They can ban it, as long as they ban yamaicas and crosses on chains with it. Gotta be equal now, and I consider all of those things “oppressive.”
But first can we ban hipster jeans and make wearing any type of jeans too low a crime?
[quote]Makavali wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
If they stay with an abusive husband, that is entirely there problem.[/quote]
No, it isn’t. Do you really think it’s that easy for them?
Stop deluding yourself.[/quote]
I am not deluding myself I, you are.
You are just someone in a long line of men telling them what to do.
All for their own good of ocurse.
That will teach em to make their own decisions, I am sure of that.
[quote]Chushin wrote:
[quote]Makavali wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
If they stay with an abusive husband, that is entirely there problem.[/quote]
No, it isn’t. Do you really think it’s that easy for them?
Stop deluding yourself.[/quote]
C’mon Mac!
Don’t you know that attempting to assist those who are persecuted by stronger entities is “busy-body” work?
Leave them alone to “work it out for themselves.” Who are you to try and encourage postive change in the lives of downtrodden women??? [/quote]
Exactly, who are you?
[quote]Chushin wrote:
Leave them alone to “work it out for themselves.” Who are you to try and encourage postive change in the lives of downtrodden women??? [/quote]
Positive change equates to a government telling people what they can’t wear?
I have no problem with privately owned establishments/businesses telling its patrons that they can’t wear burqas. I do, however, have a problem with government restrictions and laws being placed on certain items of clothing.
[quote]MaximusB wrote:
Calm down. I have a problem with those who bring their oppressive way of life (the very way of life that caused them to leave their home country), and bringing it to a new place that allows you to flourish. Do you know what happens when you let everyone into the country club? It goes to total shit. [/quote]
I don’t like the idea outlawing clothing but I have to agree.
There comes a time when a line has to be drawn and although it might be disrespectful, the point has to be made that there are certain things about fundamentalist Islam culture that will not stand in more modern country. If you don’t like it, then go to another country.
I saw a girl running on the treadmill the other day in the full burka and robe. I felt bad, even if she wanted to be wearing it, because there was no way she was going to effectively work out in that attire.
And a generation or two from now this law will be used by a secular majority to outlaw public display of the crucifex and the star of david. Only the darwin fish will get a pass.
Is there a difference in someone wearing a Klan outfit around in public and the government saying you cannot wear it? We had an issue with that here in LA not long ago, someone walked into a city council meeting with a Klan hood and robe on. People were disturbed obviously, people left. Turns out he was a black man expressing his 1st amendment rights.
But how is this going to be enforced? I mean on day to day basis, by the cops?
I don’t like this law. I can understand those who support it, but I don’t see how this is going to solve any problems.
It will probably just feed Muslim paranoia as well…
[quote]espenl wrote:
One problem with banning burqa in public, is some of those women who were allowed to go outside wearing a burqa will now be forced to stay home/inside. Freedom is relative.[/quote]
If the dinners are cooked and the house is cleaned and the other domestic duties are done to the husband’s standards, not allowing them outside for 30 minutes or so twice per week is wrong.
[quote]Gadrien wrote:
So you people who think burqua should be allowed in the name of freedom, you also think people should be allowed to walk around naked ?
There is a limit to put somewhere in front of every individual freedom.
[/quote]
what is wrong with naked?
I have to agree with orion on this one.
[quote]Dustin wrote:
[quote]Chushin wrote:
Leave them alone to “work it out for themselves.” Who are you to try and encourage postive change in the lives of downtrodden women??? [/quote]
Positive change equates to a government telling people what they can’t wear?
I have no problem with privately owned establishments/businesses telling its patrons that they can’t wear burqas. I do, however, have a problem with government restrictions and laws being placed on certain items of clothing.[/quote]
So if the goverment became a privately owned establishment it woould be ok to ban burqas?
I’m guessing it’s like going commando. If you haven’t done it your whole life, it feels weird.
So if a woman wants to wear one, will she be fined?
[quote]florelius wrote:
[quote]Dustin wrote:
[quote]Chushin wrote:
Leave them alone to “work it out for themselves.” Who are you to try and encourage postive change in the lives of downtrodden women??? [/quote]
Positive change equates to a government telling people what they can’t wear?
