I think its emerging science. Im not sure if they are there yet sir. I hear doctors talk about it but I haven’t researched that aspect.
Edit (2014 so not so emerging):
“According to our results, increased E2 level and ER beta gene rs4986938 polymorphism might explain why some adolescents have gynecomastia. Leptin receptor gene rs1137101 polymorphism might affect susceptibility to gynecomastia.”
Pretty good info, but it looks like it geared toward adolescents going through puberty (though I don’t imagine your genetics would change as you get older lol).
I’ve been way more fat for a lot of years than I am now. I never had any soreness before that I can remember. Seems like if it was a genetic issue, then my body has been in WAY more prime conditions in the past (stupid overweight and drank too much at times) to display this type of symptom. Why now, when I eat as clean as possible, work my ass off everyday on the weights, and my hormones are at more optimal levels than they have ever been?
Just makes no sense.
TRT is using a synthetic imitation of testosterone. You’re on the “generic” version, not the “brand name” that your body makes. Some people have trouble with generic. It is not exactly the same as your naturally produced T, so don’t expect your body to react exactly the same.
Thanks for the replies guys.
I think for now, I’m going to start taking 100mg a day of DIM. I’ll continue this until my next bloods (should be in a few weeks). From there, I’ll determine (based on Free T and the advice of Dr Calkins) whether or not I’ll lower my dose, or perhaps maybe start injecting subQ, or just stay with what I’m doing and continue the DIM.
My understanding is that DIM is not near as aggressive as AI, but doesn’t work for everyone. If this seems to help for me, and my Free T is not over range, is DIM a viable option long term?
Jay Cambell developed it after 15 years on TRT and while in prime condition. He had it surgically removed, apparently that’s the only way to permanently address it
Even then it can come back a little bit
I apologize for not remembering your protocol or how long you have been on TRT. I remember you just started with defy were you on TRT before?
If you just started TRT tender nipples is pretty normal and it is not a sign of gyno. Mine went away in less than 2 weeks. I did nothing except follow my protocol as prescribed.
When I want to peak at my bloods I one of those discountedlabs using labcorp and buy just the test I want to look at. Its pretty cheap and really helps with piece of mind.
No worries brother. There’s a lot of information on this board and it would be unfair of me to expect ANYONE to remeber each and every detail.
Yeah I’ve been with Defy a little over a month, on this new protocol (150mg @50mg X3 per week) for about 4 weeks.
I’ve been on TRT since Sept of last year. Started with 100mg @ 50mg X2 a week. Dr Calkins said he wanted my Free T a little higher so that’s why we bumped it up. My Defy labs are posted in this thread from before I went up in dosage.
My E2 was at 19.5 on the 100mg per week protocol. Do you think that @ 4 weeks on a new protocol, this could still be my body trying to stabilize?
I do. 100 to 150 is a huge jump and could be why your nipples are sensitive.
Do you remember your SHGB?
Yes it was 15.9. LOW!!
Here a link to my posted labs…
OK well I want to go on the record now 150/wk with no AI will send your E2 thru the roof With such a low SHGB. Lets see if I am right on your next bloods. No need to panic or anything just keep that in mind.
I will recommend the next time you order drugs from defy but a dozen anastrozole pills .125mg for just in case they are 1.50 each. When I get that wave of emotions (how I tell my E2 is high) I take 1 and 4 hours later it is gone. I don’t take another.
Thanks for the advice bro!
Do you think it would be a terrible idea to go ahead and start DIM now at 100mg a day and see where that lands?
I think it’s ok to wait a couple more days. I had sensitive nipps and lump that went away after a day or 2. In think it was from the dosage change.
Ah yes I remember reading these bloods. You even had prolactin in there, cool.
My SHGB was 24 when I started with defy and they put me on the same protocol. But I was taking .125mg anastrozole with every shot so 3 a week. When I started with defy my E2 was 62 Thanks to doc that believed in T mono protocol.
I post these bloods because I am very interested in seeing where 150/wk takes you by comparison and what your E2 looks like with no AI.
I dunno man… It took 3 more months for Estradiol to lower into normal ranges each time I upped dosage. I maximize my dosage with daily 17mg pins AND have a very low shbg. Somewhere past 3 months my Estradiol levelled out after the first 3 month bloods showed high Estradiol. Prolly even lower now… time is a great stabilizer but people are impatient. :))))
Testosterone Total 18.3 nmol/L 6.1-27.1
Testosterone Free Calculated 565 pmol/L (110-660)
Testosterone Bioavailable Calculated 13.2 nmol/L (2.8-15.5)
Estradiol 130 pmol/L (40-160)
SHBG 14 nmol/L (13-89)
I agree with this statement, however patience is definitely not my issue. Unknown variables are. It’s one thing to be patient when you know that this will level out, but being stupid and letting something get to the point of a permanent condition requiring surgery to correct in the name of patience is borderline insane don’t you think?
If I wasn’t haven’t physical manifestations of a symptom then I wouldn’t have any issues with riding it out, which I still may do anyway just to see. I have been having insomnia and high levels of anxiety on and off since I started this new protocol, but patience wins that battle because I’m pretty confident that it will eventually settle. When I physically start having things appear all of a sudden in my breast, well that’s a little harder pill to swallow.
Id assume its probably the protocol change and not real gyno.
I hear ya man! I was just kind of playing devil’s advocate about that blanket statement of “150/wk with no AI will send your E2 thru the roof…” Not necessarily true… Really Fake News. LOL
Man I had sensitive nipples for two months . I switched to cream and still have sensitivity , but it’s not as bad vs injections. If it’s tender not swollen you should be fine and it should go away from what I recall. It dissapeared and would only come back when I did the injection. A couple hours later gone… this was 5 weeks into a protocol.
@enackers I have had no nipple issues in ~ 3 years. My problems were way back when my PCP was trying to do TRT on me for the first time. He didn’t really know what he was doing.
My protocol has been pretty stable and I seem to tolerate larger swings and not get any bad sides.