Beginning Martial Arts for Kids

Bigger Stronger Leaner
21

I don’t train kids, I train my own kids though.

Punch hard, punch fast, punch first. They never listen to anyone like they do a father or mother seriously engaged in helping them gain confidence.

That’s what defending yourself really means. Being confident enough to stand up to whomever without worrying about winning or losing. It’s merely being confident enough and having balls enough to stand up in the first place.

The techniques can be anything. Whether it’s a tma or traditional boxing or Muay Thai… doesn’t matter. Means jack to have all the skill in the world without the guts to carry through.

My eldest isn’t very co-ordinated. He has resilience and an attitude from hell. A never give up attitude and fears no one. That’s just his make up. We never had to push him to do any task. He tries his guts out. He is the sweetest happiest kid with a real jekyl/hyde personality. Fucken clicks it and is damn strong.

Number two is athlete of the century without the mental resilience. We really have to work at him, give him lots of attention and reinforcement for him to believe in himself. It works and he’s also an ace kid.

Number three is a “I’ll do shit my way” type of guy. Walks into a room and lights it up… I don’t think he’ll ever have to fight because he’s mr personality but that being said, like number one he has a jekyl/hyde personality. I’ve seen him jump up and defend his older brother (no 2) even though he’s 2 years younger lol.

And the girl takes the cake lol. She’s all of them wrapped up into a bitch of a personality. She hates close contact and when a boy tried to kiss her, she tore his lips off! lmao… and she’s only 2!!!

Having said that, all I do and all my wife does all day is reinforce positive attitudes and correct negative ones. All day their confidence soars. Around other kids they dominate and lead without need for fighting.

Having said that, we home school all of them. Part of the problem is that kids lose their personalities or ability to develop one or develop their confidence properly at school because their are too many others to deal with for teachers.

Parents may also be busy and just not have the time or in some circumstances can’t be bothered or may want to help but don’t know how.

It’s not hard, not difficult, doesn’t need specialised people… it’s just a little effort, reinforcement and putting them through gradually more difficult exercises and duties so they accomplish and complete things.

In this case she may be super bright, intelligent and have a great personality but she may not believe in her physical abilities.
Ya gotta spend time with her, make it fun. Buy some gloves and pads and let her punch on you. Go wild and reinforce her actions by telling her how strong she hits, how physically dominating she is etc etc.

Kick, punch, wrestle with her. Hit her back in the stomach gently, a few love taps on the head etc… she’ll get used to the idea that a fight is not tip tapping pads.

That’s going to be far more applicable than any tma dojo.

Plus it will improve your bond with her, give her more confidence and improve what she wants.

Of course you can still put her in a class because beneath it all she may just want more of a social atmosphere and to belong to something around her peers.

22

I’d say any martial art is at best tertiary to self defense (even boxing!) since actually keeping yourself from getting hurt involves staying alert and aware. Also, having had someone try to really screw me up, and having sparred in a ring…very, incredibly different, to the point I can’t even explain it adequately. Let’s just say that (unless something goes haywire) even a fairly hard MMA guy doesn’t want to make you eat a curb during a match. Even full contact sparring isn’t really the same, and most schools probably won’t let kids do that.

Find something she likes, and audit a few schools–see how they run classes, try to view 2-3 if they let you (with her) and pick one. I’d avoid anything that makes me bow to a flag or a portrait of anybody, but that’s just me being stubborn. Avoid ones that rely on a lot of mystical bullshit explanations for stuff (run if you hear chi energy being really discussed). If you can, check out several schools of different styles–you’ll have to rely on locals to try to suss out a non-crappy school for each one though.

If she’s concerned about personal safety and protection that needs to be handled outside of martial arts classes–ask her why (see if anything’s happening) and if nothing is, try to explain about avoiding bad situations, keeping your eyes open, etc. The best self defense course in the world does jack shit if someone hits you on the back of the head with a bat while you’re walking past an alley.

