Sorry PX I have to disagree.
Some people naturally have different body types along with bone structures.
Some people who don’t lift much and eat decent will have a naturally larger build than someone else. You can at least admit to that.
However, i’m not saying you’re wrong, as you’re in control of what you eat and what you do so you can change your body type. But there are distinctions.
[quote]jehovasfitness wrote:
Sorry PX I have to disagree.
Some people naturally have different body types along with bone structures.
Some people who don’t lift much and eat decent will have a naturally larger build than someone else. You can at least admit to that.
However, i’m not saying you’re wrong, as you’re in control of what you eat and what you do so you can change your body type. But there are distinctions.
[/quote]
Where did I write that different body types don’t exist? I made the point that body types ARE NOT STATIC. That does not mean they do not exist. It means quit using your current “body type” as a fucking excuse as to why you aren’t gaining weight or getting stronger.
I may very well be an “ectomorph” when I am 150lbs. I am NOT one if I gain 100lbs of muscle.
I think some people throwing these terms around believe that drastic physique changes are impossible.
i never said a word about making excuses. youre assuming just because someone uses some sort of classification of somatype or has a harder time gaining muscle than someone else that they automatically will use that as an excuse. again, i never said anything about that.
as i stated before, theres two ends and a middle. on one end is your group, the people who say theres no such thing as somatypes or hardgainers then theres the other end who will use those groupings as a predisposed notion to failure or a cap on potential then theres the middle group who will take information about whats generally worked for their general group and apply it to themselves.
even if you acknowledge yourself as a “hardgainer” doesnt mean you cant change it with hard work, its just hard, hence the name.
if you take two people same height, bodyfat years training etc and one gains muscle at a rate of 3 pounds per month while the other gains muscle at a rate of 1.5lbs:month while taking the same calories then clearly either person A is an easy gainer or person B is a hardgainer.
i agree that people shouldnt use these classifications to hinder themselves and use mental blocks but i disagree on your view that these classifications dont exist.
Here is the issue: there is no scientific basis to any of this body type bullshit. We all know who pwarbarboy is from the Rate My Physique forum, right? If he had shown up here before he started training, he would have fallen very cleanly into the “ectomorph” category: small joints, very light, fairly lean.
However, after actually working at things for several years, hes taking 2nd in national teen shows and getting sneered at on this forum for his super genetics.
Point being: the only way to find out what sort of maximal genetic potential you have is to reach it.
[quote]Stronghold wrote:
Here is the issue: there is no scientific basis to any of this body type bullshit. We all know who pwarbarboy is from the Rate My Physique forum, right? If he had shown up here before he started training, he would have fallen very cleanly into the “ectomorph” category: small joints, very light, fairly lean. However, after actually working at things for several years, hes taking 2nd in national teen shows and getting sneered at on this forum for his super genetics.
Point being: the only way to find out what sort of maximal genetic potential you have is to reach it.[/quote]
Agreed. That is all there is to it. These classifications do more harm than good because once a beginner mentally accepts that they are a “hardgainer”, they will believe that less than great progress is all they can achieve.
This is great for personal trainers because if they can get you to believe that the least progress is the best you can hope for, you won’t expect anything more.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Sagat wrote:
TheOlympian wrote:
I’ve often discussed this with friends & family & would like to hear what ya’ll have to say.
Is it possible for an ectomorph to eventually evolve into a mesomorph? What about an endomorph? Can an ecto evolve into an endomorph ?
I’m an endo and would LOVE to evolve into a meso haha
Actually what makes someone a mesomorph, ecto or endo is the result of formulas where you use skinfolds, circunferences, weight and height… you can change all of these(except height), so you can change your type. For example if someone who is skinny (ectomorph) gains a lot of muscle, his ectomorphism number will go down due to the incresed bodyweight and his mesomorphism number will go up because of increased circunferences, and be his highest number now, making him a mesomorph .
If you can change all of these then what pray tell is the usefulness of these terms other than describing how someone looks RIGHT THIS VERY SECOND?
The problem is, people are using these terms to describe themselves as if they need to train according to their “body type”. Since body type is not static, it makes no sense for so many people to be concerned about it.[/quote]
So true.
BF% isn’t hardly the best way to determine somatotype. You measure the difference of the shoulder width, and torso length.
An ecto will have narrow shoulders compared to their torso. Meso will have a greater difference (wider shoulders). Endo will have measurements closer to meso than ecto, but they may also have wide hips (bones not just love handles).
Its a pretty obvious difference even when they are all around the same muscle mass and same bf%.
Everybody trains and eats the same regardless of bodytype. Mesomorphs and ectomorphs can get fat too. Endos can be ripped to the bone.
[quote]Stronghold wrote:
Here is the issue: there is no scientific basis to any of this body type bullshit. We all know who pwarbarboy is from the Rate My Physique forum, right? If he had shown up here before he started training, he would have fallen very cleanly into the “ectomorph” category: small joints, very light, fairly lean.
However, after actually working at things for several years, hes taking 2nd in national teen shows and getting sneered at on this forum for his super genetics.
Point being: the only way to find out what sort of maximal genetic potential you have is to reach it.[/quote]
i agree that regardless of your classification you can still reach the top of the food chain so to speak. the only thing you cant change is skeletal structure. spacing, joints etc are all predisposed but that does not mean you cant start off 160 lbs and end up 240. i think thats the point we all agree on.
[quote]elano wrote:
BF% isn’t hardly the best way to determine somatotype. You measure the difference of the shoulder width, and torso length.
An ecto will have narrow shoulders compared to their torso. Meso will have a greater difference (wider shoulders). Endo will have measurements closer to meso than ecto, but they may also have wide hips (bones not just love handles).
