[quote]njrusmc wrote:
People go to trial for two reasons:
Certainly guilty
Inconclusive
You never go to trial for times when you are certainly innoncent. If a guy comes into my house and attacks my family, I can shoot him dead and no one will charge me. That’s true even in the People’s Republic of New York. But if you add a hint of doubt then society is at least owed your presence in court. Yes?[/quote]
Plea deals happen all the time instead of risking loosing a jury trial. In this case there I doubt that would happen with all attention it has gotten and the possible outrage of not going to trial.
[quote]therajraj wrote:
But if they get a sample of Trayvon’s voice and determine with a high degree of certainty it wasn’t him screaming either, then piece of info won’t matter.[/quote]
Shouldn’t the phone conversation with his girlfriend contain high quality audio of his voice?
It seems like every piece of ‘evidence’ that comes out even has experts torn on how to interpret it; that should however be leading to a trial, because while there is still reasonable doubt to his guilt, there is reasonable doubt to his innocence.[/quote]
I highly doubt the conversation with his girlfriend was recorded especially since I would bet the media would get a hold of it and release it if it existed. I’m shocked they have been successful keeping her identity a secret from the media so far.
[quote]FrozenNinja wrote:
Two Experts identified the voice being that of a young man’s, most likely Trayvon in the background. One expert who doesn’t even use the software has done the same. ARE WE STILL GOING TO ARGUE IT WAS ZIMMERMAN’s voice??? Lets see what happens when they get a sample of Tray’s voice.[/quote]
Didn’t Martin’s dad already come out and say he didn’t think it was Trayvon on the tape screaming for help?
With so much shit getting out on this makes me think jury selection will be a nightmare.[/quote]
Yeah he pretty much said he was sure it was his son…Uh oh…
From the first google hit for “biometric voice recognition”:
This “expert” is going to act like he can take a garbled scream heard through at least one wall on the background of a phone call and compare it to some dude’s normal speaking voice and come up with a legitimate result?
Mainstream media isn’t reporting this story. It’s funny how some of you are accepting this at face value simply because it supports your version of events. Voice DNA? lol…
If smart both lawyers will find someone to cast doubt for both sides, same with the so called witnesses with no pics or recordings of any kind will be a big question mark for anyone asked to judge this case.
Like I said if they can question DNA they can question Voice or the “I think I may have seen something in the dark witnesses.”
Even Martins girlfriend is up in the air without a recording or phone records to back it up.
I also won’t buy anything a parent will say on either side. They both are to invested in this case to be trusted. Not that they would lie but it is a child they are defending. Both zim and Martin.
For the record the voice sounds like a kid but it could also be a male with a high voice. And for every vote for Zim they will have one for Martin.
At this point I’ll be happy if it makes it to a trial.
[quote]four60 wrote:
If smart both lawyers will find someone to cast doubt for both sides, same with the so called witnesses with no pics or recordings of any kind will be a big question mark for anyone asked to judge this case.
Like I said if they can question DNA they can question Voice or the “I think I may have seen something in the dark witnesses.”
Even Martins girlfriend is up in the air without a recording or phone records to back it up.
I also won’t buy anything a parent will say on either side. They both are to invested in this case to be trusted. Not that they would lie but it is a child they are defending. Both zim and Martin.
For the record the voice sounds like a kid but it could also be a male with a high voice. And for every vote for Zim they will have one for Martin.
At this point I’ll be happy if it makes it to a trial.
[/quote]
Agree with everything here. Anything from family members is questionable from the start, true or not. I don’t see how a plea agreement could be reached in this case. What would Zimmerman’s lawyer agree to? Stalking or street fighting? Certainly not murder or manslaughter. A trial is risky but that’s the point. If you shoot a guy in the street in a situation that’s already highly questionable, it follows that you should stand trial, risky by nature, to determine your fate.
[quote]therajraj wrote:
By the way there has been some bad information going around that apparently Trayvon’s father verified it wasn’t his son screaming on those tapes.
The opposite is true, he as well as Trayvon’s brother have both stated it was Trayvon screaming on those tapes.
Hmmm…even Anderson Cooper wears jeans, tennis shoes and a hoodie…that’s interesting. You know, I have to say this, some people in the media want to say baggy jeans and hoodies are a prodominantly black thing, black wear or black apparel. Everyone nowadays adopts that style across all races.
I love hoodies. I wear them all the time and have for at least the past 10 years. But a guy walking down the street in a button down shirt and khakis is always less suspicious than a guy in jeans and a hoodie. I think it’s just a human impulse to automatically be suspicious of people who are obscured with loose fitting clothing and hidden faces/heads.
This is kind of off topic from the thread but I was wondering if I am the only one who ever felt that way. I don’t get scared for my life but I would never expect a guy in a dinner jacket (unless it was James Bond) to fuck me up on the streets, regardless of skin color.
[quote]njrusmc wrote:
I love hoodies. I wear them all the time and have for at least the past 10 years. But a guy walking down the street in a button down shirt and khakis is always less suspicious than a guy in jeans and a hoodie. I think it’s just a human impulse to automatically be suspicious of people who are obscured with loose fitting clothing and hidden faces/heads.
This is kind of off topic from the thread but I was wondering if I am the only one who ever felt that way. I don’t get scared for my life but I would never expect a guy in a dinner jacket (unless it was James Bond) to fuck me up on the streets, regardless of skin color.[/quote]
I would wonder why he was walking in the rain so well dressed. But I wouldn’t think he was a purse snatcher.