23

[quote]Ropes wrote:
I still agree with a lot of the advice given, though I still think learning arts like Boxing, Muay Thai, or BJJ are some of the best options.

With someone at that age martial arts, if she chooses to stick with them, will be a progression and I think it’s important to develop a solid set of fundamentals. Learning to throw proper punches, kicks, knees, elbows, or controlling someone on the ground is a great start to lead into any reality based systems. From some of the classes I’ve observed with reality based systems, there seems to be too little emphasis on throwing techniques with proper form to optimize force - just lots of arm punching and whatever you would call the equivalent with knees and kicks.

I spent a lot of years grappling and have recently started training Muay Thai with a gym that also puts a heavy emphasis on boxing, and has a great western boxing team. I’ve notice that as my technique and power has improved in my punches, the same has happened with my elbows due to simply learning how to turn my hips and drive into my strikes.

I don’t think anyone has mentioned this yet, but how do you guys feel about the other aspects of boxing like parrying, slipping, head movement, defensive and evasive footwork, fighting off of the ropes, and things like using footwork to get yourself out of the corner? Honestly, whenever I work boxing I feel like punching is the easiest part sometimes - it’s the defensive aspect that always gets me and it seems hugely beneficial to any self defense situation; especially in close quarters. I also don’t seem to ever see these aspects emphasized in most reality based systems.

I didn’t mean to write so much, but on a final note, I’m not opposed to reality based systems but they seem to suffer from the same McDojo syndrome many traditional martial arts suffer from. I just believe starting with a solid set of fundamentals - the kind you can gain from great coaching in boxing, muay thai, wrestling, or BJJ - are a solid start to progressing in martial arts. Oh, and hi everyone![/quote]

Man, it really makes me sad (and a little frustrated) to hear what You and others seem to think or have experienced in regards to RMA systems. I understand that there is a current boom in their popularity (just as there is with MMA) and with that is going to come some crappy stuff, but seriously good RMA is going to emphasize correct striking technique, and pretty much everything relevant to reality combat that you would learn in boxing, Muay Thai, wrestling and BJJ AND it’s also going to teach you things like confrontation management strategies, how to deploy and defend against modern weaponry, strategies for multiple attackers, environmental considerations and utilization, awareness, cerebral self defense, and pretty much everything having to do with actual real world self defense and interpersonal combat/conflict.

It’s going to have you putting on the gloves, headgear, mouthguards, shin guards and going at it light, partial, and full contact. It’s going to have you grappling full resistance (both on a training mat AND outside on realistic surfaces like pavement, gravel, grass, hills, swamps, snow, etc…) with and without strikes. It’s going to have you beginning in all sorts of different positions that you might find yourself attacked in and learning what the best options for attack and defense are going to be and what targets are most easily accessible or vulnerable. It’s going to have you weapons sparring with modern weaponry (like you’ve got a training stick and I’ve got a training knife, now let’s see who can control the distance better and who wins). It’s going to have you trying to bite, use nerve attacks, use body handles (like grabbing hair, fingers, skin, ears, groin, etc…), and use eye attacks full speed against people who are trying to do the same thing to you and defend against your attacks.

In other words, good RMA is going to work against highly trained and athletic opponents who refuse to play by your rules, want to kill you, and will attack you at the worst possible time and place.

But again, it’s all going to come down to Steely’s options that he has available to him.

24

[quote]paulwhite959 wrote:
If she’s concerned about personal safety and protection that needs to be handled outside of martial arts classes–ask her why (see if anything’s happening) and if nothing is, try to explain about avoiding bad situations, keeping your eyes open, etc. The best self defense course in the world does jack shit if someone hits you on the back of the head with a bat while you’re walking past an alley.

