The only reason I am upset is because they have the right to teach the theories of evolution when it has nothing to do with what needs to be taught in school. It teaches nothing. Nobody needs to know anything about evolution to become whatever they want to become whether it be a doctor or a lawyer. People have lost faith in religion due to the fact that they believe some of these theories are true when the forget they are just theories. Several theories have been proven wrong but they are still taught in the colleges. Doesn’t make since at all. I was told these exact words by several people and believe them cause they have shown proof. I am done arguing now.
[quote]kroby wrote:
Nudibranchs are evolved from sea slugs. Fact. The creatures that live/grow in coral has evolved from sea sponges. Fact. The creatures that create sea sponges evolved from plankton. Fact. The first animal that has a developed eye is the octapus, also the first invertebrate that has a highly developed nervous system; even more than any other aquatic organism.
Thus arises Cthulhu. All hail the Dark One, lest your soul be blasted into oblivion.
All facts that support the theory of evolution.
Where is this “Eden” from which we sprang? Adam had Eve, then begat Cain and Abel. Who else had sex with the “first mother” which sprung forth the human race? Bah. These stories that you cling to don’t even fool a child. I gave you hard facts. Living proof evolution is. What proof do you offer that I may touch, see, feel, hear or taste? None. It’s that elusive “faith” that you “know” the “truth.” God gave you a brain. Use it!
Now, where’s Pookie? Every time I need his help, he’s impossible to find. Hey Pookie![/quote]
I’m not sure me or anyone else knows the exact definition of evolution. They don’t have proof of anything that could have happened even over a thousand years. It’s all theories.
[quote]djm_e22 wrote:
So what your thinking is if a taller man mates with a short woman, and the kid grows to be short because he/she took on his/her mother’s genes this would be evolution. I have to disagree.[/quote]
When I ask you what you think something is, trying to tell me what I think is a disingenious answer. Especially when you’re incorrect in your assertation.
[quote]djm_e22 wrote:
I’m not sure me or anyone else knows the exact definition of evolution. They don’t have proof of anything that could have happened even over a thousand years. It’s all theories.[/quote]
Theory:
“A coherent group of general propositions used as principles of explanation for a class of phenomena” (Barnhart 1948).
–In laymen terms, it means there are a few mountains of hard facts supporting it.
Other theories -
Theory of gravity.
Atomic theory.
Germ theory of disease.
Theory of Calculus.
Evolution:
Evolution is a process that results in heritable changes in a population spread over many generations. Evolution can be precisely defined as any change in the frequency of alleles within a gene pool from one generation to the next. When biologists say that humans and chimps have evolved from a common ancestor they mean that there have been successive heritable changes in the two separated populations since they became isolated.
“Well evolution is a theory. It is also a fact. And facts and theories are different things, not rungs in a hierarchy of increasing certainty. Facts are the world’s data. Theories are structures of ideas that explain and interpret facts. Facts don’t go away when scientists debate rival theories to explain them. Einstein’s theory of gravitation replaced Newton’s in this century, but apples didn’t suspend themselves in midair, pending the outcome. And humans evolved from ape-like ancestors whether they did so by Darwin’s proposed mechanism or by some other yet to be discovered.” Stephen J. Gould
[quote]djm_e22 wrote:
The only reason I am upset is because they have the right to teach the theories of evolution when it has nothing to do with what needs to be taught in school. It teaches nothing. Nobody needs to know anything about evolution to become whatever they want to become whether it be a doctor or a lawyer. [/quote]
How about a scientist? Or maybe just someone fascinated by how the world works, how heavenly bodies float, or how their heart beats? Or how about to be an educated person capable of rational thought?
[quote]
People have lost faith in religion due to the fact that they believe some of these theories are true when the forget they are just theories. [/quote]
Losing faith and understanding scientific theory do not go hand in hand. As noted before, there are many scientists of faith.
[quote]
Several theories have been proven wrong but they are still taught in the colleges. [/quote]
Scientifically proven wrong but still taught as true? Name them please.
[quote]
Doesn’t make since at all. I was told these exact words by several people and believe them cause they have shown proof. I am done arguing now. [/quote]
Science is not about proof. Religion is about proof. Science is examining the fact and building theories based on and supported by those facts. Science is not black/white, it’s about what makes sense based on the evidence and, if the evidence leads in another direction, showing the agility to discover another theory. For example, Einstein unseating Newton’s world view.
