Hello, all!
I’m 20 yo male, 190lbs, weight training for 5 years straight. When I was 15 I was extremely fat (260lbs, 35-40% bf), I’m currently around 12% bf. As I have extremely high fat cells count, its very hard for me to get below 12% bf. I’m eating very clean and cycling carbs year long, last year I was cutting 4 months, 2 of which on “Get shredded” and for first time I could see my top 4 abs. But my ass and legs remain relatively fat.
I was suspecting high estrogens, low testosterone for quite some time and when I recently got some blood work done I freaked. My testosterone is very low - around 10 nmol / l, with norm 8.4-28.7 and the norm is very low anyway! My estrogen is very high but I can provide exact readings at home (I’m currently at the office).
So while I’m interested in using steroids in the feature, I’ve always stayed natural and achieved goals to the body I want slowly. Now I know that probably in another five years I might use steroids but not before I get my bodyfat 6-8% and be able to make some real gains naturally (growing when 12-15% bf doesn’t make good gains).
So I talked to a guy at my gym - Nasar Al Ahmed, he is national bodybuilding champion in Bulgaria. He is 20 yo as well and using lots of steroids but he also knows hell lot about eating, training and endocrine system so he gave me an advice to see if I can afford Aromasin or Arimidex. Both help stop the conversion of test to estro, so now I’m gathering knowledge on this.
I want to get cut, as naturally as possible but my genetics do me a vary nasty trick. So I want to ask you to give an advice which drug should I use (if any for my age is good idea) to help my testosterone get to the upper borderline of the healthy levels and estro goes down. I’m whiling to spend some money on this, so the high price of Aromasin and Arimidex is fine.
I also checked Nolvadex and other estrogen blockers but as I’m not using steroids, I don’t have enlarged breast tissue (gyno) so I don’t think that drugs blocking estrogen binding might do me any good in the long run.
Thank you!
Dimitar
if you can handle the emotional sides (and i BARELY can) of SERMS, then nolva/clomid are great to use long term to boost your bodies own test production and to lower some of the undesired effects of too much estrogen, such as your bodies propensity to store store adipose tissue.
i would also say it’s a good idea to use a LOW DOSE of an aromatase inhibitor to keep your estrogen in the low/normal range, but you should check regularly with blood work that you’re not supressing too much estrogen, as it is still an important hormone for the male body.
Aside from this, u can throw in shit like proviron, which will also help fight the effects of estrogen and it also frees up more testosterone as “free test” which is what you want… and few herbals like zinc and longjack, some guys respond well.
Also, anyone know of using HCG OFF cycle in a controlled way? Would this help incrase your bodies test production above baseline like a serm does?
Well, I’m using ZMA for at least 4-5 months now, if it has helped than before that my test has been even lower because the blood work is from few weeks ago.
Also, as I have never used any SERMS, I’m not really aware what emotional sides they have. I’m reading that its quite safe to use tamoxifen for months, even years, but I’m confused as it seems to stop estrogen binding to breast tissue receptors and I want to get rid of the fat storages in my ass and legs which are again problematic because of high estrogen. So would Nolvadex help here?
From what I’m reading I’m doing a theory that it might be better to get Aromasin or Arimidex because of their capability to stop conversion of testosterone to estrogen. I will do weakly tests of testosterone and estrogen to check if my dose is right and if I’m going towards the good borderline of those hormones (upper for test, lower for estro). But I might be totaly wrong. Also Nolvadex is few times cheaper than Aromasin/Arimidex, I have still much to read about Clomid.
dunno man, i read it on bb.com.
perhaps someone of the knowledge and might of idowhatican can exlpain whether this is true or not and through what mechanisms if it is.
I read somewhere that it lower “free” estrogen, which WOULD have a lowering effect on your pre-disposition to gain fat. Not sure how that works.
Emotional sides - turns me into a depressed crying little bitch. It’s pretty dramatic with me, the day i start PCT, and the SERM goes up to estrogen receptors in my brain, one bad thought can leave me on my bed sobbing like a bitch lol
This from a guy who didn’t cry for 10 YEARS! (i think). Now i just put up with it, i got all lovey with my girl and its nice to be in touch with yo femininse side sometimes, heeeeyyyy!!!
No SERM’s. Period. For test boosting off cycle use an AI, SERM’s are not things to play with, they are for PCT.
He needs an AI, either letro or Adex, low dose.
I recommend letro, cheaper, at a low dose a bottle will last forever. You can get up to 3-4 times the test levels with letro dosing.
start with 2.5mg/week, dosed everyday. Liquid chemicals are better for measuring low doses out.
Thank you so much, this covered my initial theory. The thing is that Letrozole in Bulgaria is about 240$ for 30x2.5mg, but its pills not liquid. But I read Letrozole’s half life is 2 days so wouldn’t it be ok to get 1/4 tab every other day, as I think it will be impossible to cut such small tab in 7 (once a day)?
Also, the tablets are film coated. I can’t find info why there is film on Letrozole, it might be just to make it easier to swallow but it might be helping its absorbtion (lets hope not).
And please read my first post - I’m not on PCT, I’m completely natural but my natural level of testosterone is very low while estrogen is high!
[quote]Veseliq wrote:
Thank you so much, this covered my initial theory. The thing is that Letrozole in Bulgaria is about 240$ for 30x2.5mg, but its pills not liquid. But I read Letrozole’s half life is 2 days so wouldn’t it be ok to get 1/4 tab every other day, as I think it will be impossible to cut such small tab in 7 (once a day)?
Also, the tablets are film coated. I can’t find info why there is film on Letrozole, it might be just to make it easier to swallow but it might be helping its absorbtion (lets hope not).
And please read my first post - I’m not on PCT, I’m completely natural but my natural level of testosterone is very low while estrogen is high![/quote]
Honestly, if you have health insurance I would simply try to get a script. That is very expensive.
In the US we can get liquid letro as a research chemical for less than 100 dollars for a massive ammount.
You can dose every 2 days, but the blood levels will not be very stable.
You can get a very accurate scale and crush it all up and weigh and cap it all.
Or you can crush and dissolve the tabs in highproof alcohol, 150 proof minimum. But as I have said the coating makes a mess, but it works.
Can you import from the US or Europe or Japan or anywhere else ?? those prices are on the very high side.
I really appreciate your replies!
I have health insurance and Letrozole is covered by it but it is authorized to be prescribed to stop breast cancer in post-menstrual women. Probably no one will prescribe my Letro as he will be playing with his license to explain what 20 yo male has in common with post-menstrual woman.
I’m in European Union so I can import from EU easy and cheap. If the package isn’t labeled “cheap drugs that are with prescription only and expensive in the destination location” it won’t get opened and I wont have any problems - a friend of mine get cheap Chinese HGH from within the EU every six months.
The thing is I don’t have many connections in this business, I will talk to some bodybuilders in my gym that are known to use shit load of steroids but I’m not sure how letrozole for research should look like and if they will be giving me the right stuff…
If there is a way to order legally some from EU research chemical supplier, I’ll be getting it right away. I will do some more search, though if you have links - pass them over.
Thank you again!!
Dimitar
Hey, I stumbled upon a company here in a thread while searching. Those guys ship internationally letro for research purposes, on the site they say they know how to bypass customs and its $55 + $40 shipping for 30ml, 2.5mg / ml letro or 2-3 times cheaper. I wrote them email, if they answer and you don’t suggest cheaper / better option, I think I’m going right after it.
Thank you.
Dimitar
FYI, you can get 60ml @ 2.5mg/ml for about $70 (not including shipping, but that would be just under $40 to Europe).