It genuinely astounds me. Willing and eager slavery.
I think this is probably why I have never been religious. I have a need to be free, be my own man and have my own thoughts to the fullest extent possible.
[quote]Jab1 wrote:
It genuinely astounds me. Willing and eager slavery.
I think this is probably why I have never been religious. I have a need to be free, be my own man and have my own thoughts to the fullest extent possible.
[/quote]
You don’t have free will.
[quote]Sloth wrote:
Jab1 wrote:
It genuinely astounds me. Willing and eager slavery.
I think this is probably why I have never been religious. I have a need to be free, be my own man and have my own thoughts to the fullest extent possible.
You don’t have free will.[/quote]
I know that, it doesn’t contradict what I wrote.
[quote]Jab1 wrote:
Sloth wrote:
Jab1 wrote:
It genuinely astounds me. Willing and eager slavery.
I think this is probably why I have never been religious. I have a need to be free, be my own man and have my own thoughts to the fullest extent possible.
You don’t have free will.
I know that, it doesn’t contradict what I wrote.[/quote]
Seems to, in my opinion. How can one be free if you have no free will? If we’re doing nothing more than acting out the end result of domino-like chain reactions of chemicals, you’re not free. Religious or not. You’re a slave to your nature, your orientation, your program, whatever. Accepting that free will is an illusion, then the religious is following his nature, his orientation. The doctrines of his beliefs and his faith sets off his reward program.
You’re not atheist because you’re free, but because you can’t help it. And you’re not free because you’re an atheist. It simply triggers the satisfaction switch for you. It’s what you HAVE to be.
[quote]Sloth wrote:
Jab1 wrote:
Sloth wrote:
Jab1 wrote:
It genuinely astounds me. Willing and eager slavery.
I think this is probably why I have never been religious. I have a need to be free, be my own man and have my own thoughts to the fullest extent possible.
You don’t have free will.
I know that, it doesn’t contradict what I wrote.
Seems to, in my opinion. How can one be free if you have no free will? If we’re doing nothing more than acting out the end result of domino-like chain reactions of chemicals, you’re not free. Religious or not. You’re a slave to your nature, your orientation, your program, whatever. Accepting that free will is an illusion, then the religious is following his nature, his orientation. The doctrines of his beliefs and his faith sets off his reward program.
You’re not atheist because you’re free, but because you can’t help it. And you’re not free because you’re an atheist. It simply triggers the satisfaction switch for you. It’s what you HAVE to be.[/quote]
Please re-read what I wrote. It’s quite clear. Having a need to be free and actually being free are distinct things.
[quote]Jab1 wrote:
Sloth wrote:
Jab1 wrote:
Sloth wrote:
Jab1 wrote:
It genuinely astounds me. Willing and eager slavery.
I think this is probably why I have never been religious. I have a need to be free, be my own man and have my own thoughts to the fullest extent possible.
You don’t have free will.
I know that, it doesn’t contradict what I wrote.
Seems to, in my opinion. How can one be free if you have no free will? If we’re doing nothing more than acting out the end result of domino-like chain reactions of chemicals, you’re not free. Religious or not. You’re a slave to your nature, your orientation, your program, whatever. Accepting that free will is an illusion, then the religious is following his nature, his orientation. The doctrines of his beliefs and his faith sets off his reward program.
You’re not atheist because you’re free, but because you can’t help it. And you’re not free because you’re an atheist. It simply triggers the satisfaction switch for you. It’s what you HAVE to be.
Please re-read what I wrote. It’s quite clear. Having a need to be free and actually being free are distinct things. [/quote]
What is the “need to be free?” Does one feel a sense of “freedom” from following his religious faith and practices? Does the other feel “free” from his lack of faith and whatever “practices” he indulges in through life? And, the last sentence about “distinct things,” leads me to a question. Are you saying that you, believing free will to be an illusion, are satisfied with being fooled by an illusionary need for freedom? With, again, a sense of what “freedom” is, and how it is stimulated, being subjective?
[quote]Sloth wrote:
Jab1 wrote:
Sloth wrote:
Jab1 wrote:
Sloth wrote:
Jab1 wrote:
It genuinely astounds me. Willing and eager slavery.
I think this is probably why I have never been religious. I have a need to be free, be my own man and have my own thoughts to the fullest extent possible.
You don’t have free will.
I know that, it doesn’t contradict what I wrote.
Seems to, in my opinion. How can one be free if you have no free will? If we’re doing nothing more than acting out the end result of domino-like chain reactions of chemicals, you’re not free. Religious or not. You’re a slave to your nature, your orientation, your program, whatever. Accepting that free will is an illusion, then the religious is following his nature, his orientation. The doctrines of his beliefs and his faith sets off his reward program.
You’re not atheist because you’re free, but because you can’t help it. And you’re not free because you’re an atheist. It simply triggers the satisfaction switch for you. It’s what you HAVE to be.
Please re-read what I wrote. It’s quite clear. Having a need to be free and actually being free are distinct things.
What is the “need to be free?” Does one feel a sense of “freedom” from following his religious faith and practices? Does the other feel “free” from his lack of faith and whatever “practices” he indulges in through life? And, the last sentence about “distinct things,” leads me to a question. Are you saying that you, believing free will to be an illusion, are satisfied with being fooled by an illusionary need for freedom? With, again, a sense of what “freedom” is, and how it is stimulated, being subjective?[/quote]
They’re different kinds of freedom; free will, or the notion that you are free to make any choice you want or do whatever you want is illusory.
But the freedom that I need is not free will, it is freedom from being told what to do, from tyranny.
It is possible to feel free and not be so. It is possible to be free and not have free will.