Put the evolution debate on the back burner for a while. Although it is a fascinating subject I think the more important question is what happens after something dies? Everyone is so fixated on the start that they’ve lost sight of the finish line. I think the true meaning of life lies in death.
[quote]E-man wrote:
I think the more important question is what happens after something dies? [/quote]
Hopefully it stops moving, outside of some natural twitching for the first little while. If it doesn’t, then we might have the beginning of the Zombie Apocalypse.
That reminds me… I need to stock up on ammo and dry goods.
[quote]djm_e22 wrote:
The only reason I am upset is because they have the right to teach the theories of evolution when it has nothing to do with what needs to be taught in school. It teaches nothing. Nobody needs to know anything about evolution to become whatever they want to become whether it be a doctor or a lawyer. People have lost faith in religion due to the fact that they believe some of these theories are true when the forget they are just theories. Several theories have been proven wrong but they are still taught in the colleges. Doesn’t make since at all. I was told these exact words by several people and believe them cause they have shown proof. I am done arguing now.[/quote]
Couldn’t you make the same argument for physics and chemistry? They are not useful for doctors and lawyers, and they may make people lose their faith. Hell, we should just stop thinking about the origin and nature of the universe, and pray more. Then the world would be a better place.
Seriously, though. It really scares the shit out of me when people start saying that science education is not necessary. Has anyone noticed that the U.S. is no longer leading the world in science and technology? Our average high school students are way behind the rest of the world in math and science.
I am a T.A. for undergraduate calculus-based physics, but I can barely do any actual calculus because the freshman have never seen it before, and are deathly afraid of it. Whereas the European and Asian students have been doing calculus since grade school.
Anyhow, since this is a thread about what makes humans special, I would have to go with mathematical logic. The fact that we have been able to mathematically describe the world around us is hands down the greatest feat of humankind.
But, I have to make a prediction here: Artificial Intelligence is a lot nearer than most people think (maybe 20 years or so), I really think it will change everything we know about the world. Just imagine an intelligence a thousand times that of a human brain. What would it mean to be 1000 times smarter? What problems could we solve?
I feel that the best of humankind is yet to come, and it will be in the form of accelerated intelligence (both artificial and enhanced). See you in the future…
[quote]djm_e22 wrote:
The only reason I am upset is because they have the right to teach the theories of evolution when it has nothing to do with what needs to be taught in school. It teaches nothing. Nobody needs to know anything about evolution to become whatever they want to become whether it be a doctor or a lawyer. People have lost faith in religion due to the fact that they believe some of these theories are true when the forget they are just theories. Several theories have been proven wrong but they are still taught in the colleges. Doesn’t make since at all. I was told these exact words by several people and believe them cause they have shown proof. I am done arguing now.[/quote]
You are an idiot, and hence, but a monkey.
[quote]Northcott wrote:
E-man wrote:
I think the more important question is what happens after something dies?
Hopefully it stops moving, outside of some natural twitching for the first little while. If it doesn’t, then we might have the beginning of the Zombie Apocalypse.
That reminds me… I need to stock up on ammo and dry goods.
[/quote]
All I need is a cricket bat and a clear path to the Winchester.
[quote]swordthrower wrote:
djm_e22 wrote:
The only reason I am upset is because they have the right to teach the theories of evolution when it has nothing to do with what needs to be taught in school. It teaches nothing. Nobody needs to know anything about evolution to become whatever they want to become whether it be a doctor or a lawyer. People have lost faith in religion due to the fact that they believe some of these theories are true when the forget they are just theories. Several theories have been proven wrong but they are still taught in the colleges. Doesn’t make since at all. I was told these exact words by several people and believe them cause they have shown proof. I am done arguing now.
Couldn’t you make the same argument for physics and chemistry? They are not useful for doctors and lawyers, and they may make people lose their faith. Hell, we should just stop thinking about the origin and nature of the universe, and pray more. Then the world would be a better place.
Seriously, though. It really scares the shit out of me when people start saying that science education is not necessary. Has anyone noticed that the U.S. is no longer leading the world in science and technology? Our average high school students are way behind the rest of the world in math and science.
