…So back to the original topic, though I prefer humanity to outgrow religion…[/quote]
This is pretty naive and ignorant. There is nothing to outgrow. There is no great maturity to non-belief and you just demonstrated. It’s not enlightened, it’s not advanced, it’s not evolutionary, it holds no advantage.
[/quote]
I must admit the espenl ethos is definitely regression. He doesn’t realize it because he bathes in ignorance.[/quote]
So which ones of your religions should I choose? You are atheists to every religion but your own. I was protestant once, but I apparently regressed from it.[/quote]
You’re putting the cart before the horse. You have to believe that God exists and understand something about his nature first. When you get that, then you will know how to interact.[/quote]
I have to rebelieve something on poor manmade evidence, understand why he is either a terrible being or just impotent, then find a way to interact with said creature. That is a tall order.[/quote]
Well that’s proof you haven’t even tried. Man has no ability to make evidence for the existence of God. I don’t feel compelled to help you though. Do some research. The evidence is all around you. Don’t be a two dimensional thinker.
…So back to the original topic, though I prefer humanity to outgrow religion…[/quote]
This is pretty naive and ignorant. There is nothing to outgrow. There is no great maturity to non-belief and you just demonstrated. It’s not enlightened, it’s not advanced, it’s not evolutionary, it holds no advantage.
[/quote]
I must admit the espenl ethos is definitely regression. He doesn’t realize it because he bathes in ignorance.[/quote]
So which ones of your religions should I choose? You are atheists to every religion but your own. I was protestant once, but I apparently regressed from it.[/quote]
You’re putting the cart before the horse. You have to believe that God exists and understand something about his nature first. When you get that, then you will know how to interact.[/quote]
I have to rebelieve something on poor manmade evidence, understand why he is either a terrible being or just impotent, then find a way to interact with said creature. That is a tall order.[/quote]
You’re right, Espy, you’re way too smart for God. You don’t need Him. An intellectual giant like you needs no omnipotent creature interaction. Just move on with your life and remain the great stalwart atheist that you are, master of his own destiny.
[/quote]
Ever met an atheist that could prove it? I haven’t. I have met theists that can prove it.
Oh wait! You cannot prove a negative, right? Wrong, you sure can.
Atheists always say the same things. As if they read it from… wait for it… a book. I seriously doubt espenl will have the ability to make unique arguments that actually prove the point.
In the end it’s always the same, if my 5 senses cannot sense it, it does not exist. That the opposite of enlightened thought.
If theists can prove it, faith wouldnt be required. The bible is man made and many quote it as truth. Maybe some good brainwashing from childhood would help me believe.
[quote]espenl wrote:
If theists can prove it, faith wouldnt be required. The bible is man made and many quote it as truth. Maybe some good brainwashing from childhood would help me believe. [/quote]
A relationship with G-d is by invitation. Apparently, you were not invited, or perhaps declined your invitation.
[quote]espenl wrote:
If theists can prove it, faith wouldnt be required. The bible is man made and many quote it as truth. Maybe some good brainwashing from childhood would help me believe. [/quote]
A relationship with G-d is by invitation. Apparently, you were not invited, or perhaps declined your invitation.
That’s your deal.
Leave those who were invited alone.[/quote]
ohhhhhhhhhh!!!
Espenl is just angry. Dead Atheists are all dressed up with no place to go.
[quote]espenl wrote:
If theists can prove it, faith wouldnt be required. The bible is man made and many quote it as truth. Maybe some good brainwashing from childhood would help me believe. [/quote]
If you walk around with your eyes closed and you bump into a wall, it’s not the wall’s fault, it’s yours. You just haven’t done your homework. You are operating on very little information and no desire to gain more yet you are certain about your own proposition.
Atheism is a logically impossible condition. It requires you to believe that nothing can do something and as much as you believe that, there is no proof what-so-ever or that even being theoretically possible, much less a reality. In theory, it’s impossible, in reality even less so.
You basically demand that God come down and kick you in the nuts and say ‘I’m here!’ for you to believe it, but shit doesn’t work that way. Anything you want to know, or is worth knowing takes effort. It’s clear your interested.
[quote]pat wrote:
Atheism is a logically impossible condition. It requires you to believe that nothing can do something and as much as you believe that, there is no proof what-so-ever or that even being theoretically possible, much less a reality. In theory, it’s impossible, in reality even less so.
You basically demand that God come down and kick you in the nuts and say ‘I’m here!’ for you to believe it, but shit doesn’t work that way. Anything you want to know, or is worth knowing takes effort. It’s clear your interested. [/quote]
If your god think it is important to be believed in, he should make an effort.
Being an agnostic atheist I cant say for sure how the universe started, perhaps a prime mover. But what created the prime mover? And it it far from a prime mover to a personal god. Maybe one day humanity will find all the answers, but it is not by reading old books.
If your god could rise people from the dead, he should rise Hitchens to say “fuck you” to all us atheists
The more I read about your religion the less sense it makes, now there could be a defect in me, but all the same, I just have to try to live a “good” life without a god. I would love the thought of valhalla, fight all day drink all night, much like the training camps I go to. Still, wishing for something doesnt make it reality.
[quote]espenl wrote:
If your god could rise people from the dead, he should rise Hitchens to say “fuck you” to all us atheists
[/quote]
You assume He cares what you think.[/quote]
There’s a whole lot of assuming going on when a peon, as is any human alive compared to Almighty God, thinks he can command God to dance for him at will.[/quote]
I know what you are saying, but would like to point out Christians do this all the time. I have no clue why God does what he does sometimes, but one day we will know.
[quote]espenl wrote:
If your god could rise people from the dead, he should rise Hitchens to say “fuck you” to all us atheists
[/quote]
You assume He cares what you think.[/quote]
There’s a whole lot of assuming going on when a peon, as is any human alive compared to Almighty God, thinks he can command God to dance for him at will.[/quote]
I know what you are saying, but would like to point out Christians do this all the time. I have no clue why God does what he does sometimes, but one day we will know.[/quote]
Yes, but in an altogether different vein. They don’t do it in mockery and derision as in, “One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: ‘Aren’t you the Messiah? Save yourself and us!’”[/quote]
[quote]pat wrote:
Atheism is a logically impossible condition. It requires you to believe that nothing can do something and as much as you believe that, there is no proof what-so-ever or that even being theoretically possible, much less a reality. In theory, it’s impossible, in reality even less so.
You basically demand that God come down and kick you in the nuts and say ‘I’m here!’ for you to believe it, but shit doesn’t work that way. Anything you want to know, or is worth knowing takes effort. It’s clear your interested. [/quote]
If your god think it is important to be believed in, he should make an effort.
Being an agnostic atheist I cant say for sure how the universe started, perhaps a prime mover. But what created the prime mover? And it it far from a prime mover to a personal god. Maybe one day humanity will find all the answers, but it is not by reading old books.
[/quote]
By definition a Prime Mover could not be created. You apparently don’t understand the cosmological argument very well.
You have freewill. If you choose not to even try, that’s not his fault, it’s yours. There is plenty of information about God out there, it’s up to you to make the effort, Gad did his part. If you don’t want to even try, it’s all on you. But clearly something about it bothers you. People who truly don’t car, wouldn’t even pursue the conversation. So you care, but you have an arrogance about you where you require God to make a special effort just for you, except to the end that even if he did some sort of miracle for you, you would still abandon him for your own selfish reasons. God won’t force you, nobody will.
