Can anyone recommend a routine that will reap the best possible gains ins muscular size?
Recently i have been doing alot of reading and i stumbled across this forum and some of the concepts which i havn’t fully got to grips with yet.
I am someone who was told that low reps, heavy compound exercises where the way to build muscular size. Yet I am now reading conflicting information and i do not know which is true
[quote]When you train with low reps (1 - 5), the adaptations that make you stronger are mostly neurological: You develop an increased ability to recruit more muscle fibers, you stimulate the higher threshold fibers that are not activated with high rep, low weight sets, you decrease neuromuscular inhibition, and there is increased coordination between the muscle groups. However, with low reps, the hypertrophy (size increase) of the muscle fibers is minimal. In other words, reps under 6 make you stronger, but they don�??t necessarily make you bigger because the strength gains come from adaptations in the nervous system.
[/quote]
I read this information today, and am just wondering if this is correct. The personal trainer at my gym told me that higher reps are better for mass while all the body building books I have purchased have said heavy, low rep sets are better for building mass.
Is the info stated above correct? If so, how come most mass bodybuilding books such as “The Secrets to Gaining Muscle Mass” by Anthony Ellis and Muscle Gain Truth by Sean Nalewanyj use the principle of low reps (5-7 or lower) with heavy weights in the workout programs?
I read in one of the articles, on here i think, total work reps should be between 24-50 for hypertrophy… ie 3x8, 3x10, 3x12, 4x8… etc?
Any routines you would recommend? I have been lfiting for 5 years so i’m pretty exerienced and relatively advanced. I have built up strong tendons and ligaments and alot of strength on 5x5 but no much size… i beleive i am now ready for a proper hypertrophy specific routine. I dont care about strength gains anymore, i just want to get as big as possible…
It was Chad Waterbury who said that (36 to 50 reps for hypertrophy).
After five years of training, maybe give Gironda training a try. Each bodypart will be trained twice per week. You shoot for 8 sets of 8 reps (same weight) with minimal rest between sets.
Check out the Gironda articles on T-Nation.
Honestly, if you’ve been training seriously for 5 years, and have made progress from a strength standpoint, but haven’t put on much muscle. Then the problem most likely has nothing to do with your training. It has to do with your diet. You’re not eating enough to allow for muscle growth.
Start eating more and you’ll gain muscle, it’s pretty much that simple.
[quote]Sentoguy wrote:
Honestly, if you’ve been training seriously for 5 years, and have made progress from a strength standpoint, but haven’t put on much muscle. Then the problem most likely has nothing to do with your training. It has to do with your diet. You’re not eating enough to allow for muscle growth.
Start eating more and you’ll gain muscle, it’s pretty much that simple.
Good training,
Sentoguy[/quote]
Quite so, but this doesn’t mean you shouldn’t experiment with different methods as I’m pretty sure Sentoguy will agree. There is no “best” routine for everybody all the time. Chances are just about everything you’ve read (or will read) works for at least some people some of the time.
Different guys will respond differently to different methods and even the same methods at different times of their lives or in different cycling programs.
Welcome to the world of trial and error AKA weight training 101.
Quite so, but this doesn’t mean you shouldn’t experiment with different methods as I’m pretty sure Sentoguy will agree. There is no “best” routine for everybody all the time. Chances are just about everything you’ve read (or will read) works for at least some people some of the time.
Different guys will respond differently to different methods and even the same methods at different times of their lives or in different cycling programs.
Welcome to the world of trial and error AKA weight training 101.
[/quote]
Absolutely agree. However, it seems to me like a lot of people are looking for some magical “best” routine that will build muscle. When in actuality there is often nothing inherently wrong with the routine they’re currently following. The “missing link” so to speak, is in actuality most often related to their diet.
If you’re not gaining weight, then the problem isn’t your routine. Any routine done correctly will put weight on you. Yes, as Tribulus mentioned different routines will work better for some and not as well for others. But they should all at least produce some results.
If you’re not gaining weight at all, or making painfully slow progress then chances are you’re simply not eating enough.
Kyusho, can we get some stats? How many calories do you consume each day (and if you don’t know, then there’s your problem right there)? How long have you been training? How much weight (muscle if you know) have you gained since you started training? How much progress have you made on your lifts since you started training?
With the answers to those questions we should be able to answer your questions more effectively.
Quite so, but this doesn’t mean you shouldn’t experiment with different methods as I’m pretty sure Sentoguy will agree. There is no “best” routine for everybody all the time. Chances are just about everything you’ve read (or will read) works for at least some people some of the time.
Different guys will respond differently to different methods and even the same methods at different times of their lives or in different cycling programs.
Welcome to the world of trial and error AKA weight training 101.
Absolutely agree. However, it seems to me like a lot of people are looking for some magical “best” routine that will build muscle. When in actuality there is often nothing inherently wrong with the routine they’re currently following. The “missing link” so to speak, is in actuality most often related to their diet.
