Best Window for Bulking

Nutrition
41

[quote]Original_Demon wrote:
Prof X,

In a fascinating study, scientists supplemented a group of mice with CLA or CLA plus guarana. After six weeks, both groups of mice showed a substantial reduction in fat mass. In the CLA-only group, the decreased fat mass was due to dramatic reduction in adipocyte (fat cell) size without a change in adipocyte number. In the CLA plus guarana group, both adipocyte size and number were reduced by 50%.3*

[/quote]

Awesome - my cat is overweight, and now I can have hoards of low-fat mice to feed to him.

OD, you have said that you don’t want to do the traditional bulk and cut cycle cause you get too fat during the bulking session. Have you ever considered just not going ape-shit on a bulking cycle? Why do you get so fat during a bulk cycle, and why do you lose muscle when you cut up?

You strike me as having the sort of personality that goes over the top in just about everything that you do. If you moderate things a bit, stop training for two hours a day, and get the basics right, most of your problems are going to diminish.

Can you bulk and cut in the same month? Probably. Is it optimal? Probably not, especially without somebody like JB there to design you entire eating and workout plan. From what I have read, you have skipped over the basics and have gone straight to PHD levels in what you are trying to do. Get you basics right, then move onto your advanced shit.

42

[quote]Original_Demon wrote:

Actually on days where your lifts are not as intense; arms, abs, aerobics, I would suggest cutting back on carbs and taking in a little more fat instead. On days off, cut the carbs back even more so as long as you have enough energy to lift (while progressing in weight) the next day. I’m not suggesting cutting the calories NIL-to-none. I’m simply stating on days you are not lifting, or not using major lifts, (Bench, Deads, Squats, etc…) just cut down on your carb intake for that day. If you have to bump up a couple of meals to meet your caloric intake, then so beit.

OD[/quote]

It sounds like carb cycling… but your last statement makes it sound like your idea is to keep total calories at the same level.

If this is the case your F’d!

I’m not saying a clean bulk is impossible but to have lean mass gains and even some fat loss for an extended period of time you are going to have to very closly monitor your calorie intake and adjust freaquently.

43

[quote]Massif wrote:

Awesome - my cat is overweight, and now I can have hoards of low-fat mice to feed to him.

OD, you have said that you don’t want to do the traditional bulk and cut cycle cause you get too fat during the bulking session. Have you ever considered just not going ape-shit on a bulking cycle? Why do you get so fat during a bulk cycle, and why do you lose muscle when you cut up?

You strike me as having the sort of personality that goes over the top in just about everything that you do. If you moderate things a bit, stop training for two hours a day, and get the basics right, most of your problems are going to diminish.

Can you bulk and cut in the same month? Probably. Is it optimal? Probably not, especially without somebody like JB there to design you entire eating and workout plan. From what I have read, you have skipped over the basics and have gone straight to PHD levels in what you are trying to do. Get you basics right, then move onto your advanced shit.
[/quote]

Thanks Mass,

A little bit about myself:

I’ve been doing the basics, on and off, for about “8” years now and I’m proud of my accomplishments. In a 5 year period I went from 165lbs to 210lbs. And this was without any sound training or advice. Although I do miss Androstine. I would cut from 22% bf to around 16% and I was not happy with this constant routine I locked myself into. I have read that this type of eating is unhealthly. It’s like running your car on 87 Octane for three months and then 93 Octane for the next three months. Your car is not meant to perform in this manner and repeating this would certainly spell destruction for your engine. Well, I’m 28, and conscerened about my engine.

T-Nation is loaded with an abundant source of everything I need to know. It has helped kick in some shots of NO2 into my system. And you know what, it’s worked! My strength increase has gone through the roof. I’m losing fat. And my muscles are getting bigger, simply put. Since I’ve been following the nutritional advice, and specific types of workouts targeted at maximum hypertrophy, I have grown with leaps and bounds. My original target of “Lean Muscle Mass” gain was a bit rediculous, I’ll admit that. But I was hyped!!! T-Nation was the gold at the end of the rainbow for me.

I’ve educated myself. Didn’t take me 10 years to learn what I needed to do either. I’ve taken everyone’s trials and tribulations, with the sound advice of countless trainers on this thread, and learned from them. I’m a more educated, confident, power-lifter/body-builder than I was five years ago.

I’ve taken the advice of eat, and decided to eat… but eat right! I’ve taken the advice of rest and I rest every couple of days now. Aside from some aerobic activity every week or so. And I have adopted new workout routines to my regime and have reaped their rewards.