Precisely. If you bumped into a guy in the middle of the night in a hoodie and jeans, you’d probably be a little more suspcious than a dude with fitted clothes and a visible face. Interesting how society in general feels that way about loose fitted clothing, but the reasons are kind of obvious.
[quote]njrusmc wrote:
Precisely. If you bumped into a guy in the middle of the night in a hoodie and jeans, you’d probably be a little more suspcious than a dude with fitted clothes and a visible face. Interesting how society in general feels that way about loose fitted clothing, but the reasons are kind of obvious.[/quote]
It’s more of a fear of how young people dress, at least I think it is. I haven’t seen a pair of baggy jeans on teens in 3 years. They all wear tight fit clothes. Still hoodies. But the image is still fresh in people minds of the baggy jeans and dark clothes.
[quote]njrusmc wrote:
Precisely. If you bumped into a guy in the middle of the night in a hoodie and jeans, you’d probably be a little more suspcious than a dude with fitted clothes and a visible face. Interesting how society in general feels that way about loose fitted clothing, but the reasons are kind of obvious.[/quote]
It’s more of a fear of how young people dress, at least I think it is. I haven’t seen a pair of baggy jeans on teens in 3 years. They all wear tight fit clothes. Still hoodies. But the image is still fresh in people minds of the baggy jeans and dark clothes.
[/quote]
The hoodie is timeless - and there is reason to be afraid of someone wearing one.
[quote]njrusmc wrote:
Precisely. If you bumped into a guy in the middle of the night in a hoodie and jeans, you’d probably be a little more suspcious than a dude with fitted clothes and a visible face. Interesting how society in general feels that way about loose fitted clothing, but the reasons are kind of obvious.[/quote]
It’s more of a fear of how young people dress, at least I think it is. I haven’t seen a pair of baggy jeans on teens in 3 years. They all wear tight fit clothes. Still hoodies. But the image is still fresh in people minds of the baggy jeans and dark clothes.
[/quote]
The hoodie is timeless - and there is reason to be afraid of someone wearing one.
[/quote]
Ok that’s not so much fear as just good old Badassitness.
Yea. I wore baggy jeans when I was in high school in the early 2000s. But now you’ve got the 120 lb kids with the skin tight jeans … I’m not really understanding that trend. At least the baggy jeans gave me room to carry shit in my pockets, even if people thought I was more likely to be a criminal. But when I see a skinny kid in tight jeans and a tight hoody (yes, tight hoodies exist) I’m pretty confident he’s not going to pull out a gun and roll me. Same with a dude in a suit. But a guy in baggy clothes is automatically a LITTLE bit suspect, even if he’s just a regular dude.
[quote]njrusmc wrote:
I love hoodies. I wear them all the time and have for at least the past 10 years. But a guy walking down the street in a button down shirt and khakis is always less suspicious than a guy in jeans and a hoodie. I think it’s just a human impulse to automatically be suspicious of people who are obscured with loose fitting clothing and hidden faces/heads.
This is kind of off topic from the thread but I was wondering if I am the only one who ever felt that way. I don’t get scared for my life but I would never expect a guy in a dinner jacket (unless it was James Bond) to fuck me up on the streets, regardless of skin color.[/quote]
not just you. I’m a little iffy on whether its nature or learned but yes, the way people dress does make me form entirely different perceptions of them on a concious and unconcious level. Some time I dont even realize what my mind is thinking in the background until I’ve brushed my wallet with the side of my hand to make sure its still there after walking by an admittedly shady person.
[quote]overstand wrote:
From the first google hit for “biometric voice recognition”:
This “expert” is going to act like he can take a garbled scream heard through at least one wall on the background of a phone call and compare it to some dude’s normal speaking voice and come up with a legitimate result?
Mainstream media isn’t reporting this story. It’s funny how some of you are accepting this at face value simply because it supports your version of events. Voice DNA? lol…
[/quote]
Important to note that the sound is traveling trough a wall and the baseline sample is not in an excited state. I said before that the scream sounds like his brother, who I was friends with growing up. Everything about this case is muddled and unconfirmed at this point except the unfortunate truth that the young man is dead.
I’m not sure if it should go to trial or not. I think a Grand Jury is appropriate as is a full police investigation. Having the facts and findings of those in place, then a judgement of whether or not a trial is the correct legal cause of action would be more easily determined.
[quote]overstand wrote:
From the first google hit for “biometric voice recognition”:
This “expert” is going to act like he can take a garbled scream heard through at least one wall on the background of a phone call and compare it to some dude’s normal speaking voice and come up with a legitimate result?
Mainstream media isn’t reporting this story. It’s funny how some of you are accepting this at face value simply because it supports your version of events. Voice DNA? lol…
[/quote]
Important to note that the sound is traveling trough a wall and the baseline sample is not in an excited state. I said before that the scream sounds like his brother, who I was friends with growing up. Everything about this case is muddled and unconfirmed at this point except the unfortunate truth that the young man is dead.
I’m not sure if it should go to trial or not. I think a Grand Jury is appropriate as is a full police investigation. Having the facts and findings of those in place, then a judgement of whether or not a trial is the correct legal cause of action would be more easily determined.[/quote]
I thought it could have been Zimmerman as well, based on the fact that he does have a rather high voice for a big guy. I know that doesn’t help the prosecution (which I’m pro), but I guess being a dad myself and not having to imagine the screams of my own child go unnoticed, it is a consolation of sorts.