I am a T.A. for undergraduate calculus-based physics, but I can barely do any actual calculus because the freshman have never seen it before, and are deathly afraid of it. Whereas the European and Asian students have been doing calculus since grade school.
Anyhow, since this is a thread about what makes humans special, I would have to go with mathematical logic. The fact that we have been able to mathematically describe the world around us is hands down the greatest feat of humankind.
But, I have to make a prediction here: Artificial Intelligence is a lot nearer than most people think (maybe 20 years or so), I really think it will change everything we know about the world. Just imagine an intelligence a thousand times that of a human brain. What would it mean to be 1000 times smarter? What problems could we solve?
I feel that the best of humankind is yet to come, and it will be in the form of accelerated intelligence (both artificial and enhanced). See you in the future…[/quote]
You made my point exactly. Which is you need to know nothing about evolution to learn about math and science.
[quote]vroom wrote:
djm_e22 wrote:
The only reason I am upset is because they have the right to teach the theories of evolution when it has nothing to do with what needs to be taught in school. It teaches nothing. Nobody needs to know anything about evolution to become whatever they want to become whether it be a doctor or a lawyer. People have lost faith in religion due to the fact that they believe some of these theories are true when the forget they are just theories. Several theories have been proven wrong but they are still taught in the colleges. Doesn’t make since at all. I was told these exact words by several people and believe them cause they have shown proof. I am done arguing now.
You are an idiot, and hence, but a monkey.
[/quote]
I noticed all the non-believers keep calling me an idiot or stupid like little boys and girls do. They can’t have a decent debate. I know as well as God knows I am not perfect so ya’ll are starting to piss me off and I would more than be glad to take this to a LEGAL charity UFC style fight. Also I just want to see what I can do, come on I only weigh 155lbs and ya’ll are in the 200 plus pound range. You couldn’t possibly lose. God forgive me I’m not perfect.
Djm,
Whoa! Let’s be peaceful — you’re getting all worked up. Please remember: the purpose of the thread I started here was to try and determine what, if anything, is unique about us. (Perhaps it IS our ability just to have the concept of God. Or having an ‘ideal self’ we aspire to.) I’m still searching. Challenging others to fight you is making the case for the ‘wild monkeys’.
Peace, bro.
HH
[quote]djm_e22 wrote:
vroom wrote:
djm_e22 wrote:
The only reason I am upset is because they have the right to teach the theories of evolution when it has nothing to do with what needs to be taught in school. It teaches nothing. Nobody needs to know anything about evolution to become whatever they want to become whether it be a doctor or a lawyer. People have lost faith in religion due to the fact that they believe some of these theories are true when the forget they are just theories. Several theories have been proven wrong but they are still taught in the colleges. Doesn’t make since at all. I was told these exact words by several people and believe them cause they have shown proof. I am done arguing now.
You are an idiot, and hence, but a monkey.
I noticed all the non-believers keep calling me an idiot or stupid like little boys and girls do. They can’t have a decent debate. I know as well as God knows I am not perfect so ya’ll are starting to piss me off and I would more than be glad to take this to a LEGAL charity UFC style fight. Also I just want to see what I can do, come on I only weigh 155lbs and ya’ll are in the 200 plus pound range. You couldn’t possibly lose. God forgive me I’m not perfect.[/quote]
Ok, here’s why people think you’re an idiot:
(Besides the fact that you’re challenging people to fight on the internet. Always the sign of a man who’s been education up to his means.)
You know nothing about science.
That’s okay.
But, when people who do know quite a bit about science try to tell you something, you put your fingers in your ears and pout and go, “NO! NO! You’re wrong!”
Now, again: that’s fine and dandy. But, people are not going to try and refute your claims in an intelligent way. They are going to call you a lackwit.
Arguing with you about evolution is like arguing with a blind man about art; you lack the ability to form an opinion. Maybe you have feelings, but feelings are not an opinion.
Thank you for playing. We must destroy Carthage.
[quote]harris447 wrote:
All I need is a cricket bat and a clear path to the Winchester.[/quote]
Cricket bat – creative! I’ll give full points for that one.