I am one of the hardest working guys you will ever meet in the gym. I lift to the point of failure, and beyond. I’ve grit my teeth so tite I’ve split the corner of my lip! I have a permanent “lazy eye” due to a squat attempt I should not have attempted. I injured my left shoulder for being over-zealous on barbell incline press. Crushed my left index finger because my arm collapsed on a dumbell press.

I take all of these repsonses to heart. However, I’m not going to “self-destruct”.

I’m going to divide and conquer!
OD

44

[quote]JNeves wrote:
Original_Demon wrote:

Actually on days where your lifts are not as intense; arms, abs, aerobics, I would suggest cutting back on carbs and taking in a little more fat instead. On days off, cut the carbs back even more so as long as you have enough energy to lift (while progressing in weight) the next day. I’m not suggesting cutting the calories NIL-to-none. I’m simply stating on days you are not lifting, or not using major lifts, (Bench, Deads, Squats, etc…) just cut down on your carb intake for that day. If you have to bump up a couple of meals to meet your caloric intake, then so beit.

OD

It sounds like carb cycling… but your last statement makes it sound like your idea is to keep total calories at the same level.

If this is the case your F’d!

I’m not saying a clean bulk is impossible but to have lean mass gains and even some fat loss for an extended period of time you are going to have to very closly monitor your calorie intake and adjust freaquently.[/quote]

I agree, this is no easy road. On days I do not lift I cut my calories by about 350-500 (Total of around 2459). On days I lift my total either reaches or slightly exceeds 3000 calories. I’ve been told I need to take in more calories. I did at one time. I got fat. Every person’s body is different. I find I do not gain any fat if my daily caloric intake does not exceed 2500 calories. I used to keep this number constant and I lost a lot of fat!

However, being the idiot I am, I wanted to gain more muscle at the expense of not losing fat. Even though my strength was steadily on the incline I wanted more!!! That’s just how I am. What are my limitations. I’ve done everything to the “T” except two things. Steroids, which I’ve decided I do not need, and nutrition. Nutrition has been the lost link for me. So simple, yet brilliant. If there is a “Magic Pill” it’s how you eat and when you eat!

Since about two weeks ago I started a food log. I kinda thought that was gay so I avoided it like the plague. Afterall, what idiot doesn’t know what he had for lunch two months ago at 12:15? I found that idiot was me!!!

T-Nation has a lot to offer! If you ignore the rediculous gestures, and uneducating flaming, you can get somewhere.

OD

45

[quote]Original_Demon wrote:

I am one of the hardest working guys you will ever meet in the gym. I lift to the point of failure, and beyond. I’ve grit my teeth so tite I’ve split the corner of my lip! I have a permanent “lazy eye” due to a squat attempt I should not have attempted. I injured my left shoulder for being over-zealous on barbell incline press. Crushed my left index finger because my arm collapsed on a dumbell press.
[/quote]

This is what I’m talking about with taking things too far. Your two hour workouts, injuries from doing dumb shit, trying to put on 30lbs in a month and wondering why you get fat. Fine, go hard in the gym, but going mental in the gym will do more damage than good.

If you have read all the articles on T-Nation, why are you lifting to failure and beyond? Why are you working out for two hours at a time? You seem to have the personality that says “If I can get huge by doing one hour workouts, I can get twice as huge doing two hour workouts”.

This is why I am saying “Get your basics sorted out”.

46

OD

It’s time to pull back and listen to Massif and those trying to help you. I remember your first thread, as do most I’m sure, and if you’ve come as far as you suggest, it’s time to use what you have learned.

The last 2 posts by Massif are right on. Read and reread them with a willing and open mind, then take a week off and evaluate your goals.

Where do you want to go first? What is most important to you now?

You’re a hopped up type 2 who needs to relax here and get a grip on the big picture. This is about a lifestyle, not a workout. Unless you are thinking about competing, it’s just not that complicated.

Workout hard and smart. Eat right. Enjoy your life. If it were only about working your ass to the bone, this thread, and many more magazines and such, wouldn’t be needed. It’s about being smart.

Read Reape’s article about backing off to grow. Accept Berardi’s 90/10 rule on nutrition. Do a full CW workout–as is, and see where you are 2 months from now.

And remember to drink 2 gallons of water everyday–you know where that’s coming from, right!?

47

Sasquatch,
Mass,

I highly respect two hardcore lifters like yourselves; I’m going to definately take your advice!!! Hell, I have been from the beginning ;).

As of two weeks ago I have reduced my time in the gym to about an hour and a half, on the average. Leg days take a little longer for me to complete. I have also taken out a couple of routines and decreased breaks between sets. I workout 3 days on 2 days off, 2 days on 1 day off.

And I’ll stop at failure… :wink:

Thanks,
OD

48

The fact that there is an overwieght midget in his avatar does not help a whole lot either.