Its a pretty obvious difference even when they are all around the same muscle mass and same bf%.
Everybody trains and eats the same regardless of bodytype. Mesomorphs and ectomorphs can get fat too. Endos can be ripped to the bone.[/quote]
lol theres no way i can get fat. at least not for another 20 years or something. the only way you could get me to go above 15% bodyfat would to hook me up to an IV and just constantly pump sugar, starch, and trans fats through it.
other than that theres no way in hell im going to be anything other than lean with a gut bulge from food storage. my metabolism is just on crack.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
You shouldn’t have. This focus on body types is overused and often flat out WRONG. [/quote]
sorry, I must have read into it too much 
[quote]Stronghold wrote:
Here is the issue: there is no scientific basis to any of this body type bullshit. We all know who pwarbarboy is from the Rate My Physique forum, right? If he had shown up here before he started training, he would have fallen very cleanly into the “ectomorph” category: small joints, very light, fairly lean.
However, after actually working at things for several years, hes taking 2nd in national teen shows and getting sneered at on this forum for his super genetics.
Point being: the only way to find out what sort of maximal genetic potential you have is to reach it.[/quote]
This is the best post.
Like said earlier, its quasi-scientifc psychobabble and like X said earlier it isnn’t static.
Sow quit worrying about what you supposedly are/were and focus om what you will become.
Wow, some interesting points.
I have to admit, i’m not totally sold on the concept of the various bodytypes, altho there is plenty of evidence. At my gym, there was this guy, who could easily claim the king of all ecto’s…he was one seriously tall & skinny guy…every time I saw him i kept thinking “how the hell did he land a job at THIS gym?”.
I think i’m juz goin to have to post up a pic of myself in the ‘rate my physique’ area, so ya’ll can guage if i am in fact an endo (which i’m starting to think isn’t so), or what. Also, it’d be good to put my money where my mouth is & say ‘here i am, i have a long way to go & it’s goin to be fun getting there! Well, some fun anyway!’.
In terms of genes comming into play with your physique, I have to say that i’m actually part nature, part nurture. You can’t help your genetics, but you can, to an extent control the environment your in.
If the king of meso’s was to be a desk bitch & do a full body work out once a fortnight at his local YMCA gym, not putting in much effort to his diet or training…then the outcome would be interesting.
With the use of (anabolic) steroids, the transformation from a seriously skinny dude (or dudette) to a complete mass monster, over the course of 4-5 years would be amazing. Who wants to volunteer for my experiment?
pick me, hmm maybe not, maybe when i can adhere to a strict clean diet for a year then maybe though i may not be so skinny si… ill pass but yes anyone else?? actuallly change of heart, u give me the steroids and foods and the membership ill do it
Rob, that’d be what i call, a very, very free pass to a fantastic physique!
It would of course be a pretty unethical study, turning an ecto into a meso, with the combination of steroids, food, training & R&R, then having a group of ecto’s, who had to stay ‘natural’ and yet train, eat & grab plenty of R&R
Ummm I’ll do it…don’t know wtf I am nor do I care. But you pay for everything and I’m in. lol
sure buy me 5 years worth of AAS and you got yourself a deal partner.
the thing is though, that just because someone gets big from 5 years worth of drugs once they come off that they still have their regular fiber recruitments and hormone levels. …that is if the 5 years of drugs didnt completely shut things off.
if you put a meso on drugs, when he comes off hell still gain quicker than the average joe. if you put an ecto on drugs when he comes off hell still gain like an ecto.
in respect to solely muscle gaining genetics the only real hinderence to the ecto is the increased metabolism. if that were to slow down then itd be fine. sure being tall doesnt help but theres tall people who are insanely strong. i,e everyone with the name Magnus. difference is they obviously dont have overactive metabolisms.
an endos problem isnt that he gains muscle too slowly, its that he gains fat too easily, his metabolism is stuck in 2nd gear.
personally i want to look into food products that shut off the “full” sensor in the brain. that way im in a constant state of extreme hunger because im hungry all the time anyways but its always “yea i could eat a snack or something” and not “ok, get me a fucking steak or im killing someone.”
hahahaha i like free passes
fuck josh your huge bro nice work, all natural??
[quote]LiveFromThe781 wrote:
sure buy me 5 years worth of AAS and you got yourself a deal partner.
the thing is though, that just because someone gets big from 5 years worth of drugs once they come off that they still have their regular fiber recruitments and hormone levels. …that is if the 5 years of drugs didnt completely shut things off.
if you put a meso on drugs, when he comes off hell still gain quicker than the average joe. if you put an ecto on drugs when he comes off hell still gain like an ecto.
in respect to solely muscle gaining genetics the only real hinderence to the ecto is the increased metabolism. if that were to slow down then itd be fine.
sure being tall doesnt help but theres tall people who are insanely strong. i,e everyone with the name Magnus. difference is they obviously dont have overactive metabolisms.
an endos problem isnt that he gains muscle too slowly, its that he gains fat too easily, his metabolism is stuck in 2nd gear.
personally i want to look into food products that shut off the “full” sensor in the brain. that way im in a constant state of extreme hunger because im hungry all the time anyways but its always “yea i could eat a snack or something” and not “ok, get me a fucking steak or im killing someone.”[/quote]
This is exactly what I’m talking about. You’re too smart for your own good. If you spent half as much time figuring out “the perfect way” instead of just going balls out in the gym and in the kitchen you wouldn’t have time to philosophize about the ins and outs of being an ecto.
I’ve heard you say in another posts you have trouble gaining or “you can’t get fat.”
Bullshit, let’s feed you 5-,6,000 calories a day for a couple weeks and let’s see what happens.