I have no problem with privately owned establishments/businesses telling its patrons that they can’t wear burqas. I do, however, have a problem with government restrictions and laws being placed on certain items of clothing.[/quote]
So if the goverment became a privately owned establishment it woould be ok to ban burqas?
[/quote]
Is this a rhetorical question? Privately owned government?
[quote]Dustin wrote:
[quote]florelius wrote:
[quote]Dustin wrote:
[quote]Chushin wrote:
Leave them alone to “work it out for themselves.” Who are you to try and encourage postive change in the lives of downtrodden women??? [/quote]
Positive change equates to a government telling people what they can’t wear?
I have no problem with privately owned establishments/businesses telling its patrons that they can’t wear burqas. I do, however, have a problem with government restrictions and laws being placed on certain items of clothing.[/quote]
So if the goverment became a privately owned establishment it woould be ok to ban burqas?
[/quote]
Is this a rhetorical question? Privately owned government?[/quote]
yes it is.
When I first heard of some countries considering banning the burqa, it was expressed as a security issue. For example, a woman claims she has to wear the burqa for religious reasons, for which she cannot be discriminated against in any way. This same woman is required to possess some form of photo ID for a job, driver’s license, the equivalent of a non license state ID,…etc. She says she has to have the picture taken with the burqa on, and her eyes down because a man might look at the photo.
If for any reason she is denied this ID then she sues for discrimination, gets them anyway, and a bunch of cash and publicity.
Then a month down the road, 57 women are using the same ID for driving, access to restricted areas in companies, …etc.
As I stated, when the ideas for this came about, this is what I believe many had in mind.
France was the first place I heard of instituting this policy because in the course of their jobs, police were encouintering women and asking for ID and couldn’t confirm from the ID who the person was.
People need to be able to do what the fuck they want as long as it doesnt harm other people.
Did you guys forgot about Freedom of religion???
Wearing a Burqa is their religious tradition, it doesn’t harm me, it doesn’t harm anybody. The claim that is it is “repressive to women” is utter bullshit. Sarzoky says that to win votes from mangina beta boys, feminists, and extreme-right wing voters in France. So he picks on an insignificant minority, Muslim women who wear the Burqa, who have no political influence.
I am an atheist, but even I understand that a Religions Tradition is NOT the same as some dude walking naked the street for shits & giggles. Or some black guy dressed as the KKK for the hell of it.
This banning of the Burqa is just as bullshit as Sweden banning the minarets.
[quote]horsepuss wrote:
People need to be able to do what the fuck they want as long as it doesnt harm other people.[/quote]
WELL FUCKING SAID!
[quote]AlisaV wrote:
I don’t like it.
God knows I like Western culture and female equality and would like to see it spread. It just seems counterproductive to do it this way. It’s just a pointless, controversial measure that immigrants will only perceive as anti-immigrant. Here, a special law, just for you, about what you can and can’t wear. It’s not a very good advertisement for freedom.
You know what changes the status of women in traditional societies? TV.
http://aidwatchers.com/2010/04/this-device-will-change-the-world/
Women in rural India and Brazil see our silly TV shows, Desperate Housewives and the like, and they’re attracted to the way women live here. They have fewer children, less tolerance of domestic violence, and are more likely to enroll their sons and daughters in school. It can be pretty darn appealing to live like a Western woman.
Exporting pop culture is much more compelling than a burqa ban. Do you really think that a law banning an article of clothing will motivate men to treat their wives and daughters better?[/quote]
Great post!
People should be allowed to wear what they want’ as long as it does not harm anyone else.
First generation immigrants will wear what is traditional for their customs or beliefs and that is ok in my opinion. I see Africans, Afgans etc. wear their traditional clothes and it doesnt bother me at all.
I’ll admit however that the first time I saw foreign dress in my country (Ireland) it bothered me but lets be honest people it’s pure racism!
(ID cards etc. is a practical issue and you should see the persons face, common sense is what is needed here!)
What you will notice however is that second generation immigrants (and 1st generation), will take on the customs and beliefs of their adoptive country, this through direct exposure to the people around them, through TV and pop culture. I have 2nd generation chinese and african students who act and dress just like their Irish counterparts.
Do not underestimate the allure of western culture and the power it has for change, especially in the youth. Let that be the catalyst for change and not government control!
I hope they do not ban the burqa, because as a male I may not be able to control myself if these stunning women are wandering the streets uncovered.