If you’re not gaining weight, then the problem isn’t your routine. Any routine done correctly will put weight on you. Yes, as Tribulus mentioned different routines will work better for some and not as well for others. But they should all at least produce some results.
If you’re not gaining weight at all, or making painfully slow progress then chances are you’re simply not eating enough.
Kyusho, can we get some stats? How many calories do you consume each day (and if you don’t know, then there’s your problem right there)? How long have you been training? How much weight (muscle if you know) have you gained since you started training? How much progress have you made on your lifts since you started training?
With the answers to those questions we should be able to answer your questions more effectively.
I’m not in the “bodypart splits only” camp and most certainly don’t believe in the “full-body only! Splits are for roid-heads” crap that Waterbury preaches, but what worked best for me in my younger years was a split that went something like this…
M Chest/tris
T Legs
W Back/bis
TH Off
F Shoulders
S Off
Repeat.
It’s a basic split and I never did more than 9-12 sets of 8-12 reps, usually 3 or 4 exercises. I went from 169lbs to 195lbs in about a year and a half without roids.
I get more out of full-body stuff now, especially for maintanence, but I put on the size with the relatively low-volume splt routine.
[quote]beebuddy wrote:
I’m not in the “bodypart splits only” camp and most certainly don’t believe in the “full-body only! Splits are for roid-heads” crap that Waterbury preaches, but what worked best for me in my younger years was a split that went something like this…
M Chest/tris
T Legs
W Back/bis
TH Off
F Shoulders
S Off
Repeat.
It’s a basic split and I never did more than 9-12 sets of 8-12 reps, usually 3 or 4 exercises. I went from 169lbs to 195lbs in about a year and a half without roids.
I get more out of full-body stuff now, especially for maintanence, but I put on the size with the relatively low-volume splt routine.[/quote]
My all time favorite, which is just that, MY all time favorite is:
M Legs
T off
W Back, Bis and abs
TH off
Fri off
Sat Chest, Tris and shoulders
I may throw some supplemental work for lagging or unbalanced muscles on off days and or at the end of another day. I keep waiting for a reason to change this up because it just seems like there should be one sooner or later, but this keeps working very well for me. If it stops, I’ll change it.
I think this is the first time I’ve ever actually stated how I prefer to train here.
[quote]beebuddy wrote:
What was your set/rep scheme. I didn’t make good gains until I cut back to 9 sets. From there I worked my way up to 12 on some days.
I started out doing like 20 - 25 sets and I made no progress. Someone turned me on the lower volume and it was like BOOM I just started to explode.[/quote]
Pretty close to yours. 10-15 total sets depending on how I feel and what’s being worked. I vary how hard I go as well, but usually quite hard with some post failure stuff peppered in, but not exclusively by any means. Probably 75-80% compounds with some strategically utilized isos. Bis after back, tris after shoulders and chest etc. I work shoulders first that day because they’re my weakest bodypart. Vanilla, boring and pretty unadvanced, but it keeps getting me bigger and stronger.
I’m not going to tell anybody else that what they do doesn’t work if they’re happy, but for me, moderate volume with each group being hit directly, hard, once a week is what works as far as I’ve discovered to this point. I’m also honestly a bit hesitant to recommend what I do just because I do it for the simple reason that I have no idea who else it will be good for though I believe a lot of noobs could do far worse to get started with.
Not being a kid anymore with a whole lifetime of discovery still before me it will also require some very compelling information to get me to change my basic philosophy.
I’m slightly less hesitant to recommend lower volume, especially since a lot of the guys posting poor results use the high volume training. I do know a couple of guys that got big with lots of high volume isolation though. My buddy, who has bigger shoulders than anyone I know does absolutely no compound work for his shoulders. It’s all front raises. Granted he has no rear delt development, but goddam you should see his front delts.
[quote]beebuddy wrote:
I’m slightly less hesitant to recommend lower volume, especially since a lot of the guys posting poor results use the high volume training. I do know a couple of guys that got big with lots of high volume isolation though. My buddy, who has bigger shoulders than anyone I know does absolutely no compound work for his shoulders. It’s all front raises. Granted he has no rear delt development, but goddam you should see his front delts.
So, yea, whatever works for ya![/quote]
Higher volume does not work for me either. Some guys here swear by it which is fine for them. High volume with high frequency would have me on a stretcher.
I WOULD recommend doing whatever you’re not doing if it isn’t working how you’d hoped.
My point is I try not to be a “this is how I do it so this is best” guy. Not saying you’re being that way.
This is all basically dependent on the muscle fiber ratio that each individual has right? (slow & fast twitch). I would think so. Anyway, some people build mass with fewer reps then others and visa versa. You just have to find your range to see what works for you.
It’s something like;
1-5 reps for Power/Strength at 90% - 100% 1RM.
6-12 reps for Strength/Hypertrophy at 80% 1RM.
12-20 reps for Muscular/Endurance at 70%-lower 1RM.