[/quote]

I’d argue that it should be addressed inside a good martial arts class, otherwise the martial art is no designed for personal saftey and protection/self defense, and therefore she should look elsewhere (if there are none that do, yeah obviously you’ve gotta make due with what is available). And if you are walking past an alley (or parked car, or really any blind corner) without paying attention to what is on the other side of it and giving yourself enough distance to be able to react if need be, then the martial art you are learning is again not teaching you the correct mindset or good habits for self protection.

25

[quote]humble wrote:
That’s what defending yourself really means. Being confident enough to stand up to whomever without worrying about winning or losing. It’s merely being confident enough and having balls enough to stand up in the first place.

[/quote]

Self-defense is more about survival vs death than winning vs losing. Sometimes it’s better to run than to stand and fight. We’re talking about a girl who may have to face, unfortunately, men who mean to do her serious harm. It’s better that she get the hell out of that parking garage as fast as she can instead of standing up (because of “balls”) to that strange person following her who is giving her the creeps. Avoiding the “fight” is more of a win than actually fighting and “winning.” Fear really isn’t a bad thing. I have a daughter and I don’t want her to be fearless (at least not in every facet of life) and want her to listen to that voice, acknowledge that fear, and act accordingly before she needs to react.

26

Sentoguy – sent PM.

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Steely, can’t see it, try resending it. If that doesn’t work I’ll PM you my email and you can send it there.

28

Sentoguy; that kind of depends. There’s plenty of people that take a martial art without self defense being a primary concern. Honestly, if (big if) I ever go back to martial arts, it wouldn’t be for me.
And we’re dealing with an 11 year old kid; she may say she wants something that teaches self defense, but who really knows what she’ll find enjoyable enough to stick with? That’s why I’d be so interested in trying out several schools. I mean, even if whatever she took wasn’t really great for self defense, it could (and should) have other positive impacts on her.

29

[quote]paulwhite959 wrote:
Sentoguy; that kind of depends. There’s plenty of people that take a martial art without self defense being a primary concern. Honestly, if (big if) I ever go back to martial arts, it wouldn’t be for me.
And we’re dealing with an 11 year old kid; she may say she wants something that teaches self defense, but who really knows what she’ll find enjoyable enough to stick with? That’s why I’d be so interested in trying out several schools. I mean, even if whatever she took wasn’t really great for self defense, it could (and should) have other positive impacts on her.[/quote]

Yes, that’s true, but in this case Steely specifically said that his daughter told him she was looking for self defense. Obviously she needs to enjoy it enough to stick with it in order to reap the benefits, but assuming she is serious, the simple knowledge that she is getting what she is after should be motivation enough to continue.

30

Steely, sent you a pm, did you get it?

31

I disagree with all you experts. It’s a bunch of grown up talk.

Steely, your daughter probably barely gives a hoot about self defense. I bet she has some friends doing Taekwando and that’s why she’s interested. If so, take her to where her friends are. If not, take her to watch a couple of nearby classes and let her choose the one she thinks she’ll have the most fun at. The best form of self defense is going to be the one she’s excited about.

All the stuff about avoidance, posture, confidence, recognizing creeps etc should all be part of good parenting. It’s just a bonus in martial arts.

32

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]humble wrote:
That’s what defending yourself really means. Being confident enough to stand up to whomever without worrying about winning or losing. It’s merely being confident enough and having balls enough to stand up in the first place.

[/quote]

Self-defense is more about survival vs death than winning vs losing. Sometimes it’s better to run than to stand and fight. [/quote]

RUN AWAY:

By the way I thought private messaging had been disabled.

33

To echo some of the semi-dissenting opinions… My personal opinion is that the best martial art for any person is the art they want to practice. Really, I’d suggest she watch and try a few and see which she enjoys the most. Traditional and sports martial arts gave me a lot of the coordination and athletic ability I have today. Those in turn gave me confidence to start really working out and getting involved in combative things like San Shou, BJJ and boxing.

