There’s usually shit added to give it a longer shelf life and whilst that isn’t necessarily a problem, it may lead to some issues.

If you’re on a “dirty” bulk and you haven’t shit in a week, you feel queasy every day, have changes in performance downstairs, lack energy or a billion other signs your body gives you and people ignore in the pursuit of getting fat then perhaps it’s worth reconsidering the all calories/macros are equal approach.

36

“clean dieting is pure marketing BS to teens who don’t know any better”

LOL, yes. It’s all a scheme by Big Chicken and Broccoli to take those poor saps’ hard earned dollars and get them hooked on not-corn syrup!

37

[quote]mutantcolors wrote:
“clean dieting is pure marketing BS to teens who don’t know any better”

LOL, yes. It’s all a scheme by Big Chicken and Broccoli to take those poor saps’ hard earned dollars and get them hooked on not-corn syrup![/quote]

I don’t know about the chicken and broccoli cartel, or the pull their lobbyists have in Washington, but I do know that image is everything. And when money and corporate interest is involved, in the bodybuilding community included, the gloves are off and the brass knuckles come on.

So it should come as no surprise that when it’s time for the muscle media mafia to sell a clean image of a pro-bodybuilder eating a likewise clean diet and living a clean lifestyle, it plays a big role in their promotion:

IMAGE: Eat clean & organic food, live a clean lifestyle, and dedicate yourself to training hard!

REALITY: Load up on a ton of drugs and eat calorically dense food, even junk food.

Of course I’m singling out the bad lot of apples, not all bodybuilders, but you get the premise of the message.

You can read all about it here:

38

[quote]TheresaACP wrote:

[quote]mutantcolors wrote:
“clean dieting is pure marketing BS to teens who don’t know any better”

LOL, yes. It’s all a scheme by Big Chicken and Broccoli to take those poor saps’ hard earned dollars and get them hooked on not-corn syrup![/quote]

I don’t know about the chicken and broccoli cartel, or the pull their lobbyists have in Washington, but I do know that image is everything. And when money and corporate interest is involved, in the bodybuilding community included, the gloves are off and the brass knuckles come on.

So it should come as no surprise that when it’s time for the muscle media mafia to sell a clean image of a pro-bodybuilder eating a likewise clean diet and living a clean lifestyle, it plays a big role in their promotion:

IMAGE: Eat clean & organic food, live a clean lifestyle, and dedicate yourself to training hard!

REALITY: Load up on a ton of drugs and eat calorically dense food, even junk food.

Of course I’m singling out the bad lot of apples, not all bodybuilders, but you get the premise of the message.

You can read all about it here:

[/quote]

I really don’t believe that most pros are that gluttonous, despite some that really go over the deep end and live up to that aforementioned reputation. I know that there have been some pro bodybuilders over the years that have been documented as having simply atrocious diets in the off season (and even during competition prep), but I believe that this is quite rare. From what I’ve observed, read and heard, most pro bodybuilders shop like most clean eating “natural” bodybuilders…albeit in much larger quantity, due to the much needed extra calorie and protein requirements (because of their respective drug intake).

Transitioning to the local gym bodybuilder emulaters and wannabes, I think that even they, by this point in the information age, understand the reason and difference between how naturals and non-naturals eat, unless they are really newbies, young and misinformed (or possible even ignorant). My experience here is that whenever “dirty bulking” (or even recommending severe excess calories from clean foods during said bulk) is advised or followed it’s simply more a case of the individual’s lack of proper dietary conviction and adherence, as it’s a thinly disguised veil that allows them to rationalize eating junk foods that they consume mostly for enjoyment, rather than the false belief that these “pack in the needed extra calories” or have some special anabolic potential that clean food simply doesn’t have.

39

[quote]TheresaACP wrote:

[quote]mutantcolors wrote:
“clean dieting is pure marketing BS to teens who don’t know any better”

LOL, yes. It’s all a scheme by Big Chicken and Broccoli to take those poor saps’ hard earned dollars and get them hooked on not-corn syrup![/quote]

I don’t know about the chicken and broccoli cartel, or the pull their lobbyists have in Washington, but I do know that image is everything. And when money and corporate interest is involved, in the bodybuilding community included, the gloves are off and the brass knuckles come on.

So it should come as no surprise that when it’s time for the muscle media mafia to sell a clean image of a pro-bodybuilder eating a likewise clean diet and living a clean lifestyle, it plays a big role in their promotion:

IMAGE: Eat clean & organic food, live a clean lifestyle, and dedicate yourself to training hard!

REALITY: Load up on a ton of drugs and eat calorically dense food, even junk food.

Of course I’m singling out the bad lot of apples, not all bodybuilders, but you get the premise of the message.

You can read all about it here:

[/quote]

you realise that the only actual professional bodybuilder you’ve asked has told you that professional bodybuilders eat clean 99% of the time?

Go to one of the other boards when tons of pro’s hang out and they’ll tell you the same thing.

Everyone cheats but the vast majority eat clean for the most part. Obviously there’s exceptions but they are exactly that - exceptions.

That’s what separates the men from the boys in this game. Being able to eat a shit ton of calories from “clean” (or whatever you want to call it) sources.

40

[quote]xXSeraphimXx wrote:
This has nothing to do with “dirty bulking” he could have eaten chicken breast and brown rice, it was the extreme surplus that caused the fat gain.

Why is eating "junk food "being equated to eating a shit ton of food?[/quote]

Not disagreeing with you, but just wanted to point out:
If he were eating chicken breast and brown rice, that fat gain would NEVER have happened. Eating chicken breast and brown rice just isn’t that fun… Don’t know if anyone is psychotic enough to get fat on the stuff.
I feel like clean foods auto-regulate – you never really want to eat more than 500 calories over maintenance.