[quote]djm_e22 wrote:
You made my point exactly. Which is you need to know nothing about evolution to learn about math and science.[/quote]
So, a person needs not have a rounded education, to spark that little something special that would further humankind? This is what you espouse? No future discoveries “evolving” from an accidental interest in a worthless class such as Evolution (a sub-discipline of Biology)?
You’re deeply afraid of change, aren’t you? It assaults your perception of Truth and Falsehood. “If it’s false now, how could it be true next year?” That’s the beauty of this “science”
(and yes, evolution is a science discipline - genetic markers have been mapped in specific valleys in Baja California in lizards that show mutative variations from a common ancestor in order to accomodate for species growth dependant on external - nature - variables)
that seems so worthless to you. It affords us to change our minds when new information is discovered. It also makes “you” come to the conclusion that you may be wrong about a great many things. Like your religion, right? That’s the crux! The crucible! The one in a kajillion chance that you’re (gulp) wrong.
Evolution is a very interesting topic. Heck, it was my major focus in college. Ecological impacts of Evolution across populations and their subsequent generations. When we understand how our environment affects us long term (across generations) we can be better stewards of what we have today, in order to secure a more healthy environment for tomorrow. You want your childen to be better off than us, right? Well, we impact our surroundings, and visa versa. This is evolution.
[quote]kroby wrote:
djm_e22 wrote:
You made my point exactly. Which is you need to know nothing about evolution to learn about math and science.
So, a person needs not have a rounded education, to spark that little something special that would further humankind? This is what you espouse? No future discoveries “evolving” from an accidental interest in a worthless class such as Evolution (a sub-discipline of Biology)?
You’re deeply afraid of change, aren’t you? It assaults your perception of Truth and Falsehood. “If it’s false now, how could it be true next year?” That’s the beauty of this “science”
(and yes, evolution is a science discipline - genetic markers have been mapped in specific valleys in Baja California in lizards that show mutative variations from a common ancestor in order to accomodate for species growth dependant on external - nature - variables)
that seems so worthless to you. It affords us to change our minds when new information is discovered. It also makes “you” come to the conclusion that you may be wrong about a great many things. Like your religion, right? That’s the crux! The crucible! The one in a kajillion chance that you’re (gulp) wrong.
Evolution is a very interesting topic. Heck, it was my major focus in college. Ecological impacts of Evolution across populations and their subsequent generations. When we understand how our environment affects us long term (across generations) we can be better stewards of what we have today, in order to secure a more healthy environment for tomorrow. You want your childen to be better off than us, right? Well, we impact our surroundings, and visa versa. This is evolution.[/quote]
It’s not that cause I do believe you can believe in God and Evolution. Some people don’t though and if they believe Evolution is real than God can’t be. I don’t know why they think this way but alot do.
Ok Ok this is what I can accept as of right now. Things can change like humans can get smaller if for some reason babies starting taking on the smaller parents genes. Things can change due to genes, which I guess is evolution to a point. But a whale never walked on land and I never was a ape. There is now evidence somewhere in the bible that humans may have walked with the dinasours, if that ends up being true than all these dates and times that scientists have came up with just might be all wrong. The earth might have only been 10-50,000 years old.
Sorry about my dumb remark I made, I get offended to quick.
Im gonna stop this arguement and say: yes. Yes, I am a wild monkey. I’m a crazy, vine swinging primate. Next topic.
[quote]djm_e22 wrote:
But that would just be it carring on the genes and not evolution. But then again I still am not sure how a house cat could have possibly come from a lion.[/quote]
Actually, you just stated that you find the theory of evolution valid. For evolution is nothing more than the transference of genes from one generation to the next, with some traits becoming more dominant, and some becoming more recessive. We had faith that you would see the light! Now about that spelling checker…
what makes us special, is the fact we can imagine, we can visualise things that “could” be. We are cursed with a conciousness that is both a curse and a advantage over the other animals that populate this planet.
Conciousness that allows us to dream up gods be it zeus/shiva/allah/buddah/odin/god, to make us feel better about the fact we will die! Im pleased with the comfort that religion can give to those who need it, im not so with the issues organised religion causes.
Scientifically speaking like Ricahrd dawkins “entertaining religious belief in a scientific context is fallacy”
a longer show from which the clip is from was on british TV. I doubt it’ll see the light of day in the states, due to the religious right probably going ape shit (see what i did there)