49

[quote]allout wrote:
The fact that there is an overwieght midget in his avatar does not help a whole lot either.[/quote]

I do possess other photos, however, I’ve been holding out on releasing them for possible before and after pics.

50

[quote]Original_Demon wrote:
So I’m annoying, maybe a little amped and excited, but you… Talking about the pot calling the kettle black!

In the unfortunate event I see that stupid, rediculous purple dinosaur, I know what readers will be endulged by your brilliance and watch as the mayhem unfolds. I quickly scroll down and disregard “any” nonsense that oozes from the caption at that particular point.
[/quote]

Huh? I don’t even know how to address this gibberish considering the multiple spelling mistakes and incoherent thoughts.

Derogatory to everyone? Read through all my previous posts. Not true. But I will call out a troll when I see one. So you’re physically threatening me over the Internet? You’re a deranged man that needs help.

My goal in life is to support you through thick and thin :wink:

I stand by what I said. I’m still willing to bet that you would get a majority vote from the members of this site to cast you off t-island.

You say the most inappropriate things on threads at the most innappropriate times. You make wild claims that you can’t back up. And you generally are a troll that needs to crawl back in your hole.

I’m self-replicating as we speak. Let the self-destruction begin…

51

“I am one of the hardest working guys you will ever meet in the gym. I lift to the point of failure, and beyond. I’ve grit my teeth so tite I’ve split the corner of my lip! I have a permanent “lazy eye” due to a squat attempt I should not have attempted. I injured my left shoulder for being over-zealous on barbell incline press. Crushed my left index finger because my arm collapsed on a dumbell press.”

“I’ll quit at failure.”

I am gonna get fired for laughing too much rather than getting something done.

All I can see right now is a montage of OD in the gym, all crazy-lazy eyed, screaming as he tries to go “past” failure then going home to have spastic sex with his wife, one eye looking at her tits and the other staring off into space…

I said it on the very first OD post and I’ll say it again. SPAZ!

That said, no need to ban OD, most spazzes are born that way. OD’s posts brighten my day and for that, OD, I am thankful!

52

[quote]Original_Demon wrote:
Prof X,

In a fascinating study, scientists supplemented a group of mice with CLA or CLA plus guarana. After six weeks, both groups of mice showed a substantial reduction in fat mass. In the CLA-only group, the decreased fat mass was due to dramatic reduction in adipocyte (fat cell) size without a change in adipocyte number. In the CLA plus guarana group, both adipocyte size and number were reduced by 50%.3*

[/quote]

First, since this is the first I have read this thread in days, has anyone said that CLA won’t help obese people lose SOME body fat? Relying on it as if it is a thermogenic savior would be a false hope for many. There are SEVERAL substances that show SOME benefit for aiding in weight loss, however, rarely (as in almost never) are these studies conducted on healthy young adults. Second, could I have the source of this article? Third, what happens in mice does not mean it happens in humans.

53

Purple Dinosaur,

This is the last time I will ever reply to you.

If you want me to take you serious you’re going to have to get rid of your avatar. I can’t even concentrate on what your typing to me with that thing wiggling in the background.

Excuse my spelling for I type on-the-fly…

I assure you, I’m no troll. LOL, this is funny to me…

Definition of a troll:

“One who hijacks a thread in the attempt to disrupt and cause argument”

Enough said… Like I said… Find a life… get one… and quit being a troll!

If you have anything relevant to add to the conversation at hand, please, feel free to chime in. I’m interested to see what knowledge you possess on this subject. If you’re more well-read on the topic, at hand, I want to hear why you support it or why you are opposed to it. Please, say something constructive and intelligent. I’ve been waiting for your genious to unfold…

OD

54

[quote]apayne wrote:
“I’ll quit at failure.”

I am gonna get fired for laughing too much rather than getting something done.

All I can see right now is a montage of OD in the gym, all crazy-lazy eyed, screaming as he tries to go “past” failure then going home to have spastic sex with his wife, one eye looking at her tits and the other staring off into space…

I said it on the very first OD post and I’ll say it again. SPAZ!

That said, no need to ban OD, most spazzes are born that way. OD’s posts brighten my day and for that, OD, I am thankful![/quote]

You talk about my wife and I… You call me a Spaz… And this brightens your day? It takes a lot, “A lot”, to piss me off… You did it! Congratulations,

OD

55

[quote]Original_Demon wrote:

You talk about my wife and I… You call me a Spaz… And this brightens your day? It takes a lot, “A lot”, to piss me off… You did it! Congratulations,

OD

[/quote]

First and foremost I’d like to thank God. I’d also like to thank the academy, TC for the reco on the edible panties, Prof. X for telling me to eat, and all my other T-peeps for everything…