I’d point out that going from nothing at all to a real boxing gym or MMA school can be pretty intimidating. Usually it smells, the bathroom/lockers are disgusting and all the guys are a missed shower away from carrying staph. I can’t tell you how many times at various different schools where I’ve seen a woman come in, try 2-3 classes and disappear. It’s just a bit to get used to. One of the trainers at an MMA school once told me that my previous training in other arts (Tang Soo Do, Wushu, Capoeira) wasn’t time wasted, it just wasn’t time well spent. I generally agree, but if that’s what it takes to get someone into any training at all, then why not. My old capoeira school is filled with tons of in shape women who love the art.

Anyway, long story short… any training is better than no training. But… I also think self defense is moderately overrated. I’m only 27 years old, but I’ve never had to throw a strike or grapple in self defense. I concur with most that awareness and confidence are 99% of conflict avoidance.

34

[quote]conservativedog wrote:

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]humble wrote:
That’s what defending yourself really means. Being confident enough to stand up to whomever without worrying about winning or losing. It’s merely being confident enough and having balls enough to stand up in the first place.

[/quote]

Self-defense is more about survival vs death than winning vs losing. Sometimes it’s better to run than to stand and fight. [/quote]

RUN AWAY:

By the way I thought private messaging had been disabled.
[/quote]

Lol, great scene!

Hmmm, well that would explain things.

35

[quote]XiaoNio wrote:
To echo some of the semi-dissenting opinions… My personal opinion is that the best martial art for any person is the art they want to practice. Really, I’d suggest she watch and try a few and see which she enjoys the most. Traditional and sports martial arts gave me a lot of the coordination and athletic ability I have today. Those in turn gave me confidence to start really working out and getting involved in combative things like San Shou, BJJ and boxing.

I’d point out that going from nothing at all to a real boxing gym or MMA school can be pretty intimidating. Usually it smells, the bathroom/lockers are disgusting and all the guys are a missed shower away from carrying staph. I can’t tell you how many times at various different schools where I’ve seen a woman come in, try 2-3 classes and disappear. It’s just a bit to get used to. One of the trainers at an MMA school once told me that my previous training in other arts (Tang Soo Do, Wushu, Capoeira) wasn’t time wasted, it just wasn’t time well spent. I generally agree, but if that’s what it takes to get someone into any training at all, then why not. My old capoeira school is filled with tons of in shape women who love the art.

Anyway, long story short… any training is better than no training. But… I also think self defense is moderately overrated. I’m only 27 years old, but I’ve never had to throw a strike or grapple in self defense. I concur with most that awareness and confidence are 99% of conflict avoidance.[/quote]

Again, I agree that any training is better than none. I’m of the opinion that pretty much every martial art has something beneficial to offer. But, let’s be honest, some have more to offer in specific areas than others. And arts specifically designed for a given area will have the most to offer in that area.

In regards to self defense being overrated, first keep in mind that we are talking about a young female in the US. Depending on what source of statistics you are going by:
-about 1 in 5 women are the victims of rape or attempted rape
-1 in 4 are the victims of domestic violence
-1 in 6 have been stalked

That’s not exactly paranoid delusional percentages for a woman to be concerned about the need to be able to defend herself. Obviously she’d like to be able to spot the trouble early or deter would be predators, but wanting to have some reliable physical skills in the event that those don’t work is probably a good idea IMO.

36

[quote]magick wrote:
I’d recommend boxing, but for some reason people look down on it. I suppose extremely efficient fighting techniques isn’t flashy enough for their taste?

So I’d say judo instead. It has mystique, cause it’s Japanese, and it’s not idolized as absurdly as BJJ is and more practical in actual self-defense. It teaches you a single fundamental technique that everyone should know (how to take a fall without breaking every bone in your body). And, most importantly, it teaches you how to read body movements and react accordingly. With just a year of training, anyone can possibly ruin their assailant’s life with a very simple throw that requires no strength whatsoever!

Not to mention, only in judo can a 5ft 100lb girl effortlessly throw a 200lb man =P ([/quote